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General/Other - Johnny Cage Johnny Cage changes 10/04/16

Leito360

Noob
Is A-List viable after the "5 frame before input a dash cancel"?
How has this change impacted in his game?

I'm asking because along side Kitana, he was going to be my second char.
 

Disasterpiese

it's not over when you lose, it'over when you quit
Jup all the hard work on learning cancels gone just poof gone, a shell of his former self rip alist
 

Disasterpiese

it's not over when you lose, it'over when you quit
Not a lot of people are talking about johnny because 1 they are still looking for something or 2 they are grieving xD

Only armour move he has now is a high hahaha
 

M.D.

Spammer. Crouch walk hater.
As someone said before, the only stupid thing is having to learn two timings for the cancels on block and on hit.

SD is completely ruined, the pressure is gone completely. You can't follow up a mimic SK in block with anything without getting meterless slid by subzero.

Basically SD is variationless Cage with big damage combos when you somehow open them up.
Mimic Shadow Kick in neutral and then run up and combo is no longer a thing, so you will get kept away a lot. Sucks big time.
 

ismael4790

Stay focused or get Caged
This patch has been devastating at so many levels for Cage (and other characters).

Fistbump is the only thing I like (Fisticuffs might be best variation, which says a lot), but don't know if it is motivation enough to prevent me from finally quitting the game.
 
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Zionix

AKA Ponkster
The sky is falling.

O wait no it isn't.

A-list is still a really good hit confirm character. You can still jail F3 into 11 or even F3.

Put lao on reversal spin (normal or ex) and do 114 SKRC F2 or F3 SKRC F2 and you win. Armored reversals are gonna that combo into 30% this is huge. You can still bait and punish for easy hit confirms. Getting zoned out should be theo nly legitimate concern and fisticuffs does some nice chip.
 

M.D.

Spammer. Crouch walk hater.
Yes they brought it from A tier to C tier in the trash. Balancing.
 

kelevra

Steel cable bungee jumper
So with a-list dead, stunt double quit his job on johnny (and hightech like it never existed) i started messing around with fisti a little. They put a-list/sd in a coma and fisti on steroids it seems. Corner: f3,exbf1,f4,2db2,d1,12,12,b12(5x)nut for 45% 1bar.
With the f3,bf1mb being stupidly plus on block. Haven't tested jailing so far but it looks like you can't hit a button.
 

ismael4790

Stay focused or get Caged
So with a-list dead, stunt double quit his job on johnny (and hightech like it never existed) i started messing around with fisti a little. They put a-list/sd in a coma and fisti on steroids it seems. Corner: f3,exbf1,f4,2db2,d1,12,12,b12(5x)nut for 45% 1bar.
With the f3,bf1mb being stupidly plus on block. Haven't tested jailing so far but it looks like you can't hit a button.
Nice combo!

On block best jailing midcreen is 4~fistbump mb f34. In the corner you can jail a standing 1, or 214 after 4~fistbump, even a b1 but the next speedbag hits whiff.

Frosted said f3~fistbump mb jail into d1 and d3 but im trying in the lab vs sub ex slide and can't seem to get it....
 

kelevra

Steel cable bungee jumper
Don't get me wrong tho, I love that they showed fisti some love but what the general changes did to the cancel characters overall is too much.
No jailing on the offense is something I would actually have liked alot because the game becomes more thoughtful by baiting and punishing e.t.c.
Imagine the following situation. You play a-list, go for a f3 and rc into block because you want to bait armor (f3 is -8 by itself so you can't use it raw vs most of the cast so you're forced to rc/skrc)
You read the opponent right and he armored, you block and then go in for the punish but you don't have any stamina because you just canceled for the bait and now you're in a situation where you can't even hit someone hard for making a bad read so you have to go for something that's fast enough for the punish OR has enough range + is fast enough. In both cases you get shit damage or am I missing something?
 

Frosted 57

Reforming Lurker
Nice combo!

On block best jailing midcreen is 4~fistbump mb f34. In the corner you can jail a standing 1, or 214 after 4~fistbump, even a b1 but the next speedbag hits whiff.

Frosted said f3~fistbump mb jail into d1 and d3 but im trying in the lab vs sub ex slide and can't seem to get it....
I was wrong about F3 ExFistBump jailing into d1 and d3. Made a silly practice mode mistake while testing it. The F3 ExFistBump cancel gap is likely around +6 though. So the F3 cancel doesn't jail at all. The only normal that jails on block is standing 4 and that one you can't combo off of on hit. So every time you use ExFistbump on block it is armor punishable unless it was S4.
 
A-List still feels the best to me. I don't think the changes to Fisticuffs will end up mattering when his b12 pressure is still the same and you need the meter investment. SD definitely took a hit.
 

Asodimazze

A-Lister
After playing some games with A-List, I don't see a future for the variation tbh :/ I hope to change my mind soon.

No mid armor - unreliable cancels - stamina dependent in a game where this is not affordable anymore - no mixups due to the 5f delay
 

kelevra

Steel cable bungee jumper
After playing some games with A-List, I don't see a future for the variation tbh :/ I hope to change my mind soon.

No mid armor - unreliable cancels - stamina dependent in a game where this is not affordable anymore - no mixups due to the 5f delay
On point buddy. At a first glance it didn't look that bad but if you dig deeper you can really see that the variation is as good as dead.