General/Other - Kotal Kahn Kotal Kahn General Discussion

[TommyKing5]

You think kotal has whiffing issues only on ferra/torr?

Yes, because those are the most important whiffing issues.

 

[conqueror]

Well for a command grab that does 19% meterless at level three it's completely fair IMO.

its not easy to get it to level 3, since each whiff is a threat for full combo punish and even if you happen to level it up there are better use for it to cash it out for meter or health rather then leaving it there and thinking kotal everytime has a 19% meterless command grab

 

[conqueror]

Yes, because those are the most important whiffing issues.

Indeed 114 whiffs on more characters then 1, even 4 whiffs on females, lmao

 

[TommyKing5]

I don't know, I can get to level three before the first round is finished. You got to tick throw.

Yes but 114 whiffs on HIT. There's a difference.

 

[conqueror]

I don't know, I can get to level three before the first round is finished. You got to tick throw.

Yes but 114 whiffs on HIT. There's a difference.

I never said its not possible to get it to level 3, i said there can be better uses for that sun energy or needs in some situations to cash it out, so its not 19% command grab for me most of the time

what do you mean by

Yes but 114 whiffs on HIT. There's a difference

Edit: also tick throw gets you so far, 1 read and youre full combo punished

 

[TommyKing5]

Go into the lab, just do 114 air grab on f/t, it doesn't connect. Same with b122 command grab in sun god.

I don't know why it whiffs and it hasn't been fixed.

 

[conqueror]

Go into the lab, just do 114 air grab on f/t, it doesn't connect. Same with b122 command grab in sun god.

I don't know why it whiffs and it hasn't been fixed.

Thats a weird case, but 114 whiffs on block almost on all females and some other characters, and that alone kills your pressure after getting a poke, i don't see it as any less important

 

[ChaosTheory]

kotal is balanced as fuck

Kotal is the best designed character in the game. He's your poster boy for the benefits of a variation system.

Too bad he's the minority in the game.

 

[CrazyFingers]

On the subject of getting Level 3 grab. 114 into grab buff (FDB 3) is 100% safe and gets you a level for free.

 

[Snibbor]

On the subject of getting Level 3 grab. 114 into grab buff (FDB 3) is 100% safe and gets you a level for free.

How safe is it exactly?

 

[TommyKing5]

How safe is it exactly?

I believe it's the same as 114 xx totem. Slightly +.

 

[CrazyFingers]

I believe it's the same as 114 xx totem. Slightly +.

This

 

[Osagri]

[

I believe it's the same as 114 xx totem. Slightly +.

I thought that converting sun levels was like totem. Not the buff

 

[TommyKing5]

[

I thought that converting sun levels was like totem. Not the buff

What?

 

[Osagri]

What?

114xxfdb3 is not plus but 114xxfdb2 is. Or thats what o thought
Edit : 114xxfbd3 definitely not plus just tested.

 

[TommyKing5]

114xxfdb3 is not plus but 114xxfdb2 is. Or thats what o thought

I think they're both the same. Reptile's ex slide doesn't punish either on block.

Mind you it's only like +2, so doesn't guarantee anything at all. Just consider it a safe use of the special, nothing more.

I could be completely wrong however, haven't tested this in a while.

 

[Osagri]

I think they're both the same. Reptile's ex slide doesn't punish either on block.

Mind you it's only like +2, so doesn't guarantee anything at all. Just consider it a safe use of the special, nothing more.

I could be completely wrong however, haven't tested this in a while.

114xxsun buff is safe but 114xxfdb2 is plus 2 I think . Can't d1 with kotal when I set AI to do 114xxfdb2 and d1 immediately after

 

[GAV]

I dont want buff for SG, i just consider it horrible to have that much recovery even for sun god choke

It's only missed 3 times for me since MKX's release.

I agree that he doesn't NEED anything, but I would like to see the parry utilized more.

 

[Pnut]

Sun God is a bill. Stop pretending like it's relevant. Blood God is better than Sun God in this current state and War God is better than both.

 

[Snibbor]

Sun God is a bill. Stop pretending like it's relevant. Blood God is better than Sun God in this current state and War God is better than both.

I disagree about blood God being better than sun god. The command grab in sun god adds a mixup not present in blood God, the latter of which suffers as a result because of the difficulty of opening up opponents without any kind of mixup.

I do agree that war God is better than both.

 

[YoloRoll1stHit]

adds a mixup not present in blood God

Risk reward dude, think about it. OS armor makes things even easier to deal with Sun god tick throw

 

[Snibbor]

OS armor between b1, choke? In that situation, couldn't you bait armor by doing a raw b1, then blocking?

D1 and D4 can both be tick thrown from, and even though it is possible to armor, that is a tremendous risk to take to spend a bar hoping that they tick throw after a poke.

 

[YoloRoll1stHit]

OS armor between b1, choke? In that situation, couldn't you bait armor by doing a raw b1, then blocking?

D1 and D4 can both be tick thrown from, and even though it is possible to armor, that is a tremendous risk to take to spend a bar hoping that they tick throw after a poke.

It depends on characters but what I meant was your throw does 19% damage and an armored launcher usually leads to 25-30%, not to mention jumping out on read and Sun God eats more damage. Tick throw reward is not worth the risk
In matchups where Blood God already bodies people with his footsie, Sun God can comfortably play his game, but in matchups where Blood God struggles (Mileena say hi), Sun God struggles even worse.

 

[TommyKing5]

It depends on characters but what I meant was your throw does 19% damage and an armored launcher usually leads to 25-30%, not to mention jumping out on read and Sun God eats more damage. Tick throw reward is not worth the risk
In matchups where Blood God already bodies people with his footsie, Sun God can comfortably play his game, but in matchups where Blood God struggles (Mileena say hi), Sun God struggles even worse.

Exactly this. B1 tick throw will work against people who don't know the match-up and that's pretty much it. If you get blown up by it against say... Tempest Lao that's 30%+ of your life gone. If you really want to tick throw however, I've been using S1 a lot more, to great success. People don't expect it at all.

But I pretty much agree with what Pnut said. War God has always been the best of the three, and I don't think that'll change anytime soon. Blood God has better overall utility even though he has no armour, you can afford to make more mistakes with Blood God because of the Obsidian totem. If you get blown up with your tick throws in Sun God, it's going to hurt, depending on the character.

 

[Tweedy]

Sun God is hella trash.

He's a practice mode, theory god.

The variation should be renamed Theory God.

The problem with his tick throw is that, not only is it a mix up that can be os armored, it's a mix up that relies on them blocking a hit, unless you just raw grab. If you hit them with D1 or basically anything, and whiff the grab because you hit them, there's still enough frames of recovery for them to recover and punish. It's so eh.

Characters like Jason, Erron Black, Wrestler Jax, already have mix ups that make you block. Sun God's mix up is the command grab. At least Blood God has the totems so he can play the neutral a little better, and kill people really quickly.