Do you feel MK11 combos are big enough & entertaining?

[LawAbidingCitizen]

Many others have brought this up at locals and after seeing MKX at last major it was a reminder of just how much combos have change in the last installation of MK.

• Do you feel combos are hype in MK11?
• Do you feel combos are lackluster compared to older games?

Personally I feel combos are very limited and boring in 11 aside from a few exceptions. It seems like the same starters and enders on repeat, tourneys are just KB, FB, 2 same combos on loop into throws and more throws.
I feel the damage is pretty good for most but brain dead 3 hit combos shouldn't get as much as 35% and there should be just a little bit more execution required to get above 20% especially 40%
But what I'm asking for isn't a change in combo damage but the length and possibilitys to widen with less restrictions on juggles. I feel damage scaling is a very important tool for competitive health and I'm fine with that being toned down.
Ignore the damage in these but focus on the depth and length:

MKX Kombows:

Am I happy with 11? Yes
I feel MK11 is possibly the best MK out of the box. It has its problems like any fighter but pretty good compared to previous day 1 titles, aside from hitbox issues, KB requirements, FBs and some Meter inconsistencys it great.


Let me know what you think about combos in 11 and how you want them changed or if they are fine as they are?

If you think they are fine as is can you please provide what characters you use and why you like the combo paths available.

If you don't like them please explain why and what characters you feel are lacking.

 

[Vslayer]

Some characters have long combos and lots of different paths (Sonya, Cassie, Noob) but MOST of the cast have one or two good combos that they use frequently.

It’s definitely underwhelming in some instances and sure KBs balance things out but I wish they did less damage and we had longer combos.

 

[Eldriken]

I don't care either way. If it's flashy and does less damage and you lose due to it, what good did that do you or anyone else?

I'd rather substitute consistency and efficiency over flashy combos any day.

Some people care too much about combos and think they're what wins games and that you're some kind of newb if you don't do optimals all the time.

 

[NaughtySenpai]

I like Scorpion combos because they give you a lot of options.
You can switch sides, corner carry, bait breakaway, couple of hard options for max damage, get oki setups, restands and shit, but really freestyling on people is not really feasible.

I'm a lot less satisfied with the combo system when I'm playing Skarlet though. She has like 2 combos. One from mid screen, one in the corner and a string into special cancel for punishes, which is ok in her case since she's supposed to be midrange footsie character not a combo machine.

Still I miss styling on people like you can in SF4 or Guilty Gear. I think that is something modern fighters are lacking big time.
I just wanna be able to juggle somebodies ass for 15 seconds with shitty damage if I feel like it.
Let me express what kind of an asshole I am. It's not always about doing max damage or effeciency, sometimes you just want to look cool.

 

[LawAbidingCitizen]

I use Shang Tsung, Kano, Cassie, Jax and Scorpion(mirrors).
I feel Shang is good with the Kombo paths he has in Warlock and is where a Zoner should be combo wise but other zoners like Scarlet and Jade may need some love.

Jax (Hunker Down) and Kano(Ripper) are kind of lacking having almost no practical launchers. I feel this way about most characters.

 

[Swindle]

“Long combos” is an overrated concept.
I much prefer the SamSho style of play.

 

[Eldagrin]

I’m fine with how combos are now. Cetrion’s hardest ender also nets her the most damage (j3 j2 f13 Geyser) so it’s not like you can’t have optimal enders that require a bit more practice and work. Most combos in SC6 aren’t super flashy either unless you’re playing someone like Raphael/Amy/Taki.

I don’t really need crazy combos for the game to be fun. Hollywood Cassie’s optimal corner combos were just like Starter, f2, 121, 21u4, 21u4 and ended in 212 xx EX Nutpunch for vortex or 123 xx db2, b1 db2 for safe jump; which is fairly repetitive.

People say “Combos in MK11 suck, they’re just starter into special into string/jump in into string or ender” as though combos for a lot of MKX characters not named Liu Kang or Kitana weren’t pretty much just that.

 

[Jhonnykiller45]

They're fine.
Using Check's combos as an example for MKX is not very good though, he spends months/years on those and they're clearly all impractical and made specifically to be really long.

 

[FoughtDragon01]

Does it really matter how long/creative a combo can be anyway? As soon as someone finds the optimal stuff, it's all you'll see everyone do.

 

[just_2swift]

Just give everyone a standard njp like mk9

 

[stokedAF]

The combos could be more creative but I like the pacing a lot more than X. Way more entertaining imo. People using weird characters is fun to watch at the higher levels. Watching the same 4 characters I always play is kinda boring even at high levels. People are there to win though so I get it.

 

[Vslayer]

I’m fine with how combos are now. Cetrion’s hardest ender also nets her the most damage (j3 j2 f13 Geyser) so it’s not like you can’t have optimal enders that require a bit more practice and work. Most combos in SC6 aren’t super flashy either unless you’re playing someone like Raphael/Amy/Taki.

I don’t really need crazy combos for the game to be fun. Hollywood Cassie’s optimal corner combos were just like Starter, f2, 121, 21u4, 21u4 and ended in 212 xx EX Nutpunch for vortex or 123 xx db2, b1 db2 for safe jump; which is fairly repetitive.

People say “Combos in MK11 suck, they’re just starter into special into string/jump in into string or ender” as though combos for a lot of MKX characters not named Liu Kang or Kitana weren’t pretty much just that.

What I miss from MKX is the creativity, it’ll always be string into special launcher into string and special ender, but you could do a ton of stuff in MKX with Cass in the corner. I feel like you had much more tools to be creative whereas here there’s one or two optimal things you can do and there’s no room for incorporating other strings.

Also Cassie’s ding dong was so much better and her baton strings were really sweet. And her undercut. I miss her

MK11 is still fun, some characters are interesting to play and fun as hell even if they don’t have big combos, but they do feel watered down.

 

[Eldagrin]

What I miss from MKX is the creativity, it’ll always be string into special launcher into string and special ender, but you could do a ton of stuff in MKX with Cass in the corner. I feel like you had much more tools to be creative whereas here there’s one or two optimal things you can do and there’s no room for incorporating other strings.

Also Cassie’s ding dong was so much better and her baton strings were really sweet. And her undercut. I miss her

MK11 is still fun, some characters are interesting to play and fun as hell even if they don’t have big combos, but they do feel watered down.

I agree that she had some more creative routes in the corner, but midscreen she had arguably less complex combos than she does in MK11, since it was usually just starter xx flip xx run b12 xx nut punch/tackle (unless you got really optimal and fit in a 212 before the b12 xx ender). She really only got somewhat interesting combos midscreen off a JK in brawler with EX air grab or off 214 which gave her either 33, b12 xx flip or f24 xx flip into the usual enders.

 

[NaughtySenpai]

Does it really matter how long/creative a combo can be anyway? As soon as someone finds the optimal stuff, it's all you'll see everyone do.

Not really true. I've seen tons of Guilty Gear/Tekken/SF tournament footage where people like Gamerbee, Smug, JimmyJTran, Kazunoko and others go for stupidly long unoptimized combos just to show off and when you see that shit, you know what player did it without even looking at the name on the screen.

This way of expressing yourself is something that has become rare in fighting games in recent years, as most games don't even support it.

Games like Tekken on top of that have things in it that require years of practice. I really enjoy watching games with legacy skills attached to it, just to admire some crazy fuck who has been playing the game for 15 years pulling of 3 EWGFs in a single combo or consistently doing taunt jet upper on somebodies wakeup.

Watching people doing ridiculous parries and hit-confirms in 3S is like watching poetry in motion.

The insane shit that people pull off in KOF games? That shit's sick.



I personally feel like you're hurting the longevity of your game by limiting creativity and mechanical skills ceilings.
NRS probably doesn't care about that because they got a new game to pump out every 2 years, but imo that's a big loss for the community as a whole.

Though I gotta admit MK11 has some of that. I think I saw this NinjaKilla guy fuck somebody up off stream by baiting a flawless block, then cancelling into Liu Kang's parry to beat out the FB u+2. That kinda shit is sick.

 

[Vslayer]

I agree that she had some more creative routes in the corner, but midscreen she had arguably less complex combos than she does in MK11, since it was usually just starter xx flip xx run b12 xx nut punch/tackle (unless you got really optimal and fit in a 212 before the b12 xx ender). She really only got somewhat interesting combos midscreen off a JK in brawler with EX air grab or off 214 which gave her either 33, b12 xx flip or f24 xx flip into the usual enders.

Yeah her midscreen were simple, they sort of did the opposites with this game brawler was super fun I wish she had a command grab again.

 

[Eldagrin]

Not really true. I've seen tons of Guilty Gear/Tekken/SF tournament footage where people like Gamerbee, Smug, JimmyJTran, Kazunoko and others go for stupidly long unoptimized combos just to show off and when you see that shit, you know what player did it without even looking at the name on the screen.

This way of expressing yourself is something that has become rare in fighting games in recent years, as most games don't even support it.

Games like Tekken on top of that have things in it that require years of practice. I really enjoy watching games with legacy skills attached to it, just to admire some crazy fuck who has been playing the game for 15 years pulling of 3 EWGFs in a single combo or consistently doing taunt jet upper on somebodies wakeup.

Watching people doing ridiculous parries and hit-confirms in 3S is like watching poetry in motion.

The insane shit that people pull off in KOF games? That shit's sick.



I personally feel like you're hurting the longevity of your game by limiting creativity and mechanical skills ceilings.
NRS probably doesn't care about that because they got a new game to pump out every 2 years, but imo that's a big loss for the community as a whole.

Though I gotta admit MK11 has some of that. I think I saw this NinjaKilla guy fuck somebody up off stream by baiting a flawless block, then cancelling into Liu Kang's parry to beat out the FB u+2. That kinda shit is sick.

I’ll admit, there is something special about watching an experienced Nina player carry their opponent all the way across the screen into a wall combo for like 60% of their health. A lot of the high execution Tekken characters like Nina and the Mishimas are extremely hype so you’ve got a point there.

 

[GothamInGray]

Combo length and look are fine, I think. I just wish more characters had variety in their combo paths. I play the characters I do because I feel like I have some creative freedom, whereas a character like Sonya, Geras, Erron Black, etc. is always doing the same combos no matter who plays them.

 

[Afumba]

I find the bigger part of the combos too short, would prefer longer juggles midscreen (not bigger damage though). Combo variety feels and looks (as spectator) limited as well. Spectating someone like Geras, Erron or Kang gets boring fast in this regard.

 

[Lokheit]

IMO a lot of the tournament variations feel really plain and vanilla in term of combos, but many characters have kustom moves that make them way more fun.

Sub-Zero for example, is tooooo basic in terms of combos, but when you use Rising Ice he becomes a very fun character with lots of combo routes.

 

[AugustAPC]

I think they're fine. There could be a bigger variety, but I prefer Mortal Kombat be a more footsie-based game. I love the Crushing Blow mechanic and think it fits Mortal Kombat perfectly.

Injustice should be the combo-heavy title. I'd like to see the two franchises separate themselves in direction. Mortal Kombat, the heavier, more methodical fighter and Injustice, the higher mobility and faster-paced game.

 

[chud_munson]

They're fine. Executing long combos is not what I think is interesting about fighting games.

 

[LawAbidingCitizen]

They're fine.
Using Check's combos as an example for MKX is not very good though, he spends months/years on those and they're clearly all impractical and made specifically to be really long.

Obviously they are not practical but there was thousands of paths on MK9 & MKX no shortage. I don't know about you but I had bigger combos on day 10 when X was out.
They had multiple patches that changed what was possible.
That video was an example and I wasn't talking about the damage just the depth and length. In many previous titles there where multiple combo paths and variations, the possibilities where limitless in X. But there are several characters that are very limited with only 1 combo path in 11 in tournament variations. I am not saying I want MKX combos just more paths, obviously certain characters have enough but that's not the case with some. I'm not saying I don't have fun playing MK11 I'm saying it gets boring very quick when things like that are limited later on down the road.

And I'm not saying we don't have combos I'm saying there isn't many paths, Most KBs don't pop up but just add damage for minimal effort/execution And what is there is pretty limited compared to previous MK's.

 

[LawAbidingCitizen]

I think they're fine. There could be a bigger variety, but I prefer Mortal Kombat be a more footsie-based game. I love the Crushing Blow mechanic and think it fits Mortal Kombat perfectly.

Injustice should be the combo-heavy title. I'd like to see the two franchises separate themselves in direction. Mortal Kombat, the heavier, more methodical fighter and Injustice, the higher mobility and faster-paced game.

What do you mean? How do combos being longer effect footsies? Neutral is before the combo starts, I specifically stayed the damage could be less for longer combos for all I care, allowing more footsie.

 

[Baconlord]

I don't care how long and elaborate they are, bnbs aren't hype. Shit like cyrax and kitana combos in x were just obnoxiously long. Plus you can't have long combos because of the way meter comes back

 

[LawAbidingCitizen]

Does it really matter how long/creative a combo can be anyway? As soon as someone finds the optimal stuff, it's all you'll see everyone do.

I disagree. To me it does matter. more combo paths meant more personal expression and creativity. In 9 and X there where hundreds odd ways of ending the combos and everything in between with far more starters. Some characters can HKD or choose between +20 TO +50 on knockdIwn adv or where exactly you want the on screen Just outside of D4/your farthest button/full screen
But many don't.
To me the combos where how I separated my character from all the other copycats. It was individuality.