After CEO, I've realized throws are really killing my hype in this game.

[Badboy Takuma]

i miss those times when bitches tried to throw me and i lp dp, ed them with my old sagat for an nice chunk of dmg.
it felt so great ha ha ha ha

come at me bitches!!

 

[theotherguy]

and should have shorter animations.

I agree with that, only because i'd like to see some classic MK1/2 flip throws just for something different.

While the longer throws are great, some just seem too elaborate, or boring. Kitana's stabby-stab front throw is one i'm not a fan of.

The thing is that throws beat pokes and I don't think it should be like that. I'm totally okay with throws breaking the animations of other basic moves and even FBs on startup but pokes should low profile throws. Throws must remain a high attack and not become mids under certain conditions.

We'd just end up with even more pokes on pokes on pokes to counter the throws. At least now you need to think about throwing out a poke because the opponent may throw and counter your poke.

 

[phnmnl]

Some characters have two KB after incorrect throw tech. Are any of them considered top tier? No. They're all low tier bar LK who's mid.

I'm a scrub and even me knows this thread is silly.

 

[Deleted member 35141]

What I dont get is people saying throws beat pokes even though I have teched throws doing d1 and d4. It kind of gives you a OS you either connect the d1 or d4 or if its a grab and guess right get a teched throw.

 

[MagicMan357]

is there anything you guys wont cry about?

 

[SonicNinja3532]

Some characters have two KB after incorrect throw tech. Are any of them considered top tier? No. They're all low tier bar LK who's mid.

I'm a scrub and even me knows this thread is silly.

Baraka is low tier? Since when lol

 

[ExpectFlames]

If the movement of this game was more like Street Fighter or an anime fighter, I'd totally agree with you.
For traditional 2D fighting games, smaller tech windows, teching on a read, and single button techs has been the way it's been for decades.

The movement of MK11 is a stiffer than those games though. It's more like Tekken.

What I mean by that is that in Street Fighter and some anime fighters every character could universally fake out a grab by walking forward then backwards to bait the grab animation for a whiff punish. In Tekken though, because of the stiffer movement, the grabs are balanced out by making them into HIGHs that can be teched multiple different ways depending on which grab the offender chose.

MK11 chose the same style as Tekken because both incorporate the ability to duck under high attacks. This already gives grabs a HUGE counter so making the grabs a bit more of a mixup if they do land makes up for them only doing only 14%.

Like I said before, if they changed it to a single button press to tech it'd be way too easy because even I already tech grabs 90% of the time, whether it's the correct direction or not.

That's because you could tech grabs on reaction 100% of the time if you practice, just like Tekken.

If they made the switch to single button teching, they'd have to lower the tech window to something smaller to compensate for it to be one button, but they'd run the possibility of grabs being teched even less and becoming even more common because techs would only be done on reads.

A smart strategy in games like Street Fighter 5 is to just eat a throw or two because they'll do significantly less damage and the tech window is smaller, making the tech more of a read and less of a reaction.

If MK11 had grab techs that were more reads than reactions, I just don't think it'd end well imo.

I really do think the way they have it right now is a fine.

How do you tech a guess 100% of the time? Educated or not. If throw animations were different for forward or back throws that would be different, but you cant honestly think that any of us believe this can you?

 

[Circus]

How do you tech a guess 100% of the time? Educated or not. If throw animations were different for forward or back throws that would be different, but you cant honestly think that any of us believe this can you?

?

You're misunderstanding.

Of couse you can't guess the direction every time in MK11. You CAN tech the grab on reaction and and at least guess forward or back though.

 

[ExpectFlames]

?

You're misunderstanding.

Of couse you can't guess the direction every time in MK11. You CAN tech the grab on reaction and and at least guess forward or back though.

Some indicator for what direction throw is coming the frames can stay exactly the same then and only then would throws be barely passable.
Side note why does everyone ignore varying throw distances ( on grab )

 

[Edmund]

From a casual standpoint, throws are one of those things that most people see as “free damage.” Like I remember when I was younger and I got thrown in a fighting game, mainly SCIV, I thought it was a cheap free comboless damage.

From a more competitive standpoint, throws are one of the universal mechanics that has to be mastered. And, if anything, it is one of the more easier ones to learn. Especially since most, if not all, characters use their throws at some point.

I do like the idea of somehow amending the the krushing blows of the throws however.

 

[dribirut]

It really isnt any different than a overhead/ low 50/50.. I think the problem is that the NRS community isnt used to defending against the throw/strike guess game. Ducking and letting go of the block button to punish this 50/50 seems counter intuitive and definitely takes some time getting used to..

At least thats whats happening to me

 

[NeonGroovyGator]

I think the only thing I'd change is to lower the damage back to 12% maybe.
Other than that, I feel like the high level players are already getting better at reading the risk/reward from back or forward throw and teching, not to mention the hard reads on throws followed by punishes, which were hype af in CEO.
It's not a true 50/50 if the positioning payoff is so different when you're near the corner, for example.

 

[B. Shazzy]

i hate grab spammers too

don't act as you have any clue about fighting games.
thank you

damn crimsonshadow btfo
lul

 

[Under_The_Mayo]

I have a question for everyone. Why were throws not a big thing in MK9? That was not a 50/50 game, yet I see people here saying that all the throws are the consequence of the game not being 50/50 based.

In mk9, throws were less damage. But there's also other things to consider. The whole "9 frame mid" thing wasn't a talking point. Every character had universal jumping attack animations. If you could anti-air one character, you could anti-air them all. If you wanted frame advantage from your jump kick, it had to be deep. And there were armored specials.

MK9 for life, babies!

(really i think if they just lowered grab damage down to 10% and took away the KB throws, they'd be perfect)

 

[Slips]

I think this throw system is perfect. It's a little cheap online but that's true for all fighting games when playing online.

Only thing I'd change, and this would be for future games and not possible with this one, is to create more than 1 throw animation for forward and back throws and make sure the frame advantage + distance are the same. Just so it's more fun to watch for spectators.

My creative juices also think it'd be cool if you could choose which throw you want to use. If you want to throw someone full screen it should be an option. Same with if you want to do a throw that has good wakeups. Always nice to give the players more strategy to work with as opposed to just being at the mercy to what animations the devs came up with.

Competitively though, this is as good of a system I've seen in fighting games.

 

[TotteryManx]

I was really frustrated with throws in the beginning, but 2 months later I break them a lot more consistently(even online). Having played other fighting games like Tekken, where you need to learn how to break Kings throws, it's kind of whatever.

 

[B. Shazzy]

What I dont get is people saying throws beat pokes even though I have teched throws doing d1 and d4. It kind of gives you a OS you either connect the d1 or d4 or if its a grab and guess right get a teched throw.

You know d2s can get grabbed and do often right? Like ya you mashed your poke but if it wasnt the right one its getting grabbed. Thats what they mean. Ive even had my d1s get backthrown and get the “counterhit” sign or whatever

 

[Deleted member 35141]

You know d2s can get grabbed and do often right? Like ya you mashed your poke but if it wasnt the right one its getting grabbed. Thats what they mean. Ive even had my d1s get backthrown and get the “counterhit” sign or whatever

For the people that mash d2 sure, I don't.
I also never said anything about mashing pokes more about reading your opponent like if you opponent goes for a stagger and you know either a grab or mid is coming you can poke out or tech a throw( if you guess right).
Or just learn to tech a throw I gave a option not saying its 100% just like teching a throw isn't 100%.

But I get it if it doesn't work everytime its useless, and we can keep complaining about things that actually work properly unlike hitboxes now thats a reason to whine( some cheese too).

 

[lxValkenhaynxl]

Its the kb requirements with the throw escape fails. It is basicaly encouraging to do at least 4 throws a game which is stupid, no wonder half the cast play around throwing you as often as possible if u get an easy 300dmg instead of 140.

 

[El mofongo]

I think the underlying problem is the fact that you have to let go of the block button in addition to pressing a button to tech. You gotta perform two steps to tech a throw instead of just one. It sounds like a minor thing but in the heat of things its a hard thing to remember/execute.

 

[Matix218]

I like this throw system personally. The only thing I think would make sense is to maybe drop the damage to 10ish% tops. I feel like a throw doing 1/3 the damage of a full 1 bar combo is fine but if they are doing closer to half that may be a bit much. Not a huge deal though, I would MUCH rather see fatal blow damage doropped down to 25% max personally.

 

[lordlosh]

KB on throw should be 100% removed. KB and FB needs to be balanced. Cause right now some character can have only 1 good KB, other have like 5. The only thing that needs to be balanced is KB and FB.

 

[Vslayer]

I think the underlying problem is the fact that you have to let go of the block button in addition to pressing a button to tech. You gotta perform two steps to tech a throw instead of just one. It sounds like a minor thing but in the heat of things its a hard thing to remember/execute.

And the fact that if you read it and quickly D2 it, you'll get grabbed anyways. It's sort of frustrating, especially if they're throwing backwards and your mashing of D2 counted as an escape failure.

 

[Repraved]

I'm still a fairly noob NRS player, so I'm not here to comment on what I think needs to be fixed. If anything gets me thrown the most, it's forgetting to let go of the block button while I'm teching rather than having the correct read or not. (damn, it's like a double commitment to defend against a throw).

But the mention of Street Fighter's movement being different, and Tekken mechanics made me want to bring up a point. This game may work more like 3D fighters in terms of movement and throw mechanics, but something that I haven't seen mentioned is that in those games, MIDS beat crouching. There is no character who lacks tools to open people up in those games for this reason, and lows are really good pokes. This combination really alters the style of ground game, and throw game for that matter.

I've struggled with grasping close range in MK11 compared to my experience in other fighters. It requires my full focus, and I find it far more difficult to start creating space and and getting in my zone of neutral. But I'm not an expert on what I'd change without drastically having to change other things to balance it out. Some mechanics in MK11 feel like an odd combination of other games, and I think that would make it easier to fall apart if messed with.

 

[OnlineSkunk]

Throws should stay the same but they should do no more than 12%, krushing blows removed and teching throws chip damage removed. Now we have a flawless throw system.