Choosing a main/team

[CamRac]

Kenshi, Freddy, and kitana. they all have better footsies, projectiles, unbreakable combos, and armor. You could go for the rushdown Ermac, but sub-zero, sonya, cage, jax, kabal, rain, and reptile do that so much better. That's just my opinion though. Some or one of his strings also will not hit low hitbox characters, and
that's problematic in this game right now.

Hmmmm... Interesting. So you don't think he's viable at the highest level, or you just think he's harder to win with, in the end?

 

[quandaghost]

Just that he takes a good deal more effort there really is no character i don't see being viable in this game. I'm more for people being able to overcome the stats with skill

 

[Lumpymoomilk]

Why is no one playing Kitana anymore

Regarding Kitana use, I'm not a "fan"

 

[16 Bit]

Why is no one playing Kitana anymore

It is interesting that a character everyone says is top 5 has never had new players picking her up.

 

[quandaghost]

I play scorpion and there are at least four characters who do what my character does, except better. Just play with him if you like him, and no matter what other people say play him. I compete with scorpion, although I haven't been to a tournament in like 6 or 7 weeks, nor have I placed higher than 3rd I continue to play him. I think skill is something alot of people over look, and they just start using derp as crutches. At the end of the day your paying for your enjoyment right?

 

[CamRac]

I play scorpion and there are at least four characters who do what my character does, except better. Just play with him if you like him, and no matter what other people say play him. I compete with scorpion, although I haven't been to a tournament in like 6 or 7 weeks, nor have I placed higher than 3rd I continue to play him. I think skill is something alot of people over look, and they just start using derp as crutches. At the end of the day your paying for your enjoyment right?

Truth. I plan on doing just that -- thanks for the reminder, haha.

 

[Mr. Mileena]

It is interesting that a character everyone says is top 5 has never had new players picking her up.

This.

We shall see where the princess really lies on the tier list soon. :/

 

[Grolarbears]

Play Noob, breh.

 

[Espio]

Play who you enjoy the most out of your options listed.

 

[RampaginDragon]

I tend to play brutal badasses in fighting games, which means I want to play almost everyone now that I'm going hard in MK9. Obviously I have to whittle it down to a reasonable team, so I need some help... Here are my choices:

Raiden -- Played him since MK2, and I can't leave him hanging now! Easily my favorite character, aesthetically.
Ermac -- Played him in UMK3, and he still feels like the MK version of Darth Vader to me.
Jax -- Also played him in MK2 and UMK3. I definitely have some loyalty to the ol' gotcha grab master.
Sheeva -- Playing her entirely for fun, at the moment. Are there matchups she even absolutely kills in? No
Stryker -- Fun to play in general, but I think I like him for his roll grab, manly x-ray, and gun cancel/baton shenanigans the most.
Kenshi -- Just a really interesting concept as a character. He's probably the only true keep away/zoner in the game that I've enjoyed playing with so far.
Cyber-Sub -- I've always kind of had an affinity for Sub, but I'm not a huge fan of regular Sub in MK9. EDIT: Cyber Sub seems fun and underrated, so I'd like to maybe look into playing him more. Join our very small club!
Cyrax -- I love the concept of bomb traps, and I also just generally think Cyrax is cool.
Cage -- I like the way he moves in MK9, and I played him in MK2. I don't mind that he can auto-pilot. I'm sure once people learn to deal with his pressure, he'll go down in popularity again, too. We know how to deal with it. The problem is its one huge mix-up with massive priority. A good Cage will trap you till your bar is gone, unless you get lucky.
Nightwolf -- I'm not sure what to think about Nightwolf, as I can't tell what his playstyle in MK9 is yet. However, I really like him aesthetically, and I have to admit that the fact that he's underplayed draws me to him more. He is a defensive tank. IMO his best playstyle is to bank on your enemies mistakes and get pressure in, when you can and its safe.

Which brings me to my final question: Which of these characters are the most underused and which are the most overused? Which characters are the most loved by the community/who do people want to see win a major?

Most over used: Cyrax, Kabal, Jax, Johnny Cage, Kenshi is growing, Kung Lao. They are the most over-used fighters.

Most under used: Jade, Sheeva, Cyber Sub-Zero, Ermac, Sindel, Baraka and some others.

Most loved. This one may be a little tough as people have varied opinions on this. For instence, my FAVORITE Fighters in MK9 are Cyber Sub-Zero, Sonya and Smoke. And I don't mean favorite to play, but favorite characteristics. Though I do happen to main two of them Lucky me. But the majority most likely says: Sub-Zero, Scorp, Raiden. MOST loved.

I think I can speak for everyone when I say im tired of seeing Kabal, Jax, Smoke playing the biggest part in majors. IMO I would like to see Ermac win a major.

As far as my opinion for your team goes, I would say Ermac, Cage and Raiden would make a nice team. Ermac can zone and bank on mistakes, Cage is a ruchdown monster, that once he gets in, its most likely over and Raiden is a VERY versatile fighter. So is NW.

This is just my opinion based on charecter traits. And also how you seemed like you didn't like to use the super over used fighters. I feel the same way, not in a hipster style, but just to mix it up. I feel bored if I play as the more over used fighters. Sonya is the most over used fighter I can muster, and that comes from how much I love the fighter in aspects outside of gameplay as well.

And outside of Sheeva and maybe Stryker, all the fighters you listed are completely viable fighters.

And on the ending comment, do you play Xbox? If so, I'd love to play some time. RampaginDragon is my Tag.

 

[Altaire]

...Okay, I just noticed this: You mentioned that Kenshi is the only keepaway you've enjoyed playing so far, yet you also listed Ermac as a potential choice. I really need to stress that Ermac is a keepaway character. His offense is absolutely pitiful. He relies on using the threat of the push to limit options and create grab mixups. If you try to play Ermac as a rushdown character, you're going to get blown up.

Also, be warned that Ermac gets absolutely demolished by anyone who can punish the push on block from outside sweep distance, which is pretty much everyone with a fast advancing special. Ermac has a lot of problems with a LOT of characters, especially the top tier (namely Jax, Raiden, Cage, Kenshi, Reptile and Liu Kang). You really need to pick your battles with Ermac, and I say that as a longtime Ermac player.

Sent from my GT-S5830D using Tapatalk 2

 

[NKZero]

...Okay, I just noticed this: You mentioned that Kenshi is the only keepaway you've enjoyed playing so far, yet you also listed Ermac as a potential choice. I really need to stress that Ermac is a keepaway character. His offense is absolutely pitiful. He relies on using the threat of the push to limit options and create grab mixups. If you try to play Ermac as a rushdown character, you're going to get blown up.

Also, be warned that Ermac gets absolutely demolished by anyone who can punish the push on block from outside sweep distance, which is pretty much everyone with a fast advancing special. Ermac has a lot of problems with a LOT of characters, especially the top tier (namely Jax, Raiden, Cage, Kenshi, Reptile and Liu Kang). You really need to pick your battles with Ermac, and I say that as a longtime Ermac player.

Sent from my GT-S5830D using Tapatalk 2

I agree in that Ermac is not a rush down. I honestly don't think he's a keep-away character either. He has to operate in a certain range to win. More of a footsies character and punishing heavy with big damage. TKP is still effective at max range, and instant air blast is a brilliant footsies tool. Yeah his rushdown has holes (hence no rushdown lol) and he has too much of an average projectile to start full screen zoning. Incidently why d'you believe he struggles vs Kang? I agree with the rest but I dunno about Kang.

Also where d'you think Raiden should be placed in the tiers? I remember just before MLG Columbus (on Lair of Altaire) you proclaimed him no.1 in the game. Now perhaps you have changed your mind but d'you think he's near top tier? I really struggle to find a place to put him. So much variety regarding his placings it makes it difficult.

 

[CamRac]

*Shnipppp*

And on the ending comment, do you play Xbox? If so, I'd love to play some time. RampaginDragon is my Tag.

Very helpful post - thanks! After playing a session with Grolarbears at my house last night, I can say without a doubt that Raiden is my best character (once again, mainly because of old skool street fighter footsies and reads, haha), and Ermac is a close second, followed by Cage, NW, and maybe CSZ or Stryker. I'm going to train a bit with NW today though, as he reminds me the most of Honda's playstyle from SF (my main). But yeah, I'm not trying to be a hipster either - I'm glad you got that.

And unfortunately, I'm only on PSN -- I really appreciate the offer, though! :/

...Okay, I just noticed this: You mentioned that Kenshi is the only keepaway you've enjoyed playing so far, yet you also listed Ermac as a potential choice. I really need to stress that Ermac is a keepaway character. His offense is absolutely pitiful. He relies on using the threat of the push to limit options and create grab mixups. If you try to play Ermac as a rushdown character, you're going to get blown up.

Also, be warned that Ermac gets absolutely demolished by anyone who can punish the push on block from outside sweep distance, which is pretty much everyone with a fast advancing special. Ermac has a lot of problems with a LOT of characters, especially the top tier (namely Jax, Raiden, Cage, Kenshi, Reptile and Liu Kang). You really need to pick your battles with Ermac, and I say that as a longtime Ermac player.

Sent from my GT-S5830D using Tapatalk 2

Yeah, I mean, I was talking about true keep-away/zoning, as in purely that. To me, Ermac seems to operate somewhere in the long-mid range with, like you said, a bunch of grab mix-ups. Thus, I don't really put him on the same level as Kenshi and Freddy in the zoning department, and I don't put him on the same level as Cage and rushdown monsters. To be honest, I think I like Ermac the most just because he's so subtly bizarre/unique. It's hard to really place him in any one category alone.

Also where d'you think Raiden should be placed in the tiers? I remember just before MLG Columbus (on Lair of Altaire) you proclaimed him no.1 in the game. Now perhaps you have changed your mind but d'you think he's near top tier? I really struggle to find a place to put him. So much variety regarding his placings it makes it difficult.

I keep hearing that Raiden is a beast, and I can see it. My only question is why are so few people really maining him at a competitive level? Is he a solid character that doesn't rely on a bag of tricks, so he has to be played "perfectly" to win at high level with?

 

[NKZero]

I keep hearing that Raiden is a beast, and I can see it. My only question is why are so few people really maining him at a competitive level? Is he a solid character that doesn't rely on a bag of tricks, so he has to be played "perfectly" to win at high level with?

Well I hear the opposite which confuses me because I think he's such a great character. With Raiden it's always about reacting to your opponent. Teleport cannot be used every single time you feel like it. Use it to escape strings or pokes or the occasional mind game. Raiden's defensive qualities are excellent. He can turtle fairly well with a life lead. His B312 strings and 334 strings are interruptable but there's the mind game. You can teleport after the first two hits in either string and if the opponent counter-pokes he whiffs and you can punish. On that note, Raiden is one of the best whiff punishers in the game. Superman is fast and corner carries. F24 is a terrific string and F23 jails so you can choose to link in vicinity blast or not.

I don't think he has the tools like a Sonya, Kabal, Kenshi etc. but there is something about him that makes me think he is still a top calibre character. I just feel like if he is truly played at the highest level he will be very difficult to beat. I only think he has like 3 bad match-ups. You just have to be smart with him and make the right reads. Not very easy to play with. He does decent damage both mid-screen and in the corner. That's all I can think of.

Perhaps B W1zZ can shed more light on the character. Why do people underrate him and why do you think he's good? Also where would you place him on the tier list?

 

[OSpliffySmitheeyO]

Have you tried freddy yet?

 

[CamRac]

Have you tried freddy yet?

Actually, I did run a set with a friend last night using him. I felt like he fit me as a zoner way more so than Kenshi, and I even won the Freddy mirror match we played, officially making me the best Freddy in my city. XD

That being said, I'll be messing with him, but I don't think I'm going to main him. I had way more fun with Ermac last night, to be honest.

 

[CamRac]

Play who you enjoy the most out of your options listed.

Just fwiw, seeing some of your matches is why Stryker is even on my list of potentials. Good ish man -- maybe we can get a set in on PSN sometime further down the road?

 

[Altaire]

I agree in that Ermac is not a rush down. I honestly don't think he's a keep-away character either. He has to operate in a certain range to win. More of a footsies character and punishing heavy with big damage. TKP is still effective at max range, and instant air blast is a brilliant footsies tool. Yeah his rushdown has holes (hence no rushdown lol) and he has too much of an average projectile to start full screen zoning. Incidently why d'you believe he struggles vs Kang? I agree with the rest but I dunno about Kang.

Also where d'you think Raiden should be placed in the tiers? I remember just before MLG Columbus (on Lair of Altaire) you proclaimed him no.1 in the game. Now perhaps you have changed your mind but d'you think he's near top tier? I really struggle to find a place to put him. So much variety regarding his placings it makes it difficult.

Ermac is still more of a zoner. He ends up getting most of his damage at sweep distance because he can create a mixup between push and dash in throw (there are other options, but this is the core mixup), but he still wants to be as far away from his opponent as possible. When I play characters like Lao and Kabal, I spend most of my time at the very tip of push range, and sometimes further. Ermac's zoning revolves around using fireballs to create frame advantage by slowing your opponent's movement, using the threat of the push to prevent your opponent from just D1ing/D3ing under fireballs or jumping over them to advance. While it's possible to duck or jump his fireballs, you're just giving Ermac a free push if you try to do either from within push range. This, in effect, gives Ermac more Street Fighter-like zoning, because like an SF character, you can't just go over or under his zoning; if you try jumping over Sagat's zoning, you just eat a tiger knee and get blown up. Ermac uses the threat of the push to the same end.

I still have Raiden in S tier. My top five, as of right now, is Kabal > Raiden > Cyrax > Kenshi > Sonya, but only because more and more of Kabal's 5-5 matchups are turning into 6-4 matchups. While I feel Raiden has no bad matchups whatsoever, I'm honestly starting to feel the same is true of Kabal as well, and Kabal has many more 6-4 matchups than Raiden does. Most of Raiden's matches are 5-5, and most of his favorable matchups are against low tier characters anyhow (Sheeva, Jade, Sindel, Baraka, Sub, Noob, Stryker, and so on). He IS, however, at advantage against several solid characters, including Skarlet, Cyrax, Mileena, Kitana and (to an extent) Freddy. I think he may also be a solid answer to Kenshi, though I need more experience in the matchup before I make any informed decisions.

To this day, Raiden's only REAL weakness is a gigantic hitbox, much like Kenshi and Freddy. If those characters are any indication, that's really not the end of the world, because it sure as shit isn't keeping them from being top tier.

 

[NKZero]

Ermac is still more of a zoner. He ends up getting most of his damage at sweep distance because he can create a mixup between push and dash in throw (there are other options, but this is the core mixup), but he still wants to be as far away from his opponent as possible. When I play characters like Lao and Kabal, I spend most of my time at the very tip of push range, and sometimes further. Ermac's zoning revolves around using fireballs to create frame advantage by slowing your opponent's movement, using the threat of the push to prevent your opponent from just D1ing/D3ing under fireballs or jumping over them to advance. While it's possible to duck or jump his fireballs, you're just giving Ermac a free push if you try to do either from within push range. This, in effect, gives Ermac more Street Fighter-like zoning, because like an SF character, you can't just go over or under his zoning; if you try jumping over Sagat's zoning, you just eat a tiger knee and get blown up. Ermac uses the threat of the push to the same end.

I still have Raiden in S tier. My top five, as of right now, is Kabal > Raiden > Cyrax > Kenshi > Sonya, but only because more and more of Kabal's 5-5 matchups are turning into 6-4 matchups. While I feel Raiden has no bad matchups whatsoever, I'm honestly starting to feel the same is true of Kabal as well, and Kabal has many more 6-4 matchups than Raiden does. Most of Raiden's matches are 5-5, and most of his favorable matchups are against low tier characters anyhow (Sheeva, Jade, Sindel, Baraka, Sub, Noob, Stryker, and so on). He IS, however, at advantage against several solid characters, including Skarlet, Cyrax, Mileena, Kitana and (to an extent) Freddy. I think he may also be a solid answer to Kenshi, though I need more experience in the matchup before I make any informed decisions.

To this day, Raiden's only REAL weakness is a gigantic hitbox, much like Kenshi and Freddy. If those characters are any indication, that's really not the end of the world, because it sure as shit isn't keeping them from being top tier.

D'you not think he loses to Sonya, Kabal or Cyber Sub? I feel those are his bad match-ups tbh though I know you play Cyber Sub so you probably know more about that match-up than I do. Other than few (or no) bad match-ups, what makes Raiden so good? He seems to have less tools than your average top tier character i.e. Kabal, Kenshi etc.

 

[Espio]

Just fwiw, seeing some of your matches is why Stryker is even on my list of potentials. Good ish man -- maybe we can get a set in on PSN sometime further down the road?

For real? I never thought I'd inspire someone to take an interest in a character. That makes me really happy to hear, thanks for your kind words. You can add me on PSN, I'll gladly play anyone, my name is same as here.

Stryker's a solid character imo, decent zoning, decent pressure, he's not terrible like many seem to think.

 

[b0mb_Trak_Kovacz]

Tap into your inner love for mid/low-tier characters, and go for gold, my friend. I would really like to see some diversity when I go to tournaments, so take that Ermac/NW/CSZ team. Go hard in the paint with them, and I think naturally you'll see yourself become a people's champion.

Playing Raiden is like playing Chun Li in 3S. It is the same reaction everytime. 'Reeeeeally? Come on, man. Play someone else.' After reading a few threads or two about how people are tired of seeing Jax, I've started to hit the books and now I'm considering my team options.

 

[Altaire]

D'you not think he loses to Sonya, Kabal or Cyber Sub? I feel those are his bad match-ups tbh though I know you play Cyber Sub so you probably know more about that match-up than I do. Other than few (or no) bad match-ups, what makes Raiden so good? He seems to have less tools than your average top tier character i.e. Kabal, Kenshi etc.

People think Raiden loses to Cyber Sub for the silliest goddamn reasons, don't listen to a word you've heard about that matchup. I've played both sides of that matchup extensively, both with my Cyber Sub against Perfect Legend's Raiden, and my Raiden against J360's Cyber Sub. I might've played him against Usedforglue a couple times as well, I can't remember.

Raiden vs. Cyber Sub is strictly a 5-5. Most people seem to think it's in Cyber Sub's favor because 1) he can parry in between two of Raiden's strings and 2) he can punish the teleport with instant air divekick. Well, the problem with both of these concepts is 1) Raiden has no fucking reason to be throwing those strings out and 2) Raiden can punish any blocked divekick with a superman, 100% of the time, no matter how low on the hitbox it connects. When I play PL's Raiden, I CANNOT divekick him under any circumstances, unless it's in reaction to a fireball. I get blown up for trying to do it any other time.

Honestly, I don't even know where this idea stems from. Raiden should never be throwing out 3 3 4 unless it's to punish on block, and he should never be throwing out B3 1 2 unless it's to whiff punish or counter-poke. As for the instant air divekick idea, holy shit, has anyone actually TRIED this against a decent Raiden player? Like, if I play a Cyber Sub with my Raiden, I welcome them to try this, because I promise you I'll take them for free if they do. First off, an instant air divekick is going to come out in about 8 or 9 frames at best; that's not any better than Kenshi's charge, Lao's 2 1, Sonya's 1 1 4 or Setktor's 1 2 B1. Hell, Cyber Sub's own 1 1 string is 9 frames. On top of that, if Raiden just teleports into block, there's a very good chance the divekick will just get blocked and subsequently blown up. Also, if the divekick fails to autocorrect, he can blow you up with a superman. The only other edge Cyber Sub has over Raiden is that Cyber Sub can parry all of Raiden's combo starters, but if Raiden baits a parry, he can punish it on reaction with a superman, or a V blast into safe jump. Neither one can be parried for whatever reason. In fact, if you're really quick and you're really looking for it, you can EX shocker to punish a parry for full combos. The irony is that of all the Raidens I've ever played, Justin Wong played the matchup best, and he'd never played a Cyber Sub before in his life.

Sonya and Kabal really aren't bad matchups at all. If Sonya whiffs a D4 or cartwheel in open space, Raiden can superman to beat either, and he can also whiff punish a cartwheel with B3 1 2 for full combos, if he can bait it. The teleport is a pretty solid answer to a lot of what makes Sonya so dumb, and the fact that he can punish her D4 by playing footsies to make it whiff is a huge asset. 5-5 matchup, IMO. The same is also true of Kabal. As far back as it may be, I feel Maxter vs. Erik Warda from Season's Beatings does a great job of illustrating why. There's really nothing Kabal can do that Raiden can't use the teleport to get around, so he just needs to use it patiently to get in and start his offense. Again, I think this is a 5-5.

Raiden has all the tools necessary to beat any character in the game. He has a solid poke tool via F2 3 and F2 4, he has a great whiff punisher via B3 1 2 (which can also be used to counter-poke after a blocked D3), and whatever the B3 1 2 won't catch, superman will. Teleport is pretty much the greatest counter-zoning and counter-poking option in the entire game, and just having it puts him at advantage against most of the cast. Against many characters, Raiden can honestly just sit at fullscreen once he has a life lead, and his opponent is forced to give chase; in the case of someone like Kenshi, Kitana, Mileena or Freddy, they can get blown up for attempting to zone him. Hell, even Kabal gets knicked by this. Bottom line: Raiden has everything he'd ever need to compete at the highest level. He's just all-around solid.

 

[Grolarbears]

Raiden has all the tools necessary to beat any character in the game. He has a solid poke tool via F2 3 and F2 4, he has a ishing certain strings as well. great whiff punisher via B3 1 2 (which can also be used to counter-poke after a blocked D3), and whatever the B3 1 2 won't catch, superman will. Teleport is pretty much the greatest counter-zoning and counter-poking option in the entire game, and just having it puts him at advantage against most of the cast. Against many characters, Raiden can honestly just sit at fullscreen once he has a life lead, and his opponent is forced to give chase; in the case of someone like Kenshi, Kitana, Mileena or Freddy, they can get blown up for attempting to zone him. Hell, even Kabal gets knicked by this. Bottom line: Raiden has everything he'd ever need to compete at the highest level. He's just all-around solid.

All of that was very interesting Altaire, and I appreciate the knowledge, but I have one question (and for the record I have just started playing Raiden even vaguely): What makes F2 3 and F2 4 so good in peoples' eyes? I hear it's pretty much his best string, but I don't really see it. F2's hitbox just seems so short as opposed to B3. It seems like if you were into range to play footsies if you tried it, you would just get poked out of it or whiff punished. I have a feeling I just don't know how to use it so I have little faith in it, but I'm scrubby with Raiden anyway. haha. If you wouldn't mind, could you explain this to me?

 

[CamRac]

For real? I never thought I'd inspire someone to take an interest in a character. That makes me really happy to hear, thanks for your kind words. You can add me on PSN, I'll gladly play anyone, my name is same as here.

Stryker's a solid character imo, decent zoning, decent pressure, he's not terrible like many seem to think.

Yeah man! Giving Osirun the flashlight treatment in your match with him this weekend was hype fosho. I definitely liked what I saw. I'm going to give Stryker a legitimate run tonight along with NW and see what happens.

Tap into your inner love for mid/low-tier characters, and go for gold, my friend. I would really like to see some diversity when I go to tournaments, so take that Ermac/NW/CSZ team. Go hard in the paint with them, and I think naturally you'll see yourself become a people's champion.

Playing Raiden is like playing Chun Li in 3S. It is the same reaction everytime. 'Reeeeeally? Come on, man. Play someone else.' After reading a few threads or two about how people are tired of seeing Jax, I've started to hit the books and now I'm considering my team options.

Oh, you know me, I've already started the tapping process, lol. The thing is, I'd play Raiden even if he was bottom tier, so I think he's here to stay on my "team." It's looking like a battle between Ermac, NW, CSZ, Stryker, and Cage for my other chars.

 

[Altaire]

All of that was very interesting Altaire, and I appreciate the knowledge, but I have one question (and for the record I have just started playing Raiden even vaguely): What makes F2 3 and F2 4 so good in peoples' eyes? I hear it's pretty much his best string, but I don't really see it. F2's hitbox just seems so short as opposed to B3. It seems like if you were into range to play footsies if you tried it, you would just get poked out of it or whiff punished. I have a feeling I just don't know how to use it so I have little faith in it, but I'm scrubby with Raiden anyway. haha. If you wouldn't mind, could you explain this to me?

F2 4 is his go-to combo starter because it's his best poke tool. It's 12 frames, hits mid, and has a lot of priority for decent reach. B3 1 2 is slow, gets blown up really badly on whiff and can be interrupted by a large portion of the cast. You can hit confirm into superman for 24% damage on hit (which, while not amazing, is enough). It's safe on block with a bit of pushback as well, which makes it useful in his footsie game.

F2 3 is just good because if your opponent is in stand block, it jails into a V blast. You can create a mixup between F2 3 V blast and F2 3 throw, or just a blockstring mixup between F2 3, F2 3 V blast. The V blast is 0 on block and leads to a safe jump on hit, so you get an attack and grab mixup with JIP throw and JIP F2 3. If the JIP F2 3 is blocked, you can confirm into a V blast or throw to create another attack and grab mixup, which forces your opponent to guess twice. On hit, F2 3 can be linked into EX shocker (the normal shocker will whiff) for a full combo, which caps out at 35% if I'm not mistaken. While that seems a tad silly when you consider that he gets 37% meterless off 3 3 4, F2 3 is a MUCH more practical combo starter, so it's worth the tradeoff.