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Match-up Discussion Catwoman Matchup Discussion

16 Bit

Mash d+1~Cat Claws
NetherRealm Studios
She makes nw fear j2 because if he does a preemptive j2 and she crouches its full combo punish. She can easily forward dash to make ground pound whiff. Even if u block catdash full screen u cant punish and nows shes up close to you exactly where she wants to be. If u do a ground pound and she does j2 it full combo punishes nw. Off of a j2 if nw anti airs he doesnt get nearly as much damage as catwoman gets fromt a whiffed ground pound and then she gets a 50/50 after that knockdown into even more damage. NW outfootsies but a lot of his stuff whiffs on her wakeup flip kick whiffs for a full punish where as all nw gets by punishing her wakeups is staff spin

If she's crouching looking for a jump 2 then it's your cue to continue ground pound or go in with standing 2. This is screen control. Just because she has an option to get past the zoning doesn't mean it isn't good. Everything can be jumped or ducked or something. The point is she has to make the read and he gets to play his game because of it.

If you block a Cat Dash full screen you can't punish it but she's still negative. She isn't "in where she wants to be". Quite the opposite, you get your offense going.

She doesn't get a free 50/50 if you knock NW down. While his wakeup attacks are not fully invincible he can vary the timing with delayed wakeup so that she cannot stuff all of them with her 50/50. On the other hand Nightwing actually can if she doesn't have trait.

The important moves we're talking about don't whiff.

Who says Nightwing only gets a staff spin for punishing her wakeups? Cat Dash and Cat Claws have poor invincibility. You can just straight up do whatever you want. You should be stuffing her wakeups with standing 2 or Ground Pound.
 

oP Twist

Unknown Nightwing
If she's crouching looking for a jump 2 then it's your cue to continue ground pound or go in with standing 2. This is screen control. Just because she has an option to get past the zoning doesn't mean it isn't good. Everything can be jumped or ducked or something. The point is she has to make the read and he gets to play his game because of it.

If you block a Cat Dash full screen you can't punish it but she's still negative. She isn't "in where she wants to be". Quite the opposite, you get your offense going.

She doesn't get a free 50/50 if you knock NW down. While his wakeup attacks are not fully invincible he can vary the timing with delayed wakeup so that she cannot stuff all of them with her 50/50. On the other hand Nightwing actually can if she doesn't have trait.

The important moves we're talking about don't whiff.

Who says Nightwing only gets a staff spin for punishing her wakeups? Cat Dash and Cat Claws have poor invincibility. You can just straight up do whatever you want. You should be stuffing her wakeups with standing 2 or Ground Pound.
Mb catdash on wakeup goes right through gp. Catdash online does not have poor invincibility and same goes for staff spin. Nw staff does not have nearly as good oki as catwoman does. Catwoman can catdash to beat most wakeups go overhead go low she has more options after knockdown than nw staff. If nw wakesup with staff spin, block and now u can apply ur pressure. You can react to ground pound then jump and punish. Catwoman would rather be in, being pressured by staff spin and s2 than be full screen getting zoned? you dont have to wakeup on nw staff all he has is groundpound for low and s2 all catwoman has to do is block low and react to s2 and s2 is negative on block so she can apply pressure.
 

16 Bit

Mash d+1~Cat Claws
NetherRealm Studios
Mb catdash on wakeup goes right through gp. Catdash online does not have poor invincibility and same goes for staff spin. Nw staff does not have nearly as good oki as catwoman does. Catwoman can catdash to beat most wakeups go overhead go low she has more options after knockdown than nw staff. If nw wakesup with staff spin, block and now u can apply ur pressure. You can react to ground pound then jump and punish. Catwoman would rather be in, being pressured by staff spin and s2 than be full screen getting zoned? you dont have to wakeup on nw staff all he has is groundpound for low and s2 all catwoman has to do is block low and react to s2 and s2 is negative on block so she can apply pressure.

MB Cat Dash on wakeup has the same properties as regular Cat Dash, the MB part won't have time to come out if you are solid on stuffing the wakeup. I don't care about online.
 

16 Bit

Mash d+1~Cat Claws
NetherRealm Studios
Half the MLG top 8 I know for a fact says they cannot react to standing 2 vs. Ground Pound. Not much else to say. As always, if the NW community thinks this mixup sucks then so be it.
 

oP Twist

Unknown Nightwing
Half the MLG top 8 I know for a fact says they cannot react to standing 2 vs. Ground Pound. Not much else to say. As always, if the NW community thinks this mixup sucks then so be it.
U can react to a 22 frame s2 if people can react to gl's f3 thats 18 frames
 

oP Twist

Unknown Nightwing
MB Cat Dash on wakeup has the same properties as regular Cat Dash, the MB part won't have time to come out if you are solid on stuffing the wakeup. I don't care about online.
I play online which makes the timing for stuffing her catdash difficult and cw's 1f2 stuffs nw's wakeups free
 

16 Bit

Mash d+1~Cat Claws
NetherRealm Studios
I play online which makes the timing for stuffing her catdash difficult and cw's 1f2 stuffs nw's wakeups free

I am skeptical you can use 1,f+2 to stuff all versions of his wakeups, between staff, delayed staff, grayson and delayed grayson. Even if you can that's whatever. She is still stopping her normal mixups to respect the wakeup. If she reads wakeup and doesn't want to do a 50/50 because of it she'd be better off doing a jump back setup.
 
U can react to a 22 frame s2 if people can react to gl's f3 thats 18 frames
I don't think they are reacting to the 18F overhead. There's a good chance they are blocking low by default and then switch to high guard after a set timing in their head which would block both the low and the overhead had they been done the very first second they can.
 

KC H0oKsw0rds

iK A B A L
Leave him be man. Just another salty Dick player because the Dick community has no one to rep him in top 8s. They think he sucks so they come to various top 10 char threads i.e. CW to "discuss" how broken they are against Dick and only Dick...
 

Ra Helios

Omnipotent God-like Selina Kyle Player
I would like to here this from @GGA 16 Bit and @EMPR_MURK .

I would like to here this from the NightWing community and the Catwoman community that believe Night Wing beat Cat-woman.

I personally believe its a 5-5. I play emperor murk and we basically go even. Even!!!

I don't see why cat-woman struggle in this Mu personally.

I played macro that believe Its a 6-4 and I made him believe its a 5-5.

I believe you have to play smart in the Mu.

Plus in staff Cat-woman can stuff NightWing wake ups except staff spin.


I would like to here your thoughts
 

Braindead

I want Kronika to step on my face
I find this whole "I can react to etc. etc. etc." nonsense hilarious. As I've stated in the past, people could barely even react to Mileena's U+4 by the end of the MK era, you INJ players must have some insane reactions.
Who can't react to Mileena's U4?!
I don't know man, I can react to WoWo's 33 vs B2 online... The animation is so obvious.. I don't know.
You guys make me doubt myself :S
 

KC H0oKsw0rds

iK A B A L
FTR you don't "react" to u4, you fuzzy guard all day. My tv at home has like 1 second lag in online MK and I can block u4 every time. Just sayin Mileena has no 50/50s.
 

xWildx

What a day. What a lovely day.
FTR you don't "react" to u4, you fuzzy guard all day. My tv at home has like 1 second lag in online MK and I can block u4 every time. Just sayin Mileena has no 50/50s.
Of course Mileena has no true 50/50's, that's why we throw a million times. And U+4 is like 28 frames, you shouldn't have to "fuzzy" that.
 

KC H0oKsw0rds

iK A B A L
Uh yes you do. Why would you try to block everything to the frame when you can just option select block everything mileena does? My original point was that it's quite an assumption to say "people can barely react to her u4 by the end of MKs life" which i think is a load of crap if you're playing any competent player. Mileena is simply not a good example of a "difficult to block" character to compare with the cast of injustice.
 

KC H0oKsw0rds

iK A B A L
.

B3 is 21f. isn't ex roll like 19. I could be wrong. Its a super unsafe mix up though
Also this. Where's the mix up?
Jump in b3? Sure, hits low
Jump in EXroll? Wtf? No one does this. Jump into special does not combo in MK. And u4 on block is not plus enough to grant you these options either.
 

xWildx

What a day. What a lovely day.
Uh yes you do. Why would you try to block everything to the frame when you can just option select block everything mileena does? My original point was that it's quite an assumption to say "people can barely react to her u4 by the end of MKs life" which i think is a load of crap if you're playing any competent player. Mileena is simply not a good example of a "difficult to block" character to compare with the cast of injustice.
That's the point. She's NOT a difficult character to block, yet in countless tournaments you see people get nailed by jump in U+4's. Further, most people who managed to armor through or standing punish her U+4 generally did so on a read and that was exposed by mixing in her 234 string which punished the read.

My point, she's not hard and people still struggled. INJ is quicker, yet people say it's easy to react. Doesn't make sense to me.