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#GrumpyBat: The Joker General Discussion Thread

Lt. Boxy Angelman

WHEN IS GOD
After what's been announced for this patch, I can say with relative certainty that unless Doomsday is somehow one of the last 2 DLC, that if I ever compete in Injustice 2, it'll be with Joker.

My man got the Warlock Quan Chi meets Jay-Z treatment.
New special, new starter and its soon to be fleshed out strings, new all black everything.

After 988 seasons, Joker will finally be fucking scary, as he always should have been.

Praise the Clown Prince.
 
He still doesn’t seem that good but what do I know
They fixed a couple of MAJOR issues with his lack of wake up, hit box business, and they gave him an overhead starter that looks reactable but still fast enough to be useful especially with teeth.

They buffed his zoning a bit so that's nice.

The truth is that he still has several issues with his neutral game and he will still get zoned out in some match ups but matches vs people like Flash, Canary, Batman etc just got a lot easier because he actually has a get off me move. No wake up is pretty awful.

I think this gave him a lot of 5-5s that were 4-6. 3-7s like vs Dr Fate, are still going to be 3-7s
 

Savage8-8

Premium Supporter
Premium Supporter
They buffed his normals apparently. And looked at his hitboxes so they probably improved his j2. This overhead starter could potentially push him way up the tier list. His mix up game got much stronger. What can you connect with the new move? Does RLG ex combo off of it?
 
Is anyone else having issues canceling into teeth from the 3,2 string mid combo after the button change? I've been trying to do my basic bnb (32xxbf2,f3,d2xxteeth,32xxteeth,j1,b13) but I can't seem to get the last teeth cancel to work.I'm wondering if the timing for the command is a bit different now. Admittedly it could be I'm just not fully adjusted to the new buttons yet.
 
Is anyone else having issues canceling into teeth from the 3,2 string mid combo after the button change? I've been trying to do my basic bnb (32xxbf2,f3,d2xxteeth,32xxteeth,j1,b13) but I can't seem to get the last teeth cancel to work.I'm wondering if the timing for the command is a bit different now. Admittedly it could be I'm just not fully adjusted to the new buttons yet.
Same here, ever since the new mapping I'm not able to cancel into teeth from down 2
 
Same here, ever since the new mapping I'm not able to cancel into teeth from down 2
Yeah that too. It took me like an hour of just d2 teeth, d2 teeth before I was able to get it to come out consistently (although it still doesn't come out all the time like it used to). And I did the same with 32 teeth, and I can do that on command outside the combo but mid combo nope.

Like I'm happy they finally buffed him but why did they have to mess with his buttons. For me atleast, bnbs are just muscle memory at work and changing button mapping completely screws that up. It's slightly annoying.
 

freerf245

11 11 11 11
Don’t know why they wouldn’t make the input df2. Probably so you couldn’t os b1 df2 in the neutral. But yea doing d2, d1, and b1 into teeth is kinda aids now.
 
Don’t know why they wouldn’t make the input df2. Probably so you couldn’t os b1 df2 in the neutral. But yea doing d2, d1, and b1 into teeth is kinda aids now.
Exactly. There's so many open spots that it makes no sense that they'd move a crucial move like teeth.

Also curious if anyone's come up with any new tech using either of his two new moves? I'm trying to come with something in the corner (like combo starter, d2xxteeth, 3xxdb3, ender). You should be able to bounce your opponent off the teeth with db3 in the corner, but I'm not sure on the recovery time on or if you can do anything after it.
 
Sup joker mains , I decided that since he finally has some buffs I wanna try this guy out , but all I see are old bnb threads I was going main him since day 1 but I thought captain cold was going be a better trap character then joker so I choose him but anyway anyone here willIng to show me some love to point me to a general direction for joker and his Strategy in the injustice neta
 

Lt. Boxy Angelman

WHEN IS GOD
Same here, ever since the new mapping I'm not able to cancel into teeth from down 2
Neither can I. Even with shortcuts on, it comes out maybe half the time.

So.
I can't believe that after 4 years they finally gave him a decent overhead starter...and it doesn't combo into his main combo extender, the MB Low Can.
I was really, genuinely excited by the idea of Top 10 Joker, aaaaand now my hope is dead.
Quality of life fixes, new wakeup, sure, excellent, glad he has them, hope to see more of him. He got the better end of a patch for the first time in pretty much ever. B2 is still going to go a long way in baiting into Parry or Crowbar for people pushing buttons. But why in the This Is An Actual Joke trolling hell wouldn't you make it an ACTUAL combo starter?
 

KingHippo

Alternative-Fact Checker
Neither can I. Even with shortcuts on, it comes out maybe half the time.

So.
I can't believe that after 4 years they finally gave him a decent overhead starter...and it doesn't combo into his main combo extender, the MB Low Can.
I was really, genuinely excited by the idea of Top 10 Joker, aaaaand now my hope is dead.
Quality of life fixes, new wakeup, sure, excellent, glad he has them, hope to see more of him. He got the better end of a patch for the first time in pretty much ever. B2 is still going to go a long way in baiting into Parry or Crowbar for people pushing buttons. But why in the This Is An Actual Joke trolling hell wouldn't you make it an ACTUAL combo starter?
It is.

 
Things I've noticed with the new patch:

Deathspin: It more damage (2 pts not much) than Crowbar Run (no mb). Sends your opponent full screen. Very useful against characters that have to work their way in against Joker. Against zoners you should be using your regular combo enders.

It hits behind very regularly. Joker takes a step forward when he does it so if your opponent is doing a jump forward for a cross up Joker will duck under it and hit behind on the landing frames. It happened several times in matches against Flash and Batman.

It is hard to stuff but certain strings into lows can beat it with very strict timing. Batman's low pop up string and Braniac's sweep have stuffed it in game.

His new b2 is useful but I've actually noticed it's easier to get off against better players who don't mash buttons when they're negative and don't wake up every single knockdown. If they do then you're gonna get poked out of it all day.

The wake up parry vs deathspin is a real mind game. The only safe wake up option is a jump but in order not to get hit by deathspin you have to be high enough that most characters can't jail into their string. So Joker can either poke out or in the case of a cross up (especially in the corner) you can just forward dash under the jump.

21 feels a lot better. So do j2 and 32

Teeth feel a lot worse with the new input.

I find myself inputting too fast and getting f3 instead of dd3f or inputting too slow and getting d3 instead of dd3.

Match ups that I think are better now

Flash- without being to pressure you for free on wake up anywhere on screen Flash players will actually occasionally have to space themselves properly.

Deadshot- The patch for Joker plus nerfs to Deadshot make it so this match up is not complete cancer anymore. I didn't play many long sets with Deadshot players but the matches I played felt a lot better.

Scarecrow- It used to be that he could sweep or jump on wake up for free and you'd be back in the blender but no longer.

Batman- the nerfs with the Joker buffs make this feel pretty even imo.


Match ups that I'm fairly certain will remain the same or around the same.

Superman- he still zones us, his pressure is real, his jump ins are fast and we can spend all day walking into f23.

Black Adam- His zoning is more dangerous than ours, his chip is better than ours and we can also spend all day walking into his neutral zone to get a string off and then being punished for it.

Green Arrow- wake ups are not a problem for him. GA never wanted to pressure with normals on wake up anyway so he continues to play the game

Dr. Fate- Same idea. Nothing about his game plan has changed. We still have to walk him down and when we do we'll have to fight through safe strings and mb push etc to get a string off.
 

Lt. Boxy Angelman

WHEN IS GOD
How much should you be getting for 1 bar, mid-screen, off a 50/50?
For a combo that involves dashing about for all those teeth? At least 350, I think. When Brainiac and many others can do it for less without execution woes, he could get a little more cheese on his burger for doing his tricky-ish stuff.
 

TamedLizard

Buff George
For a combo that involves dashing about for all those teeth? At least 350, I think. When Brainiac and many others can do it for less without execution woes.
Okay but nevermind the corner carry into solid oki.

Do you guys want me to make a combo thread for his bnbs?

J's forums really need one.
Please! Just picked up the character and think he's a blast, but have had to learn optimal teeth bnbs solely from player's streams/matches.