Blue Beetle General Discussion Thread

[|Phantom|]

His trait is practically worthless for 111.... You can combo it unless your basically in normal 111 range anyways. His trait is honestly really bad in general. I don't see the advantage of slightly more range that sometimes doesn't even matter for strings at the cost of your projectile

Apologies for any spelling errors (typing on my phone)

The initial 111 is not done in trait (I switched while MB blade was going) I do this because the dash over crossup will whiff if BB is not in trait as you have to press the button pretty late to wait for him to turn around. Also, I kept trait out after the second MB blades because the 21 1+2 string leaves you within one step of BB's max B2 range.

Not saying you are wrong (we agree that his trait is meh) I was simply just trying to find a use for it lol

 

[ATL Jones Bro3]

Apologies for any spelling errors (typing on my phone)

The initial 111 is not done in trait (I switched while MB blade was going) I do this because the dash over crossup will whiff if BB is not in trait as you have to press the button pretty late to wait for him to turn around. Also, I kept trait out after the second MB blades because the 21 1+2 string leaves you within one step of BB's max B2 range.

Not saying you are wrong (we agree that his trait is meh) I was simply just trying to find a use for it lol

I wasn't referring to your video sorry if I wasn't clear. Just in general. There's not really much of a use for his trait aside from certain combo extensions or specific set ups I feel like.

 

[|Phantom|]

I wasn't referring to your video sorry if I wasn't clear. Just in general. There's not really much of a use for his trait aside from certain combo extensions or specific set ups I feel like.

No worries;

And yeah, I pretty much agree with that...
I would like to see a potential dmg buff to his trait. I realize that he gets some dmg added to some specials/ strings.

I guess I would just like something a bit more substantial... Then again, I am sure everyone wants the same for their respective character

 

[Raynex]

His trait is practically worthless for 111.... You can combo it unless your basically in normal 111 range anyways. His trait is honestly really bad in general. I don't see the advantage of slightly more range that sometimes doesn't even matter for strings at the cost of your projectile

After watching combo breaker and seeing other characters I've noticing his weaknesses too. The best thing about trait is:

- Range increase allows j.1 confirms from ranges that weren't possible before. Also, airdash forward j.1 punishes most fireballs free
- Range increase allows F23 > B3 or F3 to combo very easily, so you get 300+ damage meterless off a jump-in
- Range increase allows you to pressure with B2 (overhead) from ridiculous ranges

But all in all it isn't even that good. I'm convinced he's mid-tier now. I use stronger characters that I don't play and work half as hard as I do with Beetle..and I'm doing better. It sucks

I don't think anyone else has done anything with these particular stings and knockdowns yet..

I used a normal BnB starter, but ended in a different knockdown. I then used instant air flight, while in trait to cross them up and finished with the 21 1+2 string to keep them close while you still have trait on.
I'm sure that you could change it up based on the range you want your opponent (depending on if you have trait or not) at least for the second knockdown. Not sure how viable it is. Just wanted to see if anyone could take it further.

132 1+2 ender doesn't give you enough advantage to truly do that mix-up you were doing. You see how long the training dummy was standing there while you zipped over his head/ No one would stand there that long without doing a wake-up, backdash, jump, attack, etc. You need a knockdown with more advantage. Try using F2 / D3 / 132 (without the stab ender) and then do that mix-up. They allow you to act way sooner because they give you more frame advantage.

 

[JustinXavier21]

The Trait discussion is an interesting one - the more I play BB, the more I find myself using it. The differences are subtle, but they're winning me games that I'd otherwise be losing...D1~DF1 combos at max range to allow punishes on things he can't usually deal with and it makes his J1 and D2 a lot better. TBF3 has infinite matchup specific uses in catching stuff that you otherwise just won't (can go through Atroc shield, can use to punish ducked projectiles at range etc...).

As for the pressure issues, I agree. Ending things in BF3 or 211+2 just leads to creating more work for yourself later - only B1 (corner) or 13Fly / 132 (midscreen) seems to do the trick which ends up really killing your damage sometimes.

Currently playing him as a total hybrid character with his Cheerios to build meter and pressure with barge and his trait to get the heavy lifting done by way of punishes and footsies. It does not currently feel like I'm using a low tier character.

 

[Pakman]

So i've noticed no one's really been taking advantage of air bf2 mb launch. Granted, mid screen he can't because recovery is too great, but corner? Oh boy is this useful!

Corner only 70% Damage. 2 bars, Side switch.

Notations:
J3, bf2mb
3,3, db1mb
Tap forwards, b3
J3, 3, bf3

 

[Apolo Volturi]

Hello guys, I have been working on Blue Beetle and I found new combos and some interesting stuff, like a side switch setup OS and other things.
I hope it useful:

 

[JustinXavier21]

So i've noticed no one's really been taking advantage of air bf2 mb launch. Granted, mid screen he can't because recovery is too great, but corner? Oh boy is this useful!

Corner only 70% Damage. 2 bars, Side switch.

Notations:
J3, bf2mb
3,3, db1mb
Tap forwards, b3
J3, 3, bf3

It's not 70% (you forgot to put competitive on), but it does 485 against Batman which isn't bad and can potentially be optimised a little more too. Definitely decent stuff considering you get the plus frames on block too. I'm gonna play with this some more and see what else is in there.

Hello guys, I have been working on Blue Beetle and I found new combos and some interesting stuff, like a side switch setup OS and other things.
I hope it useful:

These are SICK and really creative too!

 

[|Phantom|]

After watching combo breaker and seeing other characters I've noticing his weaknesses too. The best thing about trait is:

- Range increase allows j.1 confirms from ranges that weren't possible before. Also, airdash forward j.1 punishes most fireballs free
- Range increase allows F23 > B3 or F3 to combo very easily, so you get 300+ damage meterless off a jump-in
- Range increase allows you to pressure with B2 (overhead) from ridiculous ranges

But all in all it isn't even that good. I'm convinced he's mid-tier now. I use stronger characters that I don't play and work half as hard as I do with Beetle..and I'm doing better. It sucks



132 1+2 ender doesn't give you enough advantage to truly do that mix-up you were doing. You see how long the training dummy was standing there while you zipped over his head/ No one would stand there that long without doing a wake-up, backdash, jump, attack, etc. You need a knockdown with more advantage. Try using F2 / D3 / 132 (without the stab ender) and then do that mix-up. They allow you to act way sooner because they give you more frame advantage.

Yeah totally. Like I said, not sure how viable. I honestly didn't think of D3, and I think 132 leaves them a bit to close, as if I recall correctly Jaime dashes over them too far before he turns around for the button press

 

[LEGI0N47]

I play him as a mobile zoner.

His projectile is really good, and if you end your combos correctly (unlike I do) you can get some great cross up setups.

EDIT: his meterless dmg is also better than average I would say

I think mobile zoner is something he's good at but will only carry him so far. I believe it's part of his game plan to build meter and annoy with him and if you're successful with it fuck it, keep doing it. But I believe you must then mix it up and strike or be able to convert off of AA's or floats. After that it looks like if you have your spacing right they enter the blender of float cancel then OH or low, or crossup/noncrossup and more of the same. You fail then hopefully get safe and zone to change the pace until your opportunity shows again. That's how I think he's supposed to roll. I also feel trait cancel combo's will be important at times.

His mobility looks to be key in a lot of MU's. Yes I'm a master of the obvious. Did you watch combo breaker and see that dude playing Brainiac do a pretty legit job of avoiding Atrocitus dex shots with his moveset? Pretty sure Beetle could do similar once you have his movements down.

 

[|Phantom|]

I think mobile zoner is something he's good at but will only carry him so far. I believe it's part of his game plan to build meter and annoy with him and if you're successful with it fuck it, keep doing it. But I believe you must then mix it up and strike or be able to convert off of AA's or floats. After that it looks like if you have your spacing right they enter the blender of float cancel then OH or low, or crossup/noncrossup and more of the same. You fail then hopefully get safe and zone to change the pace until your opportunity shows again. That's how I think he's supposed to roll. I also feel trait cancel combo's will be important at times.

His mobility looks to be key in a lot of MU's. Yes I'm a master of the obvious. Did you watch combo breaker and see that dude playing Brainiac do a pretty legit job of avoiding Atrocitus dex shots with his moveset? Pretty sure Beetle could do similar once you have his movements down.

I mean yeah, his mobility and projectile are great, but he is no Deadshot. You have to go in and get some damage in sometimes. I think that he actually has some great corner options/ mixups.

You can space your opponent out with trait for a max range B2 into blades for some damage.

You could also use the 13 string to get some tricky flight setups going as well

 

[Raynex]

Hello guys, I have been working on Blue Beetle and I found new combos and some interesting stuff, like a side switch setup OS and other things.
I hope it useful:

Sickest video I've seen since game release. You're awesome

edit:

@Apolo Volturi I used your corner set-up, added my own variation, and combined the two. There are two possible mix-ups. You either get the 3 in 1,3 to cross-up...or the 1,3 whiffs and you fly mix-up. This sequence is the result


https://twitter.com/raynexpress/status/869281654988308480

 

[zykkspooL]

Every flight mixup ive tried so far have been mashed out so i got nothing from it not even a punish or i get punished. Are there any guaranteed setups?

 

[Apolo Volturi]

Every flight mixup ive tried so far have been mashed out so i got nothing from it not even a punish or i get punished. Are there any guaranteed setups?

His game plan is lying on mobility, but you must analyze your opponent’s reactions before to start flight setups.
Most of all players which like wake up mashing are ease to bait by Beetle, if it doesn't bother you, I would like to see some of this matches.

 

[ATL Jones Bro3]

One thing on my Blue Beetle wish list is being able to cancel all normals or strings into fly. It could just put him at a low fly height and it would give him some more options.

 

[zykkspooL]

I've been playing more Superman lately (F23 too good lol) but im gonna play some BB today and see how it goes

 

[gibster13]

I feel BB is very below the radar even though he has some very strong things.

If I was to speculate buffs, as I have been asked, I think

Airbf2 should have less recovery
More dmg off specials
F23 to be cancelable on block

 

[Coliflowerz]

https://discord.gg/mxWSqyK
Hey guys, I set up a Discord for BB the other day. Nothing much going on now but if you need a chatroom for BB it's here.

 

[ryublaze]

Some things I noticed with Beetle

- Since 111 has a gap, you really just have to hit confirm 11 or you can do 11 shield. Not a big deal imo.

- 13 float cancel pressure seems super risky because opponent can hold down and mash d2 out of it. The only thing that beats their d2 is 132 which is unsafe on block.
EDIT: Okay it seems that this is character dependent. Characters with slower d2s have a hard time getting out of 13 float j1. Also you can do 13 float up+back MB Air fireball to punish whiffed d2s.

- db1 MB seems completely useless since df1 MB does more damage overall.

- 211+3 and f2 look like the best enders in the corner. 211+3 for optimal damage and HDK. f2 for HDK and ambiguous cross-up setup.

- Instant air fireball MB in the corner should be your go to overhead combo starter because it's safe, keeps them in the corner and does more damage.

- 1st stance overall seems superior to Blade stance because you have zoning, better neutral, a safe special, and an overhead starter that's safe in the corner. I can see Blade stance being better in certain MUs or situations.

 

[gibster13]

I see no benefit of blade stance and have not since the beta.

In some match ups perhaps but it does not seem good enough to complete change a match up.

I think beetles bf2 projectile is insane

 

[gibster13]

I found this quote from @HoneyBee

"To any of you zoning haters, here's some advice. Any tournament player will tell you that you need to use the tools given to you that give you the best chance of winning the match. In this case for Blue Beetle, it's using his projectile and here's why.

His only move that has any range is very punishable and the majority of his moves have no range. You can't mindlessly jump at your opponent in this game or your shit is getting anti aired for a full combo. (Only Batman can really do this at this point since his trait bats cover him but even then, he can be anti aired sometimes.) Also, his pressure is non-existent which leaves Blue Beetle with the only option to zone like his life depends on it. If you don't like that, too bad and good luck ever beating a competent Batman player cause that's just how the match up plays out. I've never used zoning characters in the past but I can appreciate every style of play in fighting games which includes zoning. It's not as simple as "spamming" a move which, by the way, isn't a real term we use in competitive play. There's always ways around it"


This is why beetle may need some love from Paulo

 

[HoneyBee]

I found this quote from @HoneyBee

"To any of you zoning haters, here's some advice. Any tournament player will tell you that you need to use the tools given to you that give you the best chance of winning the match. In this case for Blue Beetle, it's using his projectile and here's why.

His only move that has any range is very punishable and the majority of his moves have no range. You can't mindlessly jump at your opponent in this game or your shit is getting anti aired for a full combo. (Only Batman can really do this at this point since his trait bats cover him but even then, he can be anti aired sometimes.) Also, his pressure is non-existent which leaves Blue Beetle with the only option to zone like his life depends on it. If you don't like that, too bad and good luck ever beating a competent Batman player cause that's just how the match up plays out. I've never used zoning characters in the past but I can appreciate every style of play in fighting games which includes zoning. It's not as simple as "spamming" a move which, by the way, isn't a real term we use in competitive play. There's always ways around it"


This is why beetle may need some love from Paulo

This is from the beta but since then Beetle has received buffs. The quote doesn't apply anymore.

 

[gibster13]

This is from the beta but since then Beetle has received buffs. The quote doesn't apply anymore.

Beetle was buffed ?

The only change I have noticed is that

111 was 0 but is now +1

 

[Da Tac0]

Anyone else in here having trouble going against bane and Harley? I get wrecked almost every time against them. Swamp thing is also bad

 

[AK Harold]

I've gotta say he has been the most fun character to play since the Flash for me. Are we at a point yet where we have enough Blue Beetle players to talk about Match ups specifically and break down the ins and outs?

It may be too early but I am curious what BB mains have to say. Could we do a format like this? Only 3 characters and discuss it. Although right now I feel every match up in the entire game is 5-5 for the time being I want to start developing BB's MU chart soon.

vs Robin
Advantaged. I feel like BB can control pace with blast and keep good distance from Robin and build meter. Then once in striking range we can leverage our meter to win trades. Up close we can fight pretty well in either form. Mid range we can force Robin to do what we want as Blaster or play footsies in Blade. Far range we build meter relentlessly. He also has no clear answer for air blasters as you can out range his B2.

vs Superman
Disadvantaged. I do not have a clear answer for laser sweep aside from moving in and getting close. (personal shortcoming for sure) I think the answer is manipulating flight enough to punish him for it. You cant dash straight in because of the hitbox. Up close, superman is oppressive with his F2 pressure. I think it is very winnable though if you just patience in the neutral as your blast forces him to go to the air to sweep.

vs Black Adam
Even. Blast is very hard for Adam to deal with at less than max range. Adam must commit to dive kicks or walking in. . . most choose divekick and get punished pretty easily with BB. Also Adam has no wake up vs BB up close (b2xxBF3) crushes his lightning cage. Adam's trait is not that scary since you can back away and range. Equalizer is Adam's damage potential and avenues to achieve it. Mistakes are costly and can swing the fight very quickly.