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Characters Screwed by 9/30 Patch

Ray'sGoodLiquor

I don't care I'm not a competitive player anymore
When you’re adding 20+ variations to a game, some of them will be good, some of them will be ‘wait and see’, and some of them will not.
I would totally agree with you if we weren't talking about MK11. This is the first in the line of NRS games that hasn't really had a "wait and see" period. I'll spare you my speculation as to why that is, but I can't think of a single instance where any significant tech went undiscovered for more than a few weeks. Compare that to previous titles. Everybody used to hold their breath until EVO so all the secret tech would leak out, but it seems like what we knew going into EVO was about the same was what we knew coming out. Maybe there's some extra dimension of depth we're all not seeing, but NRS hasn't really elluded to anything like that. I must say it's really convenient to spend a few days labbing a character and there being a really good chance you've found everything there is to find, but I can't decide if that helps or hurts this game's entertainment value.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
I would totally agree with you if we weren't talking about MK11. This is the first in the line of NRS games that hasn't really had a "wait and see" period. I'll spare you my speculation as to why that is, but I can't think of a single instance where any significant tech went undiscovered for more than a few weeks. Compare that to previous titles. Everybody used to hold their breath until EVO so all the secret tech would leak out, but it seems like what we knew going into EVO was about the same was what we knew coming out. Maybe there's some extra dimension of depth we're all not seeing, but NRS hasn't really elluded to anything like that. I must say it's really convenient to spend a few days labbing a character and there being a really good chance you've found everything there is to find, but I can't decide if that helps or hurts this game's entertainment value.
That’s a fair viewpoint — but it hasn’t even been a few weeks yet; it’s been precisely 3-4 days :)

I don’t expect it to take a year, but you’d hope people would at least wait a month or so (or come on, 2 weeks minimum) before they declare every 3rd varation useless in every MU.

I believe that over the coming month, people will find creative uses for some of the unsung 3rd variations and we’ll be seeing that play out in tournament.

Remember when no one played Yaas Queen because it sucked? Yeah.
 

Ray'sGoodLiquor

I don't care I'm not a competitive player anymore
That’s a fair viewpoint — but it hasn’t even been a few weeks yet; it’s been precisely 3-4 days :)

I don’t expect it to take a year, but you’d hope people would at least wait a month or so (or come on, 2 weeks minimum) before they declare every 3rd varation useless in every MU.

I believe that over the coming month, people will find creative uses for some of the unsung 3rd variations and we’ll be seeing that play out in tournament.

Remember when no one played Yaas Queen because it sucked? Yeah.
I'm not talking about the patch specifically. I play on PC and god knows when I'll get to play it. I try not to bitch too much until I've actually played what I'm bitching about. It's more of a lifespan argument for the game that was speculated about, but not truly realized until EVO was over. Most of the combo's and setups I do with the characters I play were discovered either within 3 weeks of the games launch, or a week after a gameplay altering patch. I think they may be hamstringing the game to make it easier to control from a developer perspective.
 

Gooberking

FGC Cannon Fodder
What I've learned from the internet is that all characters are now bottom 5 and totally unviable. Math facts.

The exceptions are Geras who can't die, and Terminator because characters you've seen but never played are always top tier. I'm 103.456% sure he will also be bottom 5 like everyone else on the 8th.

Raiden is the worst character in the game. He is so bad in this game that he is retroactively the worst in IJ2 and MKX. More than that, he is actually like bottom -7, being worse than all unreleased characters; including those in KP2 which doesn't even exist.

That's -7. More math facts. You all know you can't cheat math.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
I'm not talking about the patch specifically. I play on PC and god knows when I'll get to play it. I try not to bitch too much until I've actually played what I'm bitching about. It's more of a lifespan argument for the game that was speculated about, but not truly realized until EVO was over. Most of the combo's and setups I do with the characters I play were discovered either within 3 weeks of the games launch, or a week after a gameplay altering patch. I think they may be hamstringing the game to make it easier to control from a developer perspective.
I was specifically talking about this patch, though. It hasn't even been a week.
 
What I've learned from the internet is that all characters are now bottom 5 and totally unviable. Math facts.

The exceptions are Geras who can't die, and Terminator because characters you've seen but never played are always top tier. I'm 103.456% sure he will also be bottom 5 like everyone else on the 8th.

Raiden is the worst character in the game. He is so bad in this game that he is retroactively the worst in IJ2 and MKX. More than that, he is actually like bottom -7, being worse than all unreleased characters; including those in KP2 which doesn't even exist.

That's -7. More math facts. You all know you can't cheat math.
My sincerest thanks for posting this.
 

Mandolore1123

Man of Science Who Wields the Living Lightning
What I've learned from the internet is that all characters are now bottom 5 and totally unviable. Math facts.

The exceptions are Geras who can't die, and Terminator because characters you've seen but never played are always top tier. I'm 103.456% sure he will also be bottom 5 like everyone else on the 8th.

Raiden is the worst character in the game. He is so bad in this game that he is retroactively the worst in IJ2 and MKX. More than that, he is actually like bottom -7, being worse than all unreleased characters; including those in KP2 which doesn't even exist.

That's -7. More math facts. You all know you can't cheat math.
Nah man. You can’t argue with those Raiden experts. They’ve gotten to God rank on KL AND played the character since day one. Can’t you see they are only trying to make the character vIaBLe?
 

FreshFromTheDeli

FrostFromTheDeli
I'm happy with Kotal buffs.

However, it's a missed opportunity to give him Delay Disc Throw instead of Sun Beam Projectile in a variation that has 2 totems in it. It has a Krushing Blow tied to it for stacking 3 totems.
 

craftycheese

I tried to throw a yo-yo away. It was impossible.
What I've learned from the internet is that all characters are now bottom 5 and totally unviable. Math facts.

The exceptions are Geras who can't die, and Terminator because characters you've seen but never played are always top tier. I'm 103.456% sure he will also be bottom 5 like everyone else on the 8th.

Raiden is the worst character in the game. He is so bad in this game that he is retroactively the worst in IJ2 and MKX. More than that, he is actually like bottom -7, being worse than all unreleased characters; including those in KP2 which doesn't even exist.

That's -7. More math facts. You all know you can't cheat math.
Lol I think we've learned kinda the same thing from the internet.... Nobody knows what they're talking about
 

MKF30

Fujin and Ermac for MK 11
Obviously, not every character will be winners but that doesn't mean they can't buff the weaker characters that obviously need it. The game still has lots of life left in it so MK 11 has that in it's favor.
 

Wigy

There it is...
Good lord just because your favorite character is below average does not mean the developers are incompetent. The game has 27 characters and 81 variations. They're not all gonna be winners
I can get this but let's look at raiden and kollector. Both under average characters but tournament usage and community consensus and they add variations to them that are objectively buns.

Kollectors relic lure literally serves no purpose whatsoever, it leads to less damage and can be rolled out immediately in relation to chakram and you can't even cash out with it and burn two bars cause it does less damage than 443 after a chakram.

Then you look at the fact that chakram takes two slots and is one impractical KB away from being a cosmetic change from bola that can't be cancelled.

Then you add that you're giving up a command grab, teleport and up mace which has its uses.

That is objectively incompetent from them. The variation serves absolutely no purpose in comparison to his other ones which are already low tier.

This is probably the worst offender. There are various examples of this through the cast. The added salt in the wound is how long these garbage changes slug their way into the game.

Frost I wasn't happy with the changes at all, I think they made a bunch of unnecessary nerfs but at least it serves a proper purpose.
 
Good lord just because your favorite character is below average does not mean the developers are incompetent. The game has 27 characters and 81 variations. They're not all gonna be winners
Squander(ed) Kollector seems to have been specifically tuned to not win at all.

Not even getting into the obvious and numerous WQ Toss nerfs but Relic Lure hasn't been changed at all. Like AT ALL, hell you can still throw the poor bastard because of that big ass gap on block so even if you don't know how to poke him out of it, you don't really have to.

And like someone else said screw wasting a bar on that to launch when even broke ass Chakram is a better way to lead into a combo.
 
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craftycheese

I tried to throw a yo-yo away. It was impossible.
There was some character that I got matched up with in KL that was being a bit of a douche, doing some cocky stuff in the character select screen. So I exited the game before our matches even started. So I got screwed out of points post patch and so did that guy.
 
I honestly am shocked people are complaining about the balance. This game is way more balanced than any of the previous games. Maybe MKX was more balanced in the final patch, but that didn't come out until 1.5 years. And we still had to go through bouts of insane domination by Tanya and Alien. And then I don't think they ever got the balance right in I2 considering there was always an insane character (Deadshot, fate, starfire,) that countered half the cast.
 

MKF30

Fujin and Ermac for MK 11
@ untitledsixx I disagree about this game being "better balanced" than other NRS games....that's why people use the same OP characters in KL over and over and over...
 

craftycheese

I tried to throw a yo-yo away. It was impossible.
I think that tarkatan hanging around has gotten screwed. I've definitely thrown him more since this patch drop. All he wants to do is eat and watch a fight