Is MKDA Broken?

[M2Dave]

Heihachi is that weird looking dude, kind of like the Tekken Scorpion looks undead with powers lol. He's the dude that spins on his ass and teleports right with the sword?

He seemed like a pain to master, but I used to pick him just cause he looked badass.

You're probably talking about Yoshimitsu. He's the guy with the weird-looking moves and the sword.

Heihachi is somebody completely different.

He's not re-used, by the way. He's probably the best character in Tekken 5: DR. It's either him or Devil Jin. Most of the Mishimas (Devil Jin, Kazuya, and Heihachi) share the same moves in execution but they usually have different properties. All of them have the Electric Wind Godfist, which is why they're the best in DR.

Yeah, my fault lol. That's the guy I'm referring to Yoshimitsu. Also has like a weird mask, similar to V's smile but a bit different, yeah that dude lol.

Also, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong but didn't he have an invisible move also similar to reptile in MK? Or just the teleport?

P.S. Raging Storm, great observation on the fighters sets. So true.

Yes, it's a teleport from his d+3+4 stance. Trust me. It's rather worthless.

And that was Jinpachi, indeed. He is a boss character in Tekken 5.0 (only usable via a third party device) and is the first Tekken boss ever to exhibit what people refer to as the "SNK Boss Syndrome" symptons; meaning, he can shoot numerous fireballs at you, which are all unblockable, mid and very hard to side step. Jinpachi also has other over-powered moves, including that 15 frame low stun attack, which stuns you (and even picks up from the ground) for like four seconds. After the stun attack, he usually follows up with a fireball, and there is nothing you can do about it.

He is ONLY playable in the PS3 version of Tekken 5: DR, though. He is severly toned down but he is still banned in all major Tekken 5: DR tournaments.

 

[MKF30]

So, there's an actual tekken character that's banned in tournaments? Interesting, I wasn't aware of that.

Yeah, I can see in a MKA tourney certain characters being banned, bosses for sure, KAK obviously.

Sareena and Dairou would be debatable, I doubt they would be(depends lol) but I would say Sareena has a higher chance if they were to be discussed.

BTW, I've gotten better with Dai in MKA. I dued recently with bobby and have vids but have to put them on youtube.

Figured you'd might interested in seeing them.

The score was 4-4 my dai vs. bobby's sareena. However, the recording device I have died during taping lol. So I have 2 matches which I'll put out there sometime this week.

I don't use his 33, AC I prefer to just turtle personally. I like my foes to come to me sometimes hehe.

Most people can't beat his sareena but I can now with dairou, we just play the turtle game and I try to get in on him which isn't easy but very possible. :twisted:

Well, I'll let you know figured you might want to see them. Nobody uses Dairou on xbox except me. Nobody likes him lol.

BTW, I heard Tekken 6 will be online so I'm sure you'll happy about that. Yeah, there will be lag no doubt but it'll give you more comp.

I think there's some new characters also in that series. I'm sure you know though

 

[M2Dave]

So, there's an actual tekken character that's banned in tournaments? Interesting, I wasn't aware of that.

Yeah, I can see in a MKA tourney certain characters being banned, bosses for sure, KAK obviously.

Sareena and Dairou would be debatable, I doubt they would be(depends lol) but I would say Sareena has a higher chance if they were to be discussed.

BTW, I've gotten better with Dai in MKA. I dued recently with bobby and have vids but have to put them on youtube.

Figured you'd might interested in seeing them.

The score was 4-4 my dai vs. bobby's sareena. However, the recording device I have died during taping lol. So I have 2 matches which I'll put out there sometime this week.

I don't use his 33, AC I prefer to just turtle personally. I like my foes to come to me sometimes hehe.

Most people can't beat his sareena but I can now with dairou, we just play the turtle game and I try to get in on him which isn't easy but very possible. :twisted:

Well, I'll let you know figured you might want to see them. Nobody uses Dairou on xbox except me. Nobody likes him lol.

BTW, I heard Tekken 6 will be online so I'm sure you'll happy about that. Yeah, there will be lag no doubt but it'll give you more comp.

I think there's some new characters also in that series. I'm sure you know though

Jinpachi is only banned because he is NOT in the arcade version of Tekken 5: DR. He is a console only character, and thus people decided to ban him in tournaments. I think he would clearly be the best character in DR anyway.

I would not take online Sareena too seriously. f,f+1 is so safe. It's pathetic. She really isn't that good off-line because f,f+1 staggers on block a lot. I'd still like to see those matches and your Dairou, nonetheless, so put 'em up.

Tekken 5: DR is already online. It will be available Aug. 16th in the US. It will be played on a world wide server as well.

 

[MKF30]

Yeah sure man, I'll let you know officially or just post the link for ya in here once I have them on youtube.

I agree the dash sareena punch is way too easy to predict if you detect the players pattern, however her knives are still annoying if someone good can buffer quickly, like bobby blaze for example. Out of everyone on xbox nobody can throw them faster then bobby. My dairou is a perfect counter for him. BTW, we would get more matches but our connection was rough. I'm happy we got 4-4 8 matches in total that night.

The trick is to get in on her, and parry well that's my opinion on beating her or one way.

Offline I have no idea but I know some characters play wayy different offline to online.

 

[M2Dave]

If you use Dairou, the knives shouldn't be too much of a problem. Sareena cannot play a keep away game against Dairou. She'll most likely get close and start abusing f,f+1's, which is where the problem begins because Dairou cannot punish the move online.

I played Versa's Sareena a long time ago, and he was by far the best with her on the PS2 at that time. I can tell you right now that knives are not the problem, only f,f+1 is because Dairou cannot punish it. Blame lag.

 

[MKF30]

Yeah, I see what you're saying. I just feel that out of both those moves the knives are more irritating then her other move, but yeah online I've noticed as oppose to offline. Today actually, my friend came by for a little bit and I asked him to do that move repeatedly just to see something.

I must say I agree, I was able to counter him easily online not the same case with lag and such playing a role.

BTW, I do see what you mean and agree about dairou being a great counter for Sareena's. The TS nails her, I'm not sure about you dave but I also love using the teleport from a far, it gives me time to get in close or plan my next attack.

One good tactic I used against Bobby, since his is the best on xbox is that teleporting when I'm far and waiting a second then throw a fireball, he'll think I sometimes will immediately throw it and jump back, if I time if correctly he'll eat a fireball. Know what I mean?

It's also useful in a projectile war since we'll trade hits, it gives me time to plan unlike sareena unless she's really far her knives aren't that big of a problem.

And the D+2 or 3 is great anti air but I've noticed D+2 over time does more damage so I use that more.

I also love Dairou's poke in first style, it's fast and good IMO and can't be parried. His D+1 in weapon is also a good move but I believe that can be parried if I'm not mistaken.

 

[M2Dave]

Both d+1's can be parried in either stance. Use b+3 in first stance. That is unparriable (so is actually wep. b+3 as well but that move is very un-safe even for online standards).

Yes, Teleport is very useful from far away. Just make sure the knives don't catch you while you're doing it. Also, make sure you do perform it from far away otherwise it's a free f,f+1 for Sareena if she blocks it.

For anti-air purposes, use wep. d+2 all day. Don't bother with wep. 3.

Against the knives, use Block~side step~Block~side step, etc. and look for fireball and TS Drop openings. Remember, 1 knife does 4% of damage while Dairou's fireball and TS Drop do about 8% of damage so it's worth trading hits most of the time (unless you're low on health of course). That's what I try to do anyway.

Like I said, if Dairou could punish f,f+1 on block online, this match up would be so much easier.

 

[MKF30]

Yeah, I agree. My mistake I was thinking of Fujin's D+1 in first style for some reason lol..got my pokes confused. I meant Dairou, I've been using both of them lately whenever I do play online.

Anyway, yeah I have one vid up on our matches lol. Funny you say that dave because I did just that, check it out. I'll upload the other one today.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=LBOE2F_3phA

Just put it up last night.

 

[M2Dave]

Good shit. Nice SS~Block. Good fireball use.

You attack and jump too much on Sareena, though. Plus, you abuse teleport too much. I think it's only a matter of time before he starts blocking them and punishing you. Use it as long as it works but take it easy once he adapts.

 

[MKF30]

Yeah thanks.

With bobby though, I've found it's sometimes better to jump kick him if I have a gut feeling he's going to jump I'll try to beat him to the punch with JKs

Dairous awesome with that tactic also, ever find yourself finding he has priority with JK's most of the time?

But glad you enjoyed it, I have a few of them. But the others aren't up yet. 8)

 

[Tom Brady]

this thread is way off. mkda was NOT this broken trash. frost has an infinite and shes BARELY top 10. bottom lin ein mkda is one of the more balenced games i have played. you can take a character like quan chi who isnt even top 10 and still beat any character. there is a good balence in mkda.

 

[RoGE]

ok then, but what about the 3 god tier characters?

 

[Konqrr]

MKF/Dave, let's get back on topic here.

 

[Tom Brady]

ok then, but what about the 3 god tier characters?

there is no god tier in mkda. the top 3 characters have several weaknesses. this is why there is a good balance amongst the top 12 or 13 characters. they all counter pick each other in some way shape or form. like take brc, think hes god tier? pick shang vs him and see how godly brc is NOT! lol...

 

[MKF30]

Honestly, there will ALWAYS be top tiers in any and all fighting games. Occassionally "God tiers" but as long as the fighting game offers some form of balance or other characters that can indeed counter a highly annoying character, it's all good in my book.

MKA was pretty well balanced though, Scorpion though you could just push, hell fire, push, hell fire repeat...one thing I didn't like about MKA the counter/parry should have been for everyone like MKA and the push I wasn't too crazy about in cases where it gave you a free hit such as Scorpion's for example

 

[Tom Brady]

Honestly, there will ALWAYS be top tiers in any and all fighting games. Occassionally "God tiers" but as long as the fighting game offers some form of balance or other characters that can indeed counter a highly annoying character, it's all good in my book.

MKA was pretty well balanced though, Scorpion though you could just push, hell fire, push, hell fire repeat...one thing I didn't like about MKA the counter/parry should have been for everyone like MKA and the push I wasn't too crazy about in cases where it gave you a free hit such as Scorpion's for example

in MKDA scorpion cant push hellfire. also, scorpion gets NO free hits after push.

 

[RoGE]

With Scorpion you could press the special move in pi gua and then use hell fire, Bo Rai Cho is defintly broken, all you need to do to win is his style branching combo and then puke, then repeat.

 

[Tom Brady]

With Scorpion you could press the special move in pi gua and then use hell fire, Bo Rai Cho is defintly broken, all you need to do to win is his style branching combo and then puke, then repeat.

omg... NO!! scorpion cannot shove hellfire.

characters that fight or beat brc just fine are scorpion, drahmin, shang, hsu hao, raiden, frost and kenshi but hes a not really lol.

 

[Mario]

But doesn't Drahmin have a cheap infinite? I could have sworn that I saw it in a video.

 

[RoGE]

With Scorpion you could press the special move in pi gua and then use hell fire, Bo Rai Cho is defintly broken, all you need to do to win is his style branching combo and then puke, then repeat.

omg... NO!! scorpion cannot shove hellfire.

characters that fight or beat brc just fine are scorpion, drahmin, shang, hsu hao, raiden, frost and kenshi but hes a not really lol.

Look, I just did it right now, I EVEN tried to avoid with the other player it IS NOT BLOCKABLE/AVOIDABLE. sure. you can't keep doing it, but you can atleast do it once. <(thats what I was trying to say in case u misread)
You just have to time it right, try it your self if you are so sure. The shove basically gives you a free hell fire. if you cannot do it then tell me how you can avoid it.
And if the game is balanced as you say, then tell me why can't beat bo with any other characters?

 

[Tom Brady]

With Scorpion you could press the special move in pi gua and then use hell fire, Bo Rai Cho is defintly broken, all you need to do to win is his style branching combo and then puke, then repeat.

omg... NO!! scorpion cannot shove hellfire.

characters that fight or beat brc just fine are scorpion, drahmin, shang, hsu hao, raiden, frost and kenshi but hes a not really lol.

Look, I just did it right now, I EVEN tried to avoid with the other player it IS NOT BLOCKABLE/AVOIDABLE. sure. you can't keep doing it, but you can atleast do it once. <(thats what I was trying to say in case u misread)
You just have to time it right, try it your self if you are so sure. The shove basically gives you a free hell fire. if you cannot do it then tell me how you can avoid it.
And if the game is balanced as you say, then tell me why can't beat bo with any other characters?

when scorpion shoves you in open space BACKDASH!! hellfire misses every time.


MKDA is like a 3D umk3 only without a universal technique aka run jab and all normals being the same. almost every character besides the bottom 5 can compete. the stuff dreemernj saw in that philly tourney when the game was only 1 month old was trash in the long run. nothing in that tourney worked, it was 100% trash and only flew by at that time because the game was 1 month old.

 

[RoGE]

With Scorpion you could press the special move in pi gua and then use hell fire, Bo Rai Cho is defintly broken, all you need to do to win is his style branching combo and then puke, then repeat.

omg... NO!! scorpion cannot shove hellfire.

characters that fight or beat brc just fine are scorpion, drahmin, shang, hsu hao, raiden, frost and kenshi but hes a not really lol.

Look, I just did it right now, I EVEN tried to avoid with the other player it IS NOT BLOCKABLE/AVOIDABLE. sure. you can't keep doing it, but you can atleast do it once. <(thats what I was trying to say in case u misread)
You just have to time it right, try it your self if you are so sure. The shove basically gives you a free hell fire. if you cannot do it then tell me how you can avoid it.
And if the game is balanced as you say, then tell me why can't beat bo with any other characters?

when scorpion shoves you in open space BACKDASH!! hellfire misses every time.
.

Calm down man, no need to shout, we are just having a little discusion after all, don't take it to seriously, I am actually a good guy not a mean one.

Well, since I can't test if your right or not, I guess your right.
but how is Bo Rai' Cho NOT a god tier character? couldn't you just do that infinite combo then win?

 

[Tom Brady]

sorry bout the caps man. anyway, hellfire gets escaped by a bd after shove in open space but the computer eats it all day.

but how is Bo Rai' Cho NOT a god tier character? couldn't you just do that infinite combo then win?

no you cant just do the infinite and win. vs several characters their problem isnt the infinite its that they cant punish drunkin fist 32, cant cross the puke, cant stop his behind puke life up, etc. to beat brc you MUST be able to force him out of drunk fist, be able to punish puke, be able to punish life up, be able to punish 32. if you cant do these things brc kills u.

anyway, vs the characters that do beat him.. heres how and why they beat brc.

1. you cant just throw out the infinite. if you block 22 in drunk fist you interrupt with full branch. drunk fist is slow so brc cant catch you in drunk fist which is the main reason you hes so good. he cant hide behind puke traps because hes down on life. he cant life up because those characters punish life up well. hes forced to switch to mi zong or weapon which are easy stances to beat.

2. if you start out puke trapping then you'll get punished and then they turtle and you will not catch them in drunk fist because the characters that fight him have fast moving stances forcing him out of drunk fist.

3. vs scorpion.. brc moves too slow in drunk fist to even ss/ move forward fast enough to avoid hellfire. half the time that hes in drunk fist hellfire hits him unless hes jumping and this aint mkd/mka, you cant jump around like a maniac in mkda. he basically has to fight scorp in all mi zong or weapon.

4. vs shang.. shangs zoning game is WAY to much. the 3D fireball does 13% and if you arent already ducking and try to duck as it approaches to avoid block damage then it hist you in transition. crane is way too fast as well. brc must fight shang in mi zong and weapon. in fact, shang vs brc is not winnable for brc. it is one of the worst matches in the game.


i could write a 10 page essay on character matchups that are bad for brc or reasons that brc loses to or has hard fights with several characters but hopefully what i wrote can help you understand.

 

[RoGE]

Thank you for the intelligent reply. If MKDA had online play, I would have loved to play you, you seem like a decent player.

OK the other possible God tier character is Reptile, according to Konqrr he is a god tier due to his crazy damage 50-50 mix ups.

here is what he says
"Reptile's sweeps in Hung Gar and Crab do around 10-12% each and are so fast that you will be dead via mixups in no time."

 

[Tom Brady]

hung gar is super unsafe and his sweep in that style doesnt do much damage and all it really does is set up crab. crab has 2 moves b3 and b2. b3 is a safe 13% light speed fast low and b2 is a safe fast launcher that leads to 40%. problem is they wont track that well and have zero range. vs someone whos good you need to use hung gar and low ball to get in. like i said, hung gar isnt safe and low ball is unsafe if you low guard then stand guard to stop the ball from rolling over and past you.