Question - Summoner Dink's Summoner Match Up Chart!(Updated 10/30/15)

[STB Shujinkydink]

I've heard so many people say Summoner vs Imposter/BS is in QC favor or even at worst. Why is it disadvantage here? Isn't QC basically a "I do this better than you" version of Imposter?

From my experience playing guys like @DEZDA1 Imposter has safe reset mixups and also leaves him in a standing reset. QC can do more damage and what not, but he only really control the corner. Shinnoks shoulder charge is a really good wakeup that negates a lot of quans knockdown options. And the threat of it keeps quan on his toes. He has the control I believe and is more likely to safely get stuff going than quan.

Brawler Cassie is difficult for Summoner, but Hollywood is even? I think you should swap those 2 variations
Brawler: projectile can't be used in this matchup. Has some very punishable mixups, lacks F34
Hollywood: iagun can hit you out of Quan ia skull (because of faster startup) and his garbage teleport, can jump over and dodge rune. It means that if Cassie has a life lead she has something to deal with Quan fullscreen away, unlike Brawler who must chase everyone down. If Quan got hit by Cassie it might be a pain in the ass since her nut punch is from +5 to +19
There is something I'm not sure: Quan can interrupt Cassie's B124 with d1. Can someone help me test this? You can try using Mileena reversal roll Cassie's B124 if her 8f roll hits (not trade with the last hit) then his 6f d1 can do that too

Brawler has better pressure against quan. Hollywood has a shitty projectile, woo! Not worth the variation switch. shes not gonna win shooting one bullet at quan.

Just keep in mind these are my opinions. and sometimes peoples opinions suck and are bad. But I've played quan since day 1 release and this is what i believe is accurate and im willing to play anyone to further see more options i may not know of. Im not gonna sit here and say that my word is truth. Im trying to give an accurate representation from my experience playing the game. I always welcome games to change my mind, i need to know where my character excels and fails to play this game at the level I want to. Thanks

 

[SaltShaker]

From my experience playing guys like @DEZDA1 Imposter has safe reset mixups and also leaves him in a standing reset. QC can do more damage and what not, but he only really control the corner. Shinnoks shoulder charge is a really good wakeup that negates a lot of quans knockdown options. And the threat of it keeps quan on his toes. He has the control I believe and is more likely to safely get stuff going than quan.

Ah ok I see. I've only seen vs BS Shinnok on a regular basis here so I wasn't sure on Imposter other than stuff I've heard. That makes sense though. Thanks for the input.

 

[Zoidberg747]

Shirai Ryu beating Quan Chi?

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

Shirai Ryu beating Quan Chi?

@Red Raptor

Also ive played countless games with @Immortal Kombat hes done a great job of analyzing the MU. He believes its a 7-3

 

[Zoidberg747]

@Red Raptor

Also ive played countless games with @Immortal Kombat hes done a great job of analyzing the MU. He believes its a 7-3

Care to explain? I could maybe see why he would be in the difficult MU sections but putting him on the same level as Kobu Tanya seems weird to me. I'd like to know the logic of @Immortal Kombat.

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

Care to explain? I could maybe see why he would be in the difficult MU sections but putting him on the same level as Kobu Tanya seems weird to me. I'd like to know the logic of @Immortal Kombat.

Ill let him go into more detail, but quan is one of the few characters that has to hold the kunai mixups. No armour, he has to take the plus frames which leads into f2(?) i think

 

[YoloRoll1stHit]

Brawler has better pressure against quan. Hollywood has a shitty projectile, woo! Not worth the variation switch. shes not gonna win shooting one bullet at quan

No. Brawler cannot have better pressure with 1 less string and 2 punishable specials. I'm saying this from a Cassie player's perspective. Hollywood projectile might be the top 5 best projectile in the game with 11 frame startup (ex is 8 frame and has a mid)

 

[Zoidberg747]

Ill let him go into more detail, but quan is one of the few characters that has to hold the kunai mixups. No armour, he has to take the plus frames which leads into f2(?) i think

F1 not f2.

Ill have to study this myself tomorrow.

 

[YoloRoll1stHit]

Wait shirai ryu has frame trap?
And i confirm that mileena can roll to interrupt the gap in cassie b124 string. It means 6f d1 can also do that, with tougher timing

 

[Zoidberg747]

Wait shirai ryu has frame trap?
And i confirm that mileena can roll to interrupt the gap in cassie b124 string. It means 6f d1 can also do that, with tougher timing

Ill let him go into more detail, but quan is one of the few characters that has to hold the kunai mixups. No armour, he has to take the plus frames which leads into f2(?) i think

No but I can kind of see where he is coming from. So the issue is after f12 2+4(both hits) kunai Quan is out of d1 range which might make it seem like f1 is guaranteed. But Quan can actually D4 and it will low profile the F1. It should give enough hit advantage to back away unless the frame data is wrong. You can also NJP if you think he is going to do it but you actually have to delay it a little bit because it will whiff otherwise. So it is hard if his kunai pressure is done right but there are definitely ways out of it even in the corner. I also think one of Takeda's main problems in the MU is Quan's Zoning. Sure Takeda has a teleport which makes it a little more difficult but one blocked teleport might as well mean death for him. I can maybe see this being 6-4 Takeda but I would be more inclined to say its 5-5.

The funny thing is while I think this MU chart overestimates Shirai Ryus effectiveness against Quan, I think it severely underestimates Ronin against Quan. Ronin's pressure is much better than SR and can actually frametrap quan. After much testing I dont really see how Quan can get out of it without taking the last hit of the f1 string after backdashing, which Takeda can easily set up again. In the corner it is pretty much an infinite. Ronin also doesnt get outzoned by Quan as bad as he can use his own EX projectile(which absorbs all other projectiles) or he can use reflect. SR can anti-zone with teleport but if Quan blocks it that could be Takeda's life, whereas a missed reflect is slightly less dangerous(although the Quan could EX trance in certain circumstances to punish). I dont really think Quan has 7-3 MUs against him up but I would put Ronin up there with Kobu Tanya given the fact that he can compete in footsies and zoning, and basically infinites Quan in the corner.

 

[Genei Jin]

can you explain the Special Forces Sonya match up and the Liu Kang Dragon Fire match up?

 

[Ragnarök Tyr]

@STB Shujinkydink Why do you place Metallic that high above Crystalline and After Shock?

 

[Immortal Kombat]

No but I can kind of see where he is coming from. So the issue is after f12 2+4(both hits) kunai Quan is out of d1 range which might make it seem like f1 is guaranteed. But Quan can actually D4 and it will low profile the F1. It should give enough hit advantage to back away unless the frame data is wrong. You can also NJP if you think he is going to do it but you actually have to delay it a little bit because it will whiff otherwise. So it is hard if his kunai pressure is done right but there are definitely ways out of it even in the corner. I also think one of Takeda's main problems in the MU is Quan's Zoning. Sure Takeda has a teleport which makes it a little more difficult but one blocked teleport might as well mean death for him. I can maybe see this being 6-4 Takeda but I would be more inclined to say its 5-5.

The funny thing is while I think this MU chart overestimates Shirai Ryus effectiveness against Quan, I think it severely underestimates Ronin against Quan. Ronin's pressure is much better than SR and can actually frametrap quan. After much testing I dont really see how Quan can get out of it without taking the last hit of the f1 string after backdashing, which Takeda can easily set up again. In the corner it is pretty much an infinite. Ronin also doesnt get outzoned by Quan as bad as he can use his own EX projectile(which absorbs all other projectiles) or he can use reflect. SR can anti-zone with teleport but if Quan blocks it that could be Takeda's life, whereas a missed reflect is slightly less dangerous(although the Quan could EX trance in certain circumstances to punish). I dont really think Quan has 7-3 MUs against him up but I would put Ronin up there with Kobu Tanya given the fact that he can compete in footsies and zoning, and basically infinites Quan in the corner.

The problem with most takeda players is they only think in terms of f1,2, 2+4.
The quan mu is one of the few mu's you can safely put down b2,1 kunai mixups without fear of retribution. Quan has zero zoning options against takeda now that air cyclone is only -6. If he wants to try to zone you he can but if your paying attention he shoudnt be able to. You have whips that go half way across the screen and a air move that can be safely thrown out at any time. Plus if you do get close to quan now, f1,2,2+4 string has zero gaps now. It's real easy to lock down quan at any part of the screen and make him have no options.
Edit: I mostly play lasher, which gives you a little further reach. Doesn't change the schematics of the mu much though. (I prefer the better, more reliable armor.) Plus the anti air whip move helps get out of some of Quans bat setups on knockdown.

 

[DrManhattan]

who is dink and why should we take his MU chart seriously? has he ever wow or placed in anything other than week one mkx?

 

[Immortal Kombat]

who is dink and why should we take his MU chart seriously? has he ever wow or placed in anything other than week one mkx?

You should just spare yourself and leave this thread now fool

 

[Immortal Kombat]

You should just spare yourself and leave this thread now fool

Edit: Hi p2w

 

[ArmedCalf]

I mean I'm here reading it and I'm reading certain things I see, and I still in no way think Imposter beats Summoner in any way shape or form. I don't know how it isn't even?

EDIT: Not that Imposter doesn't have dirt on Quan-Chi I know he does, but Quan has dirt on Shinnok as well

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Can someone explain why special forces sonya blade is free as fluff?

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

who is dink and why should we take his MU chart seriously? has he ever wow or placed in anything other than week one mkx?

Allow me to introduce myself. Shujinkydink. The Quanfather. Sultan of swag. Quan Chi loyalist and tournament player for 5 years. 4th at NWM, 17th at EVO, multiple Top 8s in ESL and keeping a consistent gatekeeper status worldwide. Im not the best player but im one of the most knowledgeable and passionate about my character and when people want quan experience, they look to me. But i see you joined this site in july of this year, so may i ask, who are you to be questioning my legacy, small child?

I mean I'm here reading it and I'm reading certain things I see, and I still in no way think Imposter beats Summoner in any way shape or form. I don't know how it isn't even?

EDIT: Not that Imposter doesn't have dirt on Quan-Chi I know he does, but Quan has dirt on Shinnok as well

Standing reset mostly. From my experience shinnok has safer options than quan does. Quan cant really zone either cause of tele. It could be 5-5, but i lean towards a slight disadvantage to Quan. We can play some though if you'd like to further flesh it out. This MU chart is continuously growing and changing.

 

[Diego de Souza Costa]

any update on the Kenjutsu MU ???....

 

[I GOT HANDS]

Holy shit, true to your reputation, this is hands down the most biased match-up thread to date.

Quan Chi goes EVEN with Jason? Righto.



Anyone who takes this list seriously has got to be brain damaged.



Just to shine some light on to the blatancy of one the agendas being pushed here: When you originally posted this match up list you had Grandmaster Sub third down on the "difficult match ups" list. Under 3 weeks later, you made the statement that we should discount Tom Brady's opinion about Quan, because Sub is one of the easier match ups in the game for Quan.

Hey pig and Tom both play characters quan beats pretty easily so they're the wrong guys to listen to.

When it was pointed out that your match-up chart says its one of his hardest, your response was:

Dude that MU chart is pre patch lol. A lot has changed

But when asked to explain exactly what it was that turned Grandmaster from one of his hardest match-ups to one of his easiest, in a patch where GM went unchanged, you had no response.

Now, you say this thread has been updated in the past couple of days... how come GM is still right there, third from the top in most difficult match ups? LOL

you will literally say anything to push your agenda if it helps your argument at the time


This thread is just the perfect summary of the Quan Chi community as whole.

who is dink and why should we take his MU chart seriously? has he ever wow or placed in anything other than week one mkx?

Short answer: you shouldn't. Taking this guy's word for anything MKX balancewise is one of the worst things you can do lol

 

[I GOT HANDS]

Also if you have such little knowledge that you ever truly thought Grandmaster was ever a bad match up for Quan, you really shouldn't be posting match-up lists or calling yourself the godfather of Quan lol

 

[Emperor Eevee]

Brawler has better pressure against quan. Hollywood has a shitty projectile, woo! Not worth the variation switch. shes not gonna win shooting one bullet at quan.

Just keep in mind these are my opinions. and sometimes peoples opinions suck and are bad. But I've played quan since day 1 release and this is what i believe is accurate and im willing to play anyone to further see more options i may not know of. Im not gonna sit here and say that my word is truth. Im trying to give an accurate representation from my experience playing the game. I always welcome games to change my mind, i need to know where my character excels and fails to play this game at the level I want to. Thanks

I'd honestly would go Brawler against Quan instead of Hollywood. While Brawler's pressure isn't that much better, the HKD is exactly want against Quan Chi. And so what if she doesn't have F34? F33, if i remember correctly, is -8 and if he blocks it he get's a D1(-9) and that's it. If he misses times it and you block, that's a free FlipKick punish.

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

Also if you have such little knowledge that you ever truly thought Grandmaster was ever a bad match up for Quan, you really shouldn't be posting match-up lists or calling yourself the godfather of Quan lol

Quan struggles in the corner. Sub has a fairly easy time getting him there. I aint saying its 7-3 or anything. I just give a slight advantage to sub. Thats all.

 

[ArmedCalf]

Standing reset mostly. From my experience shinnok has safer options than quan does. Quan cant really zone either cause of tele. It could be 5-5, but i lean towards a slight disadvantage to Quan. We can play some though if you'd like to further flesh it out. This MU chart is continuously growing and changing.

That'd be cool. Wouldn't mind figuring it out a bit.