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Match-up Discussion DS Matchup Chart after a year into IGAU

YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Master
@Mr Aquaman, I shall list some advantages ds has bcuz numbers are meh to me, I want to adjust my chart later, but anyways:
Fullscreen: of course ds has better zoning so ares will have to utilize his tele at times to close the distance against ds and ds can hold the lead better IMO from this distance.
Midscreen: still can use guns nd bait teles as well. If ares decides to dash in, d2 nd d1 can handle it.Godsmack can be countered with j3 as well.
Sweep distance: DS has d1, d2, b1, f3, and j3 at his disposal, so he definitely can play the footsie game at this range vs ares.
Up close: cant oki ares really, but can apply pressure and frame traps and can bait wakeup teles or godsmack. Also can utilize j3 as well up close and his other solid normals.
Overall, 6 4 or 5 5 arent that didf, so instead I made a list of things that help ds vs ares.
 
A

Argenrost

Noob
AVN PTH jonnitti said:
Batman: 5-5
Cyborg: 6-4
Doomsday: 5-5
Nightwing: 5-5
Raven: 6-4
Wonder Woman: 5-5
Zatanna: 5-5

these are matchups i struggle in. can you guys help me out on these? especialy nightwing, doomy and raven :/
@MITDJT @GGA Slips @RedRaptor10 @G4S J360 @Crathen @Vagrant
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DS checks Cyborg's IAFB game with Quick Fire very easily. As that tends to be a crucial part of Cyborg's game in the ideal case... the rest is self-explanatory. DS is generally more solid all-around than Cyborg. I don't have experience against really good Cyborg players but the zoning game advantage alone is enough to call this match-up in DS's favor I think.

DS vs. Raven is a lot of back-and-forth zoning. Raven gets a lot of damage if she responds correctly in the zoning game, but the average situation is favorable for DS in both chip damage and punishment, even when her trait is active. She gets dominated in the close-range game too; her mix-ups are very limited and easy to block while DS's generally aren't.

Playing against Deg and another local Zatanna player, I can be a little more specific on the Zatanna match-up. DS doesn't care too much about her Linking Rings zoning because he can check her with Quick Fire all day. Puppet Master is also punishable by QF if you pinpoint the awkward reversal timing. QF also keeps her from eternally running away with teleports for free, so ultimately she's forced to hold her ground a little more. Her answer to this is to read gun shots and teleport in for a full combo punish, but even MB teleport is punishable if you read it correctly and input 132 as soon as she blinks over. It's a solid 5-5 because both characters have strong answers to the other character's tools that would otherwise cause them problems, so at that point it's purely a matter of making the best reads.

And I kinda have to go with Mr. Aquaman about Ares. It's a solid 5-5, for many of the same reasons the Zatanna match-up is a 5-5. The difference is that Ares has less zoning potential but a much stronger close-range/mid-range game. A solid Ares will hurt you bad if you make a mistake in zoning, and you can't meet him in the air at all. There's too much potential for things to go south in this match-up for it to be a 6-4 in DS's favor IMO.
 
KH_Captain

KH_Captain

Nightwolf wannabe
This would make him top 9-10. Though i do agree with wowo, gl, kf. i do think youre upplaying a tad. Pretty close, I think DS is about 12th best with GL n BA.
 
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L1FTER

L1FTER

Noob
I need serious advice for the Flash. I know it's his worst MU but any advice on how to make it easier will be helpful.
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Master
L1FTER said:
I need serious advice for the Flash. I know it's his worst MU but any advice on how to make it easier will be helpful.
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I shall give you the screen breakdown:
Full to midscreen: utilize ur guns of course but try to see how he reacts to them. Mix in ex guns from time to time and gain dat meter for pushblocking and etc. Also try to bait lightning charge with jump back 3.
Midscreen to sweep: can punish guns, so be careful with them. Let jump 3 be ur friend if he tries to get in nd mix in ex guns more in this position of the screen. Try to punish dashes with guns.
Sweep to close: d2 will do u very well, use this to keep him honest and away from u. It is faster than flashes b2 and it blows up dash ins for full combos. Also beats jump in. Utilize j3 from time to time( since flash has a good d2 try to do a quick j3 to blow it up). Also utilize his b1 and f3 as well ( recommend meter burn f3 to blow up d1,2)
Close: utilize his f3, b1, d2, and etc. To either apply oki pressure or to keep him away
Hope this helps :)
 
L1FTER

L1FTER

Noob
MITDJT said:
I shall give you the screen breakdown:
Full to midscreen: utilize ur guns of course but try to see how he reacts to them. Mix in ex guns from time to time and gain dat meter for pushblocking and etc. Also try to bait lightning charge with jump back 3.
Midscreen to sweep: can punish guns, so be careful with them. Let jump 3 be ur friend if he tries to get in nd mix in ex guns more in this position of the screen. Try to punish dashes with guns.
Sweep to close: d2 will do u very well, use this to keep him honest and away from u. It is faster than flashes b2 and it blows up dash ins for full combos. Also beats jump in. Utilize j3 from time to time( since flash has a good d2 try to do a quick j3 to blow it up). Also utilize his b1 and f3 as well ( recommend meter burn f3 to blow up d1,2)
Close: utilize his f3, b1, d2, and etc. To either apply oki pressure or to keep him away
Hope this helps :)
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I'll try to keep some of this in mind. I'm just finding jumping in hard since d2 and air to airs always go in flash's favor so that's really hurting j3 and the 50/50 game after that.
 
F4tal

F4tal

Apprentice
MITDJT said:
Alright I picked him up as main now, but I have also been using him since day 1 and watching other DS players duke it out in tournaments and what not, this is my chart and i'd like TYM to give me their opinion/ insight.
Aquaman: 4-6
Ares: 6-4
Bane: 5-5
Batgirl: 4-6
Batman: 5-5
Black Adam: 5-5
Catwoman: 6-4
Cyborg: 6-4
Doomsday: 5-5
Flash: 4-6
Green Arrow: 6-4
Green Lantern: 5-5
Harley Quinn: 5-5
Hawkgirl: 6-4
Joker: 6-4
Killer Frost: 5-5
Lex Luthor: 6-4
Lobo: 5-5
Martian Manhunter: 4-6
Nightwing: 5-5
Raven: 6-4
Scorpion: 5-5
Shazam: 6-4
Sinestro: 5-5
Grundy: 5-5
Superman: 5-5
Wonder Woman: 5-5
Zatanna: 5-5
Zod: 5-5

Advantageous MUs: 9
Even MUs: 15
Disadvantageous MUs: 5
Give me yall opinions and let me know how yall feel. Some matchups I dnt have as much xp in, so enlighten me.
@Crathen
@GGA Slips
@KingHippo
@Vagrant
@Mattix
@Argenrost
tag any other DS I missed lol, I forget tags a lot.
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If it means anything I absolutely agree with the Hawkgirl vs. Deathstroke MU. Some would argue that he wins 7-3 but I feel it's just a tough but very manageable 6-4. She just has to patient and use flight at the right time even though she can't stay in the air for long due to DS air shots.
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Master
F4tal said:
If it means anything I absolutely agree with the Hawkgirl vs. Deathstroke MU. Some would argue that he wins 7-3 but I feel it's just a tough but very manageable 6-4. She just has to patient and use flight at the right time even though she can't stay in the air for long due to DS air shots.
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Agreed, and if she corners DS, she can do some serious damage to him for sure.
 
L1FTER

L1FTER

Noob
So after running an online set with syknis I have a few questions about aquaman. What do we do to apply pressure at midscreen besides guns and how do you deal with his b1? The b1 makes playing footsies very tough.
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Master
L1FTER said:
So after running an online set with syknis I have a few questions about aquaman. What do we do to apply pressure at midscreen besides guns and how do you deal with his b1? The b1 makes playing footsies very tough.
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For b1, I would say try to mb f3 it or try to land a jump on it, it is hsrd to deal with for sure. Midscreen best you can do other than guns is slowly approach and try to corner him so u can wreck his wakeups.
 
L1FTER

L1FTER

Noob
MITDJT said:
For b1, I would say try to mb f3 it or try to land a jump on it, it is hsrd to deal with for sure. Midscreen best you can do other than guns is slowly approach and try to corner him so u can wreck his wakeups.
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Yeah it seems like this match up is all about knocking him down and doing oki setups on him. Also his jumping attacks beat deathstrokes in the air to air contest so anti airing with d2 is a better option.
 
Vagrant

Vagrant

Champion
Yoaksssss said:
What are your guys opinion on the Lobo match-up?

@GGA Slips @MITDJT @G4S J360 @Srryimwhte @Vagrant @KingHippo @AVN PTH jonnitti any other DS mains?
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Even Steven 5-5.

Fun matchup actually.

You want to zone him out, force him to get impatient and make mistakes, and mix him up if he's being patient and sitting still waiting to block low guns.

DS gets a space control advantage, lobo massively out damages DS. MB hook charge vs. f3/mbf3 in footsies set up both of their mixup games. I feel like this matchup could swing in eithers favor depending on stage.
 
Yoaks

Yoaks

A spaceman
Srryimwhte said:
its honestly a 5-5 as death stroke its not a real zoning match only reason I probably would appear 6-4 in lobos favor is when people shoot recklessly and get checked with trait shotgun
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Yea definitly agree. The "Run of the Mill" Deathstroke player is really easy to deal with as Lobo. Alot them just throw out GunShot's but that shit gets punished mid-screen. Playing you guy's on here makes the Lobo vs Deathstroke one of my favorite match up's! The mind games on KD and footsie game is pretty even on both sides so it's all on who gets the momentum going first!
 
Slips

Slips

Feared by dragons. Desired by virgins.
MITDJT said:
I havent played it much, but if it is 5 5 I wouldnt be surprised. Also slips I know he has played dat matchup alot vs fill pops/ vagrant as well.
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At best it's 5-5 for Lobo. Could be 6-4 DS. Hard for Lobo to load nuclear shells without getting shot. Also hard for Lobo to stop DS from jumping around.

I don't think DS beats Cyborg at all. At best it's 5-5. It's hard sledding if Cyborg gets a life lead on DS. If the Cyborg player you are playing is doing instant air shots then they aren't playing the mu right.
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Master
GGA Slips said:
At best it's 5-5 for Lobo. Could be 6-4 DS. Hard for Lobo to load nuclear shells without getting shot. Also hard for Lobo to stop DS from jumping around.

I don't think DS beats Cyborg at all. At best it's 5-5. It's hard sledding if Cyborg gets a life lead on DS. If the Cyborg player you are playing is doing instant air shots then they aren't playing the mu right.
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Yeah lobo could be that, and if cyborg does standing fireball, ds can just jump it and if he tries and charge it, shoot him out of it. Plus DS is significantly better up close without a doubt.
 
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