The Power Nth -- Hawkgirl General Discussion Thread

[regulas]

Also as a general note, from what I can tell unlike Batgirl, Scorpian is actually not too bad for Hawkgirl. The tp although annoying is much easier to deal with (notably since you can still use jump/fly and not necessarily be hit) And his other ranged abilities are similarly slow and or avoidable.

 

[Tiger Wong]

Maaaaaaaannnnn...... I'm gonna mess with Bane for a little but I was labbing that MC MB on block. +7 is so lovely. It looks like it means you get an entrance and if they block it, you have two 6 frame attacks that you can combo off of if they try to interrupt (for mediocre to average damage but hey, we're not dealing with GL here). Or you can WE and you're pretty much out of most normal moves range and leaves them beggin for a WE 3 (or two if they're close enough).

 

[Boodendorf]

Mc mb is +7 on block? Okay that's the best buff ever, the slight nerf to mace charge barely matters now.
Mc mb avoid most armored moves, like mb b3 that were usually used to deal with your wakeup mc but it was risky since it was extremely unsafe on block. Now the only option to deal with it is either bjump 2 or early crossup 2.

Yep HG is definitely better now. Any other changes?

 

[Tiger Wong]

Well when she does MC MB she falls superfast and her cancel into trait is really late. There's barely enough frames to get a flight 2 off.......

But it's possible. There's a few new combos in the BnB thread.

Also, she can combo after MC MB with F13/32/D1/D2. The new combos are in the BnB thread.

 

[TrulyAmiracle]

YOOOOOOOOOOO

Found another change, Ground mace toss is a fuckin MID now. You cant duck it o_o
Also, Footdive is now listed as -8 not -10, dunno if they actually changed the blockstun on it. Dem stealth buffs?

 

[Boodendorf]

YOOOOOOOOOOO

Found another change, Ground mace toss is a fuckin MID now. You cant duck it o_o
Also, Footdive is now listed as -8 not -10, dunno if they actually changed the blockstun on it. Dem stealth buffs?

FUCK YEAH! 32 mt mb is now LEGIT AS HELL IN THE CORNER!
Also i'm not sure if they made divekick -8 at every height or -8 from top height? If it's from the top it's a huge buff.

Aw yeh! Can't wait to come back home and play dat winged booty.

 

[TrulyAmiracle]

Wait wait, what fuckin garbage is this? Ground mace toss is a mid now but some characters can just completely duck it like Bats and Barbara but others like Nightwing and Scorpion cant...

FUCK YOU NRS LOL, If you're gonna make it a mid then make it a fuckin proper mid ~___~;

 

[regulas]

MT change is awesome even if there are a few characters it doesn't work on.

 

[4x4lo8o]

Wait wait, what fuckin garbage is this? Ground mace toss is a mid now but some characters can just completely duck it like Bats and Barbara but others like Nightwing and Scorpion cant...

FUCK YOU NRS LOL, If you're gonna make it a mid then make it a fuckin proper mid ~___~;

Yeah, the frame data says mid but it appears it'll whiff on most of the cast when crouching. I didn't test everyone, but Ares, Superman, Aquaman, and Shazaam can crouch under it. The only characters I tried on who couldn't were the obviously large hit box ones like Doomsday.

 

[Tiger Wong]

So basically it's still a high?

 

[Dulllyanna]

Wait wait, what fuckin garbage is this? Ground mace toss is a mid now but some characters can just completely duck it like Bats and Barbara but others like Nightwing and Scorpion cant...

FUCK YOU NRS LOL, If you're gonna make it a mid then make it a fuckin proper mid ~___~;

It was always listed as a mid lol.

 

[Boodendorf]

Got the patch, OH MY GOD MC MB IS AMAZING.

 

[regulas]

Got the patch, OH MY GOD MC MB IS AMAZING.

Yes yes and yes, now that I've gotten to use it a bunch in fights it is everything I hoped it would do, the fact that it lands you at the perfect range to follow up with pressure mid-screen is a big deal given that you are also at +7 (not to mention its a total of like 4.7% chip).

As a side note the only downside is that while it is +7, you need precise timing to actually get the full +7 i.e. against lex with corpse charge it's extremely difficult to counter the reversal with say 3 that is 12 frames (and should be 5 frames after MB MC.

 

[EmInEnTShAdOw]

Yes yes and yes, now that I've gotten to use it a bunch in fights it is everything I hoped it would do, the fact that it lands you at the perfect range to follow up with pressure mid-screen is a big deal given that you are also at +7 (not to mention its a total of like 4.7% chip).

As a side note the only downside is that while it is +7, you need precise timing to actually get the full +7 i.e. against lex with corpse charge it's extremely difficult to counter the reversal with say 3 that is 12 frames (and should be 5 frames after MB MC.

Yeah, thats why safer to do F1 or D1. Can still get good damage off F1>1 confirm. Don't forget throw and divekick too

 

[regulas]

How much have people played around with trying to vortex? WE3 in particular leaves you only -1 on block or 10 if they duck but with some distance. You can follow up with some pressure and another WE3 (say d1~WE3 for example is only at 7 frames), done properly you can easily go back and forth a bunch. There is also Air MT DM when you learn the ranges though you need to do this at max jump height or else you will be stuck standing still for awhile on the ground.

The main reason is to do with the 40%+ midscreen combo's. They all start with 3 which as a mid is not going to easily open someone up, so I've been trying to think of ways to make them practical other then just hoping you get lucky or maybe punishing a wiff.

 

[CamRac]

How much have people played around with trying to vortex? WE3 in particular leaves you only -1 on block or 10 if they duck but with some distance. You can follow up with some pressure and another WE3 (say d1~WE3 for example is only at 7 frames), done properly you can easily go back and forth a bunch. There is also Air MT DM when you learn the ranges though you need to do this at max jump height or else you will be stuck standing still for awhile on the ground.

The main reason is to do with the 40%+ midscreen combo's. They all start with 3 which as a mid is not going to easily open someone up, so I've been trying to think of ways to make them practical other then just hoping you get lucky or maybe punishing a wiff.

It's basically like, what's max damage off of:

D2
D1
B2,2
WE2
B2,3 (if you want to take the risk)
B1 (if you happen to AA with it)
& F1,3

123, 32, 22, & 3 don't seem to have much use outside of punishing people. I mean, we can say we're going to mix-up with something like a 22, but will that really come into handy against someone that is familiar with Hawkgirl (i.e. competitors a year or so into the game cycle)?

 

[regulas]

It's basically like, what's max damage off of:

D2
D1
B2,2
WE2
B2,3 (if you want to take the risk)
B1 (if you happen to AA with it)
& F1,3

123, 32, 22, & 3 don't seem to have much use outside of punishing people. I mean, we can say we're going to mix-up with something like a 22, but will that really come into handy against someone that is familiar with Hawkgirl (i.e. competitors a year or so into the game cycle)?

The whole point I was thinking of is to use WE3 to cross-up then start with 3~MT, if they block you can then D1~WE3 to cross-up again so on and so forth. The point is to dull someone reactions make them screw up or even block in the wrong direction because you keep changing sides on them.

3~MT combo's are 40-52% damage midscreen (1-2MB)

 

[CamRac]

Ohhh, I'm sorry, I misunderstood what you were getting at. That being said, if MT doesn't actually hit mid, couldn't people just block low after the WE3 crossover, and then full combo punish you?

The +1 on block is fairly useless if you can't even guarantee a connect. :/

 

[regulas]

Ohhh, I'm sorry, I misunderstood what you were getting at. That being said, if MT doesn't actually hit mid, couldn't people just block low after the WE3 crossover, and then full combo punish you?

The +1 on block is fairly useless if you can't even guarantee a connect. :/

You can always MB on reaction (as long as the mace is still on screen), it's not ideal but does compensate and leave you safe (you can also use this if they jump), the main thing I think is to not overuse 3~MT itself and to throw in enough overheads to condition them to blocking high.

 

[TrulyAmiracle]

depends on the character, I'll see if i have time tonight to test who can duck ground MT. Right now i know scorpion, NW and Doomsday cant duck it with Bats and Barbara can. Havent tested anyone else yet

I usually use that "vortex" by mixing throw, sweep, d1 or instant footdive. if the d1 hits you can get a mini-combo or do b2 as a frametrap into b22 or b23.

 

[XxSYNDROISxX]

how hard is Hawkgirl to use and is she worth it? I want a new character to work on and i love the have she plays as she doesn't seem to relie on combos much just mix ups

 

[TrulyAmiracle]

... Hawkgirl has mixups?

 

[regulas]

... Hawkgirl has mixups?

B2~WE2 (or B23 if you want to try)
B22

Also you can continue as B223 or B22~WE2 for a second set.

Mid-Overhead or Mid-Low from the same starter leading into a combo, that constitutes a mix-up, you can even do WE3 and instead cross-up to add another flavor to the mix.. She has no effective 50/50 though since sweep is her only low starting hit.

 

[XxSYNDROISxX]

Anyone?

 

[TrulyAmiracle]

Lol I was being sarcastic bro =P considering how outsiders see Hawkgirl as a "fly away and chuck maces x infinity" kinda characters with no mixups or up-close tools.


Also b223/b22~WE2 mixup doesnt work midscreen. you have instant divekick and WE3 shenanigans there though so it evens out.


To answer your question XxSYNDROISxX ,hawkgirl is more of a hit-and-run character with zoning tools and lots of shenanigans upclose, her corner game is amazing and you can lock down a lot of characters easy.
She has a couple bat matchups and need you to be patient and not flying around (Sinestro, batgirl, lex, WW) but she goes even or beats most of the cast, including the S tier crew.

Personally i think its worth it as both my subs (Raven and Batgirl) are considered "better characters" but i feel like Hawkgirl has the potential to be just as good as either of them, if not better. Plus she's also more fun to use, you can control the tempo of the match very easily with her which can be used as a tactic to through the opponent off.

She has her share of mixups but theyre not that rewarding midscreen, in the corner they all go into full combo for 40%+ damage and put you in a position to do the same mixup again.

Her combos arent long and while her "optimal" damage ones are on the hard side they're not impossible and you can get them down after playing for a bit. Plus you can play her without doing them and get similar damage.


Hope that answers your question.