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Instant Pause Rematching ON STREAM

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
Since there’s a bunch of wild threads right now, figured I’d add another interesting debate that’s been going on a little on TYM and a lot on Twitter.

The pausing before the match has concluded, and instantly rematching in NRS games.

Now, I have zero problems with this OFF STREAM. It makes sense to want to get to the next match as quickly as possible. Other than the victor not getting his satisfactory ‘ality, no harm no foul.

The problem to me is doing it on stream. Whether you want to admit it or not, viewership and the viewership experience matters a lot in building our scene/community. You WANT people watching NRS tournaments, you want them to WANT to watch them as well. This helps with a few things. Gaining interest from viewers who aren’t already playing so they want to try out the game. Gaining interest from existing players to actually want to compete in tournaments. Viewership numbers also helps gain outside interest from sponsors. More eyes on you means more eyes on their brand. Tons of benefits to go around.

So, why is the instant pause rematch ON STREAM a bad thing? Firstly, it kills the hype. Pretty simple, there’s no satisfactory resolution. Every match tells a story. There’s a beginning, middle and end. To me it feels like you cut the ending a little short. You technically saw the ending, but it’s as if the climax of a movie happens, then automatically a new movie starts playing. Usually there’s a small amount of aftermath after the ending of a movie/story. That aftermath in this case is an ‘ality, win pose, and the commentators quickly reflecting on what just happened. Or even the viewer processing what just happened. It takes away the awe factor when they have ZERO time to reflect.

When you instant pause rematch, you get none of that. As a viewer, you don’t get the gratification of a true, and full ending. The commentators don’t have time to say really anything without interfering with the next match. And all the suspense and hype is sucked out of the air.

I understand the argument of “those 10-15 seconds add up, I want to get to the next match” as a player. But I’m not talking about sitting there and waiting during casuals, off stream pools, etc. This only affects matches on stream. If all you had to do to dramatically increase the viewership experience is to let it rock ONLY while you’re on stream, what realistically is the harm in that? Also, it gives you a few extra seconds to process what just happened as a player. I understand some players don’t need that time and they think it’s beneficial to them to instant rematch, totally get it. I would be very interested to know the statistic though of how often someone who just lost that instant rematches won that next match.

Anyway, I just wish every tournament player who plays on stream would let it rock. At the very LEAST while in top 8. Obviously you don’t have to, you can do whatever you want. I just think it would be more beneficial to you and the scene in the long run, if you just. Let. It. Rock!

Thoughts?
 

Shark Tank

I don't actually play these games
I get why they do it. But it just isn't fun to see.

Only NRS players do that shit. I never see a street fighter stream where the losers cut that shit before round was over. Anime players don't do it. Just NRS.
Those games also don't have finishers and you can't pause before your life bar hits zero without giving up a round( I have seen people get up before an ultra finishes). If MK games had a no finisher mode where you just had that cathartic match end when the life-bar hits zero it would not be an issue, but that would trigger too many people despite not being a hard thing to implement.

EDIT: Also most games don't allow you to pause after one player loses
 
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Eji1700

Kombatant
i agree that it's a bad look, and mostly because of the "wait wtf" feeling as a viewer. Even if it's just muscle memory and not salt it feels off, especially when the player has figured out the match is over before the viewer.

The said, it doesn't help that NRS has never really resolved this. Every game has post match downtime, but it's pretty small. MK games have the same victory animations AND Finish him/fatality/brutatlity time.

It would really help if NRS met them halfway and put in a "skip" command. Like if both players(or just the winner) are holding two buttons are something it'll jump to character victory animations from wherever it is. So if it's a super hype set and someone wants to grind it in, they don't have to hold the buttons and viewers get to watch the fatality/brutatlity play out, but if you just want to keep it moving/run it back/get it done you can both hold the buttons and skip out.

The problem with the pause method, which is nearly identical, is that it can be done BEFORE the victory, which is what leads to the anti hype in the first place. Having an in game way that just fades to victory screen or something when no one wants to bother would be a lot more elegant and stop players from pausing so early and screwing the game flow.
 

DarksydeDash

You know me as RisingShieldBro online.
it's fine until the last match.

Whoever wins deserves to perform that fatality while the defeated watches the entire thing.

As Kung Lao would say:

"Learn from this."
 

MK Led

Umbasa
I agree that on stream you shouldn't do it, mainly for entertainment/hype purposes, but off stream it's a blessing that shaves sometimes up to a minute off every set, which is a huge time saver when you have hundreds (or thousands at evo) of competitors to get through in pools.

imo fatalities get old in a tournament setting kinda quickly, and after a while into the game's lifespan should really only be done on stream to close out sets in top 16/8. Brutalities as slick af though, fantastic for on stream matches and just at home.
 
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Sablicious

Apprentice
>there's there ARE

IMO, a 'vote' should be required for early restarts / premature existing. MK signature is its finishers -- people skipping this aspect of the game (due to salt or impatience), defeats the purpose of NRS's development in said aspect of the games.
 

Bucketfeet

Apprentice
They should just create a tournament mode where there is no "finish him" and the match ends like any other round but with a quick rematch option.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
Imo this is Much Ado About Nothing. I don't know why people make a big deal about this.. It's a personal choice.

Also in my opinion, it's hype when somebody loses a round and their reaction is, "NAH, F THAT, LET'S GO" and restarts the match. It's like a way of saying, "Nah, I'm ready, let's run that back" and you can feel the intensity. I don't understand people vilifying this or making it into a bad thing.

Just let each player do what they want to do. It's not a big issue. I've never felt a hype set was ruined by somebody insta-rematching. Just seems like something for people who don't compete to cry about.
 

KingHippo

Alternative-Fact Checker
I personally always let the outros play out, but if someone has a different prerogative, I'm not going to stop them. I'd really like to meet this person who was fully invested in watching the game but not letting the outros happen made them stop watching, because I'm positive they don't exist.

This non-issue has always sounded to me like the crappy self-loathing that comes about every time a new game comes out. "Why can't you guys be like everyone else," which is just a reaction from years of being gaslit by the general FGC that there are rules to follow and if you don't know you're not valid.
 

The Ultimate

aka CommandThrower
Unless we get a "tournament mode" like Tekken 7 that makes the intros and outros unskippable, or an option that puts a 120 frame delay on pausing, I think we'll be seeing pauses on stream during this game's competitive lifetime.
 

DDustiNN

MK11 Pocket Guide: Koming Soon to the App Store
Since there’s a bunch of wild threads right now, figured I’d add another interesting debate that’s been going on a little on TYM and a lot on Twitter.

The pausing before the match has concluded, and instantly rematching in NRS games.

Now, I have zero problems with this OFF STREAM. It makes sense to want to get to the next match as quickly as possible. Other than the victor not getting his satisfactory ‘ality, no harm no foul.

The problem to me is doing it on stream. Whether you want to admit it or not, viewership and the viewership experience matters a lot in building our scene/community. You WANT people watching NRS tournaments, you want them to WANT to watch them as well. This helps with a few things. Gaining interest from viewers who aren’t already playing so they want to try out the game. Gaining interest from existing players to actually want to compete in tournaments. Viewership numbers also helps gain outside interest from sponsors. More eyes on you means more eyes on their brand. Tons of benefits to go around.

So, why is the instant pause rematch ON STREAM a bad thing? Firstly, it kills the hype. Pretty simple, there’s no satisfactory resolution. Every match tells a story. There’s a beginning, middle and end. To me it feels like you cut the ending a little short. You technically saw the ending, but it’s as if the climax of a movie happens, then automatically a new movie starts playing. Usually there’s a small amount of aftermath after the ending of a movie/story. That aftermath in this case is an ‘ality, win pose, and the commentators quickly reflecting on what just happened. Or even the viewer processing what just happened. It takes away the awe factor when they have ZERO time to reflect.

When you instant pause rematch, you get none of that. As a viewer, you don’t get the gratification of a true, and full ending. The commentators don’t have time to say really anything without interfering with the next match. And all the suspense and hype is sucked out of the air.

I understand the argument of “those 10-15 seconds add up, I want to get to the next match” as a player. But I’m not talking about sitting there and waiting during casuals, off stream pools, etc. This only affects matches on stream. If all you had to do to dramatically increase the viewership experience is to let it rock ONLY while you’re on stream, what realistically is the harm in that? Also, it gives you a few extra seconds to process what just happened as a player. I understand some players don’t need that time and they think it’s beneficial to them to instant rematch, totally get it. I would be very interested to know the statistic though of how often someone who just lost that instant rematches won that next match.

Anyway, I just wish every tournament player who plays on stream would let it rock. At the very LEAST while in top 8. Obviously you don’t have to, you can do whatever you want. I just think it would be more beneficial to you and the scene in the long run, if you just. Let. It. Rock!

Thoughts?
I agree. Someone did that during the reveal event and I was like "Seriously?"

It just makes people feel like sore losers to me idk.
I agree 100%, and had the exact same thoughts. I’ve always hated it, but it was especially hype-deflating to do it at a reveal event. Like why not just let it play out and take a breather?
 

John Grizzly

The axe that clears the forest
simple:

let players do whatever they want!
Maybe down the road, sure. But right now people are dying to just see more MK11. There's no need for a quick restart in the FIRST COMPETITIVE MATCHES IN THE GAME'S HISTORY.

Imagine if Babalities or some form of humiliating finisher is in the game and people are restarting before it happens. There needs to be a tournament toggle option that skips fatality sequences. Both players should have to agree on it and there should be no way to skip win screens if one players doesn't agree to do so, though. If Sonic feels like babying your ass, he just doesn't turn it on, just like in MK9.
 

JBeezYBabY

Mr. Righteous
To keep it all the way live, i HATE when a loser skips the fatality, brutality, whatever finish, let the finish ROCK! This is part of the reason why ppl take NRS as a fucking joke because this is looked as a negative tantrum.

It not only turns off the viewers but i also throws off the commentators with the sudden pause/restart. Its lame overall and on stream, the pause should NOT be a viable function. PERIOD.
 
Maybe down the road, sure. But right now people are dying to just see more MK11. There's no need for a quick restart in the FIRST COMPETITIVE MATCHES IN THE GAME'S HISTORY.

Imagine if Babalities or some form of humiliating finisher is in the game and people are restarting before it happens. There needs to be a tournament toggle option that skips fatality sequences. Both players should have to agree on it, though. If Sonic feels like babying your ass, he just doesn't turn it on, just like in MK9.
thats why i said: let the players do what they want!