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Kotal Kahn General Discussion

Crudebike

Crudebike

Noob
Wrenchfarm said:
Gotta love the 2nd round mercy :)

I'm really struggling with Kotal so take my advice with a grain of salt. One area I can definitely see you need improvement on though is hit confirming. If you go to the Sub-Zero fight, you throw out F23xKhan Cut a bunch of times even when he's blocking. You get away with it a few times because he doesn't seem familiar, but that will get you blown up on the regular. Just cutting out that habit and waiting to make sure the first two strikes actually hit before doing the special will help improve your game.

I'm terrible at hit confirming but one thing that has really helped me is doing the string and inputting the directional part of the special command, but not hitting the button till I know the string hit. Never give them a chance to hit you for free.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the tips bro
 
Blade4693

Blade4693

VIVIVI
I have tried labbing out his tourney variations myself to no avail. With Shao Kahn I have been able to create a lot of ok bnbs for myself, nothing crazy but good enough for now...with Kotal though I can't find anything. Maybe it's time to start watching some Kotal vids lol

Are there any vids that go over his tourney variations only? Also what is his general gameplan?
 
H

Hor_PeT

Noob
Hi, I realized yesterday that Kotal up close has serious problem after D1.
I do not know if I miss anything but it was weird.

After D1 it is +10. It supposed to be the advantage to be able to do a 8-9F high and beat mashing.
First I tried against Cassie Cage (set to duck) but neither of S1 or S2 connected but I am pretty sure my timing was good.
Then tried against Kotal and S1 still whiffed but S2 not.

I did not lab for hours but with other characters like Skarlet, Cassie I could easily follow up D1 with S1 and even with Skarlet 1F link it was pretty "easy". When I saw Kotal S1 I saw the move is so high it might whiff even if the advantage is there... Cassie hurt animation after D1 was not high enough to hit the S1... Even Kotal?

My friend immediately gave up on Kotal lol I always low profiled him.. What else Kotal can do after D1 up close? Other highs are slower than 10, only the low is 17F which would trade with a 7F poke..
Choke is 14F which would beat any mashing... I played the sun choke variation and always grab I did not realize it yet - but totem variation will not have that option.

What am I missing? I try to help my friend lol... And I supposed to play him too but that recognition bothers me...
In the evening I will go to the practice room to lab it again as I tried with my friend online with 70 ping but I should have done it after the 30th attempt.
EDIT: I tried in the lab. Only S2 connected against Kotal.

To stop mashing F4 can be your tool (or another poke but I do not see it rewarding)... not like in MKX the 114 which was even a launcher to punish mashing...

What do you think about it?
Sry if it is a big epic fail from me. :D
 
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Ram

Ram

Buluc Chabtan
_CHINOCUDEIRO_ said:
B22 is Kotal universal launcher.
You can do midscreen meterless B22-F12-and then choose if you want the damage and corner carry of the BF4cat (227 dmg). Or put a safe totem or change position with the DF2 sword of this variation
This combo can do it at the beggining of the match distance and if you use the cat it carries the opp to the corner and puts you at mid distance where Kotal shines
B22 is unsafe but you can follow on block with 1(OH) and make it safe. This variation also has the DF4 ray that if amplified tracks the opponent .
I mean, the grab variation is cool, but dont sleep on the cat

Also I´m beggining to use the unblockable in hard knockdowns or even between blocked strings, superuseful

EDIT:
B22-34-BF4cat (262dmg,midscreen,meterless,corner carry)
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Wrenchfarm said:
Messing around with the blood totem variation and it's interesting. Blood totem doesn't disappear when you get hit this time. More interesting, any time you call out a totem and get a hit you can summon another totem for an instant cash out. It's health on demand. So let's say you have a lv1 totem out, you score a basic combo, something like B22 122 for the full screen knock back. Summon your second totem while they are full screen and that's 68 health right there, also you have another lv 1 totem that is ready to convert to health for any other hits.

But it gets better. If you knock a character far back (lets say you were midscreen and did B22, F12xsword cut) and you summon another totem, it will appear near Kotal and work as a lv 1. But, if you manage summon again on the same screen as the first totem, they will stack. You still get your lv 1 totem pay out when you summon the 2nd one, but the next cash out is worth double. Adds up fast.

If you manage to stack three, the health boost is massive. Like a single stray F34 string will heal you for 130. A single throw will heal 150. If you hit a combo, you're basically healing back a combo worth of damage.

The Jaguar moves are more interesting than people are letting on too. Not many people seem to be aware that when amplified, they are projectile immune. Kotal isn't very meter dependent without his sun choke throw, so you can use them to do okay damage and get in on projectile heavy characters pretty often.

TBH I'm really struggling with the new Kotal. Everything he does seems so slow and half his fucking moves are high, I get beat out A LOT. So far combo potential seems low, I'm used to Kotal having BIG BOY damage. But I think there is a lot to explore with him and his second variation might not be nearly as bad as it seemed on first blush. Hopefully people can open up this character and put all his weird pieces together.
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Two very helpful posts, thank you guys!
 
Ram

Ram

Buluc Chabtan
angry bruiser said:
what other combo starters are there aside from b22 on a standing opponent? and how does he mix up b22 so the double mid actually hits?
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hmm not sure about the second part of your question, but for the first part, 223 launches for a combo in the corner
 
A

angry bruiser

Noob
thanks, i forgot to specify but i was curious about midscreen combos. there has got to be more than 1 single string combo starter, right.

also why can't kotal do a low/mid sword special anymore? and why can't he control sunray distance? also why can he only place 1 totem instead of choosing between 3??

and my second question is because you need to open people up. 2 mids won't open up someone blocking, so how do you mix this up? in mkx kotal could easily mix up any string because he had low+mid sword specials but now he can only do it from strings with lows built into them.

so how do you make people get hit by b22?
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
B2 isn't mid, look at the movelist.

His combo starters are F24, F12, 12. All into kahn cut.
 
Wrenchfarm

Wrenchfarm

Lexcorp Proprietary Technologies
angry bruiser said:
thanks, i forgot to specify but i was curious about midscreen combos. there has got to be more than 1 single string combo starter, right.
Click to expand...
I have bad news for you...

If you use the ascension variation, the kahn cut is how you get your combos. If you use totems, your combo string is b22 and that seems like it.
 
AK Harold

AK Harold

Noob
I dunno his new blood totem is kinda great, they last a long time now and the stack, cash in mechanic is powerful. The three stack returns over 100 percent.
 
Ram

Ram

Buluc Chabtan
AK Harold said:
I dunno his new blood totem is kinda great, they last a long time now and the stack, cash in mechanic is powerful. The three stack returns over 100 percent.
Click to expand...
Can you expand on this please? I know others have also talked about in earlier in this thread, but I still don't quite get how this works
 
AK Harold

AK Harold

Noob
So blood totem will absorb non blocked damage you do while it's up. If you cast totem again on the same screen it will cash out the absorb and add a stack to your totem. If you cast totem on a different screen you will cash out the absorb and summon a new level one totem.

Totem will absorb more per stack. I don't have the hard math, but the result is always worth it if you have opportunity. If the totem runs out of duration it will also give the refund amount.

I'm not able to play right now but the amounts are estimated 40/80/120 percent of non block damage. If someone can lab real quick and math that, be nice.

What's effective about stacking is you aren't punished at all for doing another totem but rewarded. I've gotten up to a third of my life back in one chunk in a live game. Also, since his good Ray tracks it is so good with the totem since it will basically life steal full amount to you and is unavoidable. Unfortunately it is hard as hell so far to set up for the light.
 
Ram

Ram

Buluc Chabtan
AK Harold said:
So blood totem will absorb non blocked damage you do while it's up. If you cast totem again on the same screen it will cash out the absorb and add a stack to your totem. If you cast totem on a different screen you will cash out the absorb and summon a new level one totem.

Totem will absorb more per stack. I don't have the hard math, but the result is always worth it if you have opportunity. If the totem runs out of duration it will also give the refund amount.

I'm not able to play right now but the amounts are estimated 40/80/120 percent of non block damage. If someone can lab real quick and math that, be nice.

What's effective about stacking is you aren't punished at all for doing another totem but rewarded. I've gotten up to a third of my life back in one chunk in a live game. Also, since his good Ray tracks it is so good with the totem since it will basically life steal full amount to you and is unavoidable. Unfortunately it is hard as hell so far to set up for the light.
Click to expand...
Cool, thanks for explaining. If you put sunlight on the opponent, will the blood totem absorb that damage? or only physical hits by kotal?
 
Chairface_ChipNDale

Chairface_ChipNDale

Noob
I'm having some success by cancelling f24 into db4 cause of the unblockable. It's easy to react to but once the opponent thinks you're gonna cancel into it you finish the string with the low or cancel into df2 instead for a combo. It's not great but it's working for me
 
Wrenchfarm

Wrenchfarm

Lexcorp Proprietary Technologies
Chairface_ChipNDale said:
I'm having some success by cancelling f24 into db4 cause of the unblockable. It's easy to react to but once the opponent thinks you're gonna cancel into it you finish the string with the low or cancel into df2 instead for a combo. It's not great but it's working for me
Click to expand...
I've been doing that too. Gimmicky AF, but fun to do until people catch on
 
Ram

Ram

Buluc Chabtan
This is where I’m at with Kotal (cat form variation) after a couple days of play:
  • I love f34 and f4.
  • If I hit them with f34, I do 1 forward dash and then meaty their getup with f4.
  • If f34 is blocked, I give no f’s and I d1, which usually hits and then I go for throw
  • If I can get a decent life lead, I’ll start playing lame: backing up, putting on sun, throwing disks, checking their forward movement with f34
  • Good zoning can be tough to deal with...I’ll try to put on sun in between their projectiles which usually makes them stop shooting them or change something up, which lets me go for disks or amplified cat pounce (projectile immune)
  • In a poke war, sometimes I’ll do d1xxSword Cut
  • At the start of a match, if I read them going for a forward advancing move, I go for d4xxSword Cut or a neutral jump
  • Stand 4 is a nice anti-air when spaced properly
  • After a forward throw, the opponent is perfectly positioned to be checked by f34 or f4 (although watch out for them reading this and jumping out/in)
  • Since I do f34 like 100000x per game, I’ll eventually move on to do f3 throw
That’s all I got for now
Having a fun time with kotal Kat :)
 
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