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Firestorm is the perfect replacement for Captain Cold.

snort

Noob
The puddle is 3 seconds. That's enough time to charge to lvl 2. What is 2 more seconds? There's more to CC than MB puddle.
Puddle is used for more then just trait charging... It keeps rush down chars in check, helps build meter when used for zoning, among others.
 
I'm not downplaying, just simply stating facts. NRS just nerfed a low mid tier character into worst in the game while leaving characters like SuperGirl and BlackAdam alone.
You also said he loses to Firestorm, which isn't true. They took 2 seconds off of puddle and then I believe you said he no longer beats characters like Robin and Catwoman. Let's be honest. Did it take skill to put the puddle down for 5 seconds and zone those characters out? No. They are trying to get rid of the brain dead aspect of this game. 3 seconds is fine.

Now, as a capt cold player, you have to think. If you're a good CC player, you'll be fine, but the players that just want to sit back and zone will have a tougher time. Supergirl did escape nerfs once again, but at least NRS is actively getting rid of brain dead mechanics. With Batman and Deadshot getting nerfed, Supergirl will finally be in the spot light along with Black Adam as they, imo, are in the top 3. But I honestly think this patch puts CC closer to top 15 than bottom 5. I mean CC vs SG is 5-5. CC does well against everyone but Green Arrow. It's the only MU where having MU knowledge is useless.
 

dribirut

BLAK FELOW
Any way you want to dice it, it doesn't look good.

Please someone explain to me how you decide to considerably nerf a mid possibly low tier character and go on to think:

"You know what, I think super girl is fine"

I'm a scare crow main and even I think his buff was dumb. They should have done the same thing for captain cold. Give him these nerfs but compensate with something actually useful
 

snort

Noob
You also said he loses to Firestorm, which isn't true. They took 2 seconds off of puddle and then I believe you said he no longer beats characters like Robin and Catwoman. Let's be honest. Did it take skill to put the puddle down for 5 seconds and zone those characters out? No. They are trying to get rid of the brain dead aspect of this game. 3 seconds is fine.

Now, as a capt cold player, you have to think. If you're a good CC player, you'll be fine, but the players that just want to sit back and zone will have a tougher time. Supergirl did escape nerfs once again, but at least NRS is actively getting rid of brain dead mechanics. With Batman and Deadshot getting nerfed, Supergirl will finally be in the spot light along with Black Adam as they, imo, are in the top 3. But I honestly think this patch puts CC closer to top 15 than bottom 5. I mean CC vs SG is 5-5. CC does well against everyone but Green Arrow. It's the only MU where having MU knowledge is useless.
He does lose to firestorm, and I've already stated why, you're probably playing nobody good. There's a reason why Cold is the only char not represented in the top 100 in rank matches and isn't used in tourny play. Sonic's Cold got bodied at ELeague and he most likely wont use him anymore after the nerfs. You have no idea how many times I've caught players in puddle at 4 or 5 seconds. Throws into puddle most likely wont work either.
 

foxof42

Thanksgiving corner game, going ham and stuffing
Any way you want to dice it, it doesn't look good.

Please someone explain to me how you decide to considerably nerf a mid possibly low tier character and go on to think:

"You know what, I think super girl is fine"

I'm a scare crow main and even I think his buff was dumb. They should have done the same thing for captain cold. Give him these nerfs but compensate with something actually useful
In other words, balance the character, exactly. They made it clear in the stream for the previous patch that they consider him a utility character who does very well in certain matchups and have been toning down his tools in those matchups since. But why? Why CHOOSE to make a character unbalanced? Why not take away some things that made his good matchups braindead and give him the proper tools to handle his many bad MUs? They need to redesign him outright. The only thing that really needs to stay essential to the character is the ability to charge trait, but everything else I consider up for debate. He needs fixes all over the place.
 

foxof42

Thanksgiving corner game, going ham and stuffing
But for the record... I haven't had a problem with the GA MU with Cold. It's pretty much lvl 2 trait/cold blast spam loops at fullscreen. That's the entire MU. You turtle at fullscreen charging trait and make sure your blocking is on point because you're going to block plenty of low arrows until they understand that they have to come to you. If they're forced to come to you, the game has officially shifted in your favor. With antiairs on point and even more turtling, you're in the clear. In a way it's like the Ivy/Arrow MU if Ivy had a godly D2.

Still pretty boring.
 
He does lose to firestorm, and I've already stated why, you're probably playing nobody good. There's a reason why Cold is the only char not represented in the top 100 in rank matches and isn't used in tourny play. Sonic's Cold got bodied at ELeague and he most likely wont use him anymore after the nerfs. You have no idea how many times I've caught players in puddle at 4 or 5 seconds. Throws into puddle most likely wont work either.
You shoot and crouch your way in on firestorm. Charge when you hit them or block the low. What exactly does he do that gets you bodied?
 
But for the record... I haven't had a problem with the GA MU with Cold. It's pretty much lvl 2 trait/cold blast spam loops at fullscreen. That's the entire MU. You turtle at fullscreen charging trait and make sure your blocking is on point because you're going to block plenty of low arrows until they understand that they have to come to you. If they're forced to come to you, the game has officially shifted in your favor. With antiairs on point and even more turtling, you're in the clear. In a way it's like the Ivy/Arrow MU if Ivy had a godly D2.

Still pretty boring.
I lose the life lead against him. My straight shots don't even work because they're highs and he's shooting fire in low stance. I always have to chase which is pretty annoying
 

just_2swift

King of Edenia.
Dirty shit to be discovered? He's basically the same exact char prepatch but worse. NRS litterally nerfed him into the worst character in the game hands down. Swamps been getting buffs from the start and he's looking pretty damn good after the latest patch, Joker could be top 10 now too. Cold beats nobody in the game after the ice puddle nerf.
He's not the worst. One word.... Booyah
 

Cursa

Counterpoke with armoured DB2 at all times.
Any way you want to dice it, it doesn't look good.

Please someone explain to me how you decide to considerably nerf a mid possibly low tier character and go on to think:

"You know what, I think super girl is fine"

I'm a scare crow main and even I think his buff was dumb. They should have done the same thing for captain cold. Give him these nerfs but compensate with something actually useful
I agree with this the most. I'm not exactly super versed in the captain cold match-ups but watching sonic fight whiteboi and hayatei as cold made the matchup look extremely difficult once he got level 2 trait. Whether or not he deserved the nerf or not idk but he definitely should've been given something else if they decided the bubble and puddle needed nerfs.
 

snort

Noob
I agree with this the most. I'm not exactly super versed in the captain cold match-ups but watching sonic fight whiteboi and hayatei as cold made the matchup look extremely difficult once he got level 2 trait. Whether or not he deserved the nerf or not idk but he definitely should've been given something else if they decided the bubble and puddle needed nerfs.
This was only because they didn't know how to deal with it in the beginning, now all top players do.
 

Cursa

Counterpoke with armoured DB2 at all times.
This was only because they didn't know how to deal with it in the beginning, now all top players do.
I haven't seen any recent gameplay of sonic's cold, how do they deal with it now?
 

foxof42

Thanksgiving corner game, going ham and stuffing
I haven't seen any recent gameplay of sonic's cold, how do they deal with it now?
There's no recent gameplay because he dropped him like a rock and announced on Twitter that he wouldn't be touching him again until he got fixes to his buttons at the bare minimum.

But here's him vs Nubcakes from Eleague?

If you're in the globe, committing to backdashing is the way to go. At worst you eat a projectile. On a hard read, you get chased down by Cold. If you're playing a cqc character and he pops trait, you proceed to build more meter than him until he gets impatient or you find a moment for a MB roll.
 

foxof42

Thanksgiving corner game, going ham and stuffing
what makes Cap Cold bad?
He starts off with a poor projectile that gets up to Firestorm status at level two, but until then it's pretty bad. His jump is floaty and his jump normals are terrible. His buttons are slow and difficult to punish with. Some of his strings are just outright strange like his famous all-highs string. He gets frame advantage off his overhead string that almost always requires whiffing the first hit, but that's about the best you can do for pressuring. No mix outside setups that can be woken up on, tech rolled, delayed wakeup, etc. Your whole game plan centers on making yourself a target in neutral so you can get level two trait going.

The best thing he has going for him is possibly the best d2 in the game, an amazing 6f low d1, and trait resets if you land a hit. Other than those things, he gets counterpicked by 75% of the cast and has to work hard to get anything going.