Match-up Discussion Jade Matchup Discussion Thread

[Past]

What do you mean by this?

Also could you share or point to a link to some of your recent footage?





Cyrax has little options to approach Jade and is chasing her, while Jade can pretty much dictate the momentum of the match. She can walk backwards away from him while still being a threat with her pokes. If Cyrax does get uncomfortably close you have D3 and such to interrupt him and space yourself again. Just my observations of course.

You've been AA Grabbed out of Overhead from the TIP of the pole? :O Haven't seen that happen yet.

Will have to try your Noob advice out more and see if it helps. Overhead seems to get screwed by Dash Upknee for me. If Noob is playing patient it doesn't feel like I steamroll him at all.


Concerning Reptile:- He shouldn't be able to pressure you with Forceballs at all. They can be reacted to with Flash and punished with Flash-Shadow Kick. On wakeup Flash virtually nullifies his Oki with Forceball too. Jade takes away a decent portion of Reptiles game with the use of Flash.

Whenever I have the chance to punish Elbow Dash, I end with Shadow Kicks for the full screen push, sacrificing a bit of damage for superior position (fullscreen).
This match feels very much like a game of reads to me, from full screen Reptile HAS to get in, and you have to guess how he will. His Dash Block is too slow so he's restricted to Elbow Dash (not much of a restriction ¬_¬).
Checking him with full screen Rangs helps control the dashing, along with the rare Staff Overhead at just under full screen (can be used to catch Elbow Dash in and Elbow Dash~Jump in). Can't get careless with the Rangs, he can jump~Elbow Dash at nearly all distances - Which is where Up Rang comes in handy as it will catch most of his jump attempts (distance depending) and will still hit an Elbow Dash.
Reptile is fairly easy to bait into Ex Glow, as it is very likely he will attack when he's in.
Jade is still working extremely hard 4.5-5.5, possibly 4-6.

Tried using EX glow against reptile's dash. The result is that I immediately pulled MK out of my PS3 and stopped playing for two weeks.

 

[Arkayne]

Concerning Reptile:- He shouldn't be able to pressure you with Forceballs at all. They can be reacted to with Flash and punished with Flash-Shadow Kick. On wakeup Flash virtually nullifies his Oki with Forceball too. Jade takes away a decent portion of Reptiles game with the use of Flash.

.

Yes, you can glow on wakeup against forceball. A good reptile always keeps himself at the range to where you can't punish it, and after playing THTB in a long set. I realized glow forceball and punish is a horrible idea unless your close. I can't how many time I got D+4'd into something for trying to punish I'm not saying my spacing was perfect. But D+4 -> Acid hand. Is RETARDED good. Honestly I wasn't trying to win vs him. I was trying to get REAL LIFE punishment matchup experience and to see what I can and can't do against a good Reptile. It just sucks that characters can now D+4 and make U+3 whiff. I missed alot of punishes like that and THTB thought it was hilarious too.

[MENTION=4]THTB[/MENTION] : It's all good man! haha Don't worry I got to spread Jade Technology around so I'm fine. Upon all the people asking to play me after seeing Jade. Since no one else plays/played her.


[MENTION=5927]Thead[/MENTION]: I didn't mean to say reaction, what I meant to say was Meaty. I play against a REALLY good noob player ALOT. Thats why when I played Hitoshura at SB I didn't have a problem beating him until the pad messed up and I lost. Anyways, because of the D+1 nerf you can't really wakeup with flash. Because I can't begin to count the times (Combot/Trkt I just say his name because he was at SB as well) has stuffed flash and EX flash on Meaty/Wakeup. Actually the noob matchup got harded for Jade then it was before. Still potentially in her favor just not as much.

 

[Thead]

With U3 no longer hitting crouch, I've had to use it a lot more sparingly in all matchups. Reptile is a match I would avoid abusing it for the reasons you state and as on block he can Elbow Dash in and start his pressuring.

I haven't got access to the caliber of player you have, but these are my experiences of the match. You are forced to switch between having Reptile in your face as you counter pressure or being fullscreen. Reptile puts you into these scenarios because he can choose when to Elbow Dash/Forceball. His Dash is especially annoying for Jade as it can punish long range pokes, nearly nullifying a good portion of her game.
Jades Flash can be used to make opponents create patterns. This makes Reptiles Forceball and Dash easier to bait.

Arkayne: You mean as you've used Flash or Glow on wakeup, you've been stuffed out of them? You do not have enough the invincibility to do anything??

 

[Arkayne]

With U3 no longer hitting crouch, I've had to use it a lot more sparingly in all matchups. Reptile is a match I would avoid abusing it for the reasons you state and as on block he can Elbow Dash in and start his pressuring.

I haven't got access to the caliber of player you have, but these are my experiences of the match. You are forced to switch between having Reptile in your face as you counter pressure or being fullscreen. Reptile puts you into these scenarios because he can choose when to Elbow Dash/Forceball. His Dash is especially annoying for Jade as it can punish long range pokes, nearly nullifying a good portion of her game.
Jades Flash can be used to make opponents create patterns. This makes Reptiles Forceball and Dash easier to bait.

Arkayne: You mean as you've used Flash or Glow on wakeup, you've been stuffed out of them? You do not have enough the invincibility to do anything??

Sorry, I keep saying Flash as Glow and Vica Versa. I'll just say GLOW. Yeah, Jade can get stuffed out of glow meaty. You can even test it VS Noobs d+1, That glow NEEDS to be 0 frames. I've been stuffed out of regular AND ex. Consistently too. The noob player I play against isn't worried anymore. Because he knows how to stuff it CLEAN. He does it too often for it to be an accident.

 

[TakeAChance]

Jade can indeed get her glow stuffed by meaty attacks. It is infuriating. I cannot tell you how many times I lamented NRS for not making it 0 frame startup like Kabals saws....if there was one move in the game that should have been 0 frames it was glow...

 

[SLy]

Does anyone know how to handle skarlet? ive thought i was doing exceptionally well in that match up until i played a good one..I feel skarlet with meter is just as good as jade with meter..her hyper armor slides and etc makes it hard for me to pin her down and set her up for both offense and footsies..Zoning is not a problem but she has good ways to get in on jade..any pointers??

 

[TakeAChance]

Does anyone know how to handle skarlet? ive thought i was doing exceptionally well in that match up until i played a good one..I feel skarlet with meter is just as good as jade with meter..her hyper armor slides and etc makes it hard for me to pin her down and set her up for both offense and footsies..Zoning is not a problem but she has good ways to get in on jade..any pointers??

Don't take this to seriously as I just noticed this when playing shujinky, but Jades 4,f3 stuffs pretty much all of Skarletts wakeup options with the exception of enhanced slide.

 

[SLy]

Don't take this to seriously as I just noticed this when playing shujinky, but Jades 4,f3 stuffs pretty much all of Skarletts wakeup options with the exception of enhanced slide.

Thanks for the tip bro..Im cautious of using it because some characters could punish it on block..im gonna assume your aware that scarlet cannot..

 

[TakeAChance]

4,f3 is safe on block now.

 

[Drayn0]

Does anyone know how to handle skarlet? ive thought i was doing exceptionally well in that match up until i played a good one..I feel skarlet with meter is just as good as jade with meter..her hyper armor slides and etc makes it hard for me to pin her down and set her up for both offense and footsies..Zoning is not a problem but she has good ways to get in on jade..any pointers??

Skarlet is better in close, but jade has better footsies. If you can keep skarlet at mid-screen you'll win.

 

[SLy]

Havent seen anyone update it so ill do it..

6-4 vs Baraka
5-5 vs Cyber Sub-Zero
5-5 vs Cyrax
5-5 vs Ermac
4-6 vs Freddy Krueger *This matchup also needs a serious breakdown
4-6 vs Jax
4-6 vs Johnny Cage
4-6 vs Kabal
4-6 vs Kano
4-6 vs Kenshi
5-5 vs Kitana
4-6 vs Kung Lao
4-6 vs Liu Kang
5-5 vs Mileena
5-5 vs Nightwolf
6-4 vs Noob Saibot
6-4 vs Quan Chi
4-6 vs Raiden *Feels like 3-7 but thats just me..4-6 should be fair enough..
??? vs Rain *Not to sure..We need to break this one down
4-6 vs Reptile
5-5 vs Scorpion
4-6 vs Sektor
6-4 vs Shang Tsung
5-5? vs Sheeva *Not to sure on this
6-4 vs Sindel
5-5 vs Skarlet *Again thanks for the TakeAChance and Drayn0 for clearing that up
4-6 vs Smoke
4-6 vs Sonya Blade
6-4 vs Stryker
5-5 vs Sub-Zero

Thats how I see it for now.I would like to hear opinions though..Lets puts some life in this thread fellas

 

[JustObserver]

6-4 vs Baraka

Baraka has very good defensive options and can get close easily with his blade charge, so my opinion is 5-5 or even less.

4-6 vs Cyrax

What advantage has cyrax in this mu? Glow counters his web moves, which are huge part of cyrax's game so 5-5 or higher.

5-5 vs Mileena

Can't understand this, explain pls.

 

[SLy]

Yea he has good defensive options but what good are they when jade decides to zone him..don't get me wrong his charge is good for getting in but jade can punish it in fact that's his only tool to get in and can be anticapated..punish baraka with shadow kicks and he's back to square 1

I feel the rax matchup is 5-5..typo on my part.

I play against mileenas a lot so I don't feel like its that bad for her.Jade can hold her own in this MU..unless you see a major disadvantage for jade that I don't see?

 

[TakeAChance]

Jade cannot easily Zone baraka. One EX Blade Charge and Jade is in hot water. Honestly that matchup is 5-5 at best for Jade.

 

[JustObserver]

4-6 vs Liu Kang
5-5 vs Mileena

Very similiar mutch-ups, i'd even say liu kang is more dangerous, so...

 

[SLy]

Jade cannot easily Zone baraka. One EX Blade Charge and Jade is in hot water. Honestly that matchup is 5-5 at best for Jade.

I didn't say it was easy to zone baraka..you definitley have to pick your spots but as you said if he ex bladecharge then I'm in trouble..may I add that ex bladecharge can also be punished..he needs meter to get in and once he's in and if jade is sitting on meter which most likely is the case her ex glow gets her out of jail free.. And if wakeup is not respected he eats a full combo ending with shadow kicks which sends him across screen again..and if she's not sitting on meter it relies on your defense..barakas mixup game can destroy her..but that's all he has against her..zoning isn't possible for him here

 

[TakeAChance]

Matchups Based on My Current Experience


5-5 vs Baraka - Can't Jump on Baraka, HAVE to respect his wakeup, his blade charge is hard to punish, he can go full screen with it. It really limits Jades options. Baraka can basically constantly check you with blade charge and there is nothing you can do from a distance.
4-6 vs Cyber Sub-Zero - Dive Kicks. Nuff said.
6-4 vs Cyrax This is a bad matchup for Cyrax. I almost want to put it as a 7-3 for Jade. I would if it wasn't for his potent damage.
4-6 vs Ermac (Jade cannot flash through his distance pressure. When Ermac get's a life lead, it forces you to play his game)
4-6 vs Freddy Krueger You can flash through his projectile claws, but NOT his ground claws. Freddy can still d osome serious full screen pressure.
4-6 vs Jax (Jax has a very good up close game, and 100% corner loops. Jade can negate his projectile, but not his Pound pressure. Glow helps, but the advantage is still slightly in Jax's favour)
5-5 vs Johnny Cage I think this matchup isn't that bad for Jade. She can glow through all of his pressure traps and usually get a free combo out of it. (Like his EX Fireball trap)
4-6 vs Kabal (Almost a 5-5, but Jade has to still respect so much of Kabal's game)
4-6 vs Kano (On paper you would think this was a 5-5, but it's not. Kano's knives are hella fast, he can ball you all day on reaction to your rangs if you want to trade.)
2-8 vs Kenshi IMO Jades WORST matchup. She cannot negate ANYTHING that Kenshi has. With no teleport, and subpar strings, this fight is VERY hard for Jade. There is almost nothing she can do in this matchup.
5-5 vs Kitana Jade and Kitanna are battling for similar space here. This match is all about who has the lifelead.
4-6 vs Kung Lao
4-6 vs Liu Kang
4-6 vs Mileena This used to be a 5-5 before the U3 nerf. Now it is most definitely in Mileena's favour. You have to constantly respect mileenas wakeup, and while Jade can negate Mileenas sais and her distance meter build, he can't do really anything against Mileenas strings. U3 was great for pressuring Mileena not anymore...
5-5 vs Nightwolf
6-4 vs Noob Saibot
6-4 vs Quan Chi (I really want to make this a 5-5, but it REALLY depends on the Quan you are facing)
3-7 vs Raiden (Cannot pressure Raiden with Jades excellent corner game, Can't jip reliably, have to respect the superman, can't throw rangs, this is hell.)
5-5 vs Rain This matchup can really go either way. Total 5-5. Jade can glow and stop his 4,3/3,3 cancel pressure.
4-6 vs Reptile
5-5 vs Scorpion
6-4 vs Sektor Honestly I have to give the advantage to Jade in this one. Sektor CANNOT missile pressure you, you can even make his homing missile usless. The only real tool he has against you here besides his teleport is his flame thrower, which you can blow up on reaction with either EX Staff Slam or glow.
6-4 vs Shang Tsung
5-5? vs Sheeva ehhhhh 5-5 or 4-6 really. Debatable.
6-4 vs Sindel
5-5 vs Skarlet Really think this depends on the skarlett. 4,3 limits a lot of skarlets wakeups outside of ex red dash. Dagger cancelling is no big deal for Jade....but Jade has no real reliable combo punish to her teleport...(can someone prove me wrong?)
4-6 vs Smoke This match up is interesting. I do agree that smoke has a slight advantage, but I think it's just as capable of winning for Jade as it is for Smoke.
4-6 vs Sonya Blade - This matchup is tough. Sonya can take away your staff slam with the arc kick, she is also a better zoner than you, and a WAY better up close fighter. Difficult matchup.
6-4 vs Stryker I agree with this, Strykers whole game is pretty much negated.
6-4 vs Sub-Zero This one is going to be controversial. I REALLY think Jade has the advantage here. Especially if you are going to "Lame it out". It is insane how many Sub Zero's at least online, have no idea what to do when you can stay at full screen and negate their ice blast. This matchup is about life leads, and patience, but with the ability to negate any meter build from Sub at fullscreen, he is going to get desperate. Jade can handle this matchup very well.

 

[SLy]

Jade v sektor matchup might be a little bit debatable..
You mention a lot of valid points that I agree upon however the sektor forums see this mu as 6-4 in sektors favor.. How?

I'm a firm beliver that the best way to look at a match up is who has the most changes to open the opponent up? Due to Jade's terrible pokes and non-existant pressure she stands a lot harder time landing something on Sektor. What she has to look for are opprotunities to use flash kick and rangs... making it a very slow race. Sektor on the other hand can open her up extremly fast from anywhere on the screen. Flame is the key to the mid screen battle as well as b1. From full distance, I feel that once Jade makes a move, Sektor can punish it. Sure Jade can negate missiles, but Sektor isn't taking damage from it.

He also makes some good points also.. All in all I guess 5-5 seems fair enough..

 

[Past]

Matchups Based on My Current Experience

6-4 vs Cyrax This is a bad matchup for Cyrax. I almost want to put it as a 7-3 for Jade. I would if it wasn't for his potent damage.

Jade can't lame cyrax out due to her poor spacing tools. He also has better offense so what can jade really do here?

5-5 vs Johnny Cage I think this matchup isn't that bad for Jade. She can glow through all of his pressure traps and usually get a free combo out of it. (Like his EX Fireball trap)

Jade will not have meter to do that every time and even then its not guaranteed damage. She can't keep Cage out. 6-4 Cage

4-6 vs Kano (On paper you would think this was a 5-5, but it's not. Kano's knives are hella fast, he can ball you all day on reaction to your rangs if you want to trade.)

You don't have to trade with Kano. Jade is not at a disadvantage because Kano's offense is not that good

2-8 vs Kenshi IMO Jades WORST matchup. She cannot negate ANYTHING that Kenshi has. With no teleport, and subpar strings, this fight is VERY hard for Jade. There is almost nothing she can do in this matchup.

This matchup sucks

5-5 vs Kitana Jade and Kitanna are battling for similar space here. This match is all about who has the lifelead.

Not really. Jade has no answer for Kitana's offense. She does not have to throw fans and even then all she will eat is 8%

5-5 vs Nightwolf

I still believe that this is in NW's favor. NW can do whatever he wants. What does Jade have?

6-4 vs Stryker I agree with this, Strykers whole game is pretty much negated.

Stryker does not have to zone here. Roll beats shadow kick every time and his offense is better. 5-5 in my opinion

6-4 vs Sub-Zero This one is going to be controversial. I REALLY think Jade has the advantage here. Especially if you are going to "Lame it out". It is insane how many Sub Zero's at least online, have no idea what to do when you can stay at full screen and negate their ice blast. This matchup is about life leads, and patience, but with the ability to negate any meter build from Sub at fullscreen, he is going to get desperate. Jade can handle this matchup very well.

I don't think Jade has the advantage but I don't believe that this is easy for Sub because flash>clone.

 

[TakeAChance]

I don't know how you guys play Jade, but, against Cyrax, you can shut him down EVERY time his chest panel opens. Know your strings, and pokes and the matchup is not bad at all. I still think it's 6-4 for Jade.

I just don't feel comfortable in the kano matchup. Jade has no great punish to upball.

Nightwolfs only benefit here is his reflect. Shoulders can be ducked and I don't have to much trouble with his matchup. It could be 6-4 nightwolf, but I always go fairly even with wolf's.

Jade has glow for the predictable f2,1 string from kitanna. D4 negates almost all of her wakeups, and she can't zone. Uprangs are great in this matchup. I am one of the few who think this is even, so I cannot fault you for thinking otherwise.

A Stryker that is not shooting bullets is a gimped Stryker. Striker does have offensive potential, but he has to burn meter to get in and it is predictable.

as with Katana I have had people tell me they think the sub match up is even or in his favour. Perfect Legend and I played some sets the other day online. He agreed it was in her favour.

 

[SLy]

I think its safe to say jade v kitana is 5-5..it is true that her only options involve meter or just(a good defense never hurts either ) however what can kitana do once jade knocks her down?? D4 stuffs all of her wake up options if time right (timing is not as strict) her best option is wake up square boost which can also be stuffed,baited, and if neither it throws her across screen which I feel jade has an advantage in long range position..it can go either way but because of kitanas damage output I'd say it acan be slightly in her favor.4.5-5.5 at best

 

[Trini_Bwoi]

is Jade so awful that she can literally waltz past Noob's greatest strength and still come out with an even matchup?

 

[TakeAChance]

is Jade so awful that she can literally waltz past Noob's greatest strength and still come out with an even matchup?

I have her pegged at 6-4 against noob. It would be higher, but Noob does have a decent rushdown believe it or not.

 

[Prinz]

Matchups Based on My Current Experience...

Agreed with everything except Kitana being 6-5 (I'm starting to deal with her close pressure, maybe I need a better opponent and offline play ) and Stryker 5-5 (up-close he is better and his roller throw is insane, but stoppable; also, I may not know the match-up very well).
Sektor is a pain, but dealt with, I'd say 5-5 just because of his up-close game; also imagine him staying away reacting with teleuppercut to boomerangs and with flamethrower if you try to get in... I think it would change the game...
Quan Chi - I'm bad at beating him, I guess it's just my gameplay. I'd give it 4-6, but again, I'm very bad at beating him

 

[TakeAChance]

Agreed with everything except Kitana being 6-5 (I'm starting to deal with her close pressure, maybe I need a better opponent and offline play ) and Stryker 5-5 (up-close he is better and his roller throw is insane, but stoppable; also, I may not know the match-up very well).
Sektor is a pain, but dealt with, I'd say 5-5 just because of his up-close game; also imagine him staying away reacting with teleuppercut to boomerangs and with flamethrower if you try to get in... I think it would change the game...
Quan Chi - I'm bad at beating him, I guess it's just my gameplay. I'd give it 4-6, but again, I'm very bad at beating him

Quans give me a little bit of trouble as well. Shujinkys Quan was like...mad crazy. The only reason I give Jade a slight advantage is because at FULL screen Quan can't do anything except skydrop. You can bait it out and react accordingly.