My thoughts on why throws are worthless

[FlsGd2BAgngsta]

Can somebody please tell me why I would ever throw my opponent say, after a blocked jump in punch? Nearly every character (maybe all, I dont know) in the game has some kind of high low mix up game that leads to full combos or another safe jump. Why would I ever let my opponent out of this guessing game while hes taking chip damage and is one wrong move away from getting 40%ed. So I can get 12% damage and let my opponent off the hook to regroup???

Maybe Im wrong and Im sure their are at least a few cases where a throw attempt is the correct play but I never feel like its right after a blocked jump in punch. It takes all of the pressure off of them, only does 12%, and it should be dropped from everyones game imo.

 

[scrubtastic]

well i like to throw in a throw after a couple blocked pressure strings to catch them off guard or to put them in the corner if we are near it and then go in to continue pressure.

 

[MKF30]

To each his own I suppose, but IMO throws are VERY important....if someone is just blocking, you will be thrown every chance I get lol and you can't tech out of every, single one of them....that's how I see them. Throws IMO do decent damage, are fun to watch and are a great tool for constant blockers.

 

[DaiHuu]

Because players with above average reaction time won't be deterred from blocking if you don't attempt to grab them. You create a mix up that causes them to stop blocking, making them scared of the throw so later on during the match they'll press a button during one of your strings, and bam free damage.

 

[FlsGd2BAgngsta]

To each his own I suppose, but IMO throws are VERY important....if someone is just blocking, you will be thrown every chance I get lol and you can't tech out of every, single one of them....that's how I see them. Throws IMO do decent damage, are fun to watch and are a great tool for constant blockers.

But even on a constant blocker would not the chip damage from block strings and safe jumps more times than not equal the damage of the throw...plus keep them in a guessing game until they take a gamble and guess when you will end the string into another safe jump mix up?

Heres an example for ermac:

jp,2,2
crossover jp
another immediate crossover jp,b1,1
crossover jp,b1,1,4,tkl (or a lot of different combinations and options)

Its pretty difficult for opponets to read this kind of stuff and react in time to punish before your next safe jump. And I use ermac as an example because his mix up game is not his strength. If you take one of the characters who has great high low strings and free safe jump on block strings it just seems obvious to me that its better to keep your opponent on block and guessing than it is to just throw them off to safety with the wakeup option of their choice. The risk/reward seems to heavily outweigh a throw attempt.

 

[DaiHuu]

But even on a constant blocker would not the chip damage from block strings and safe jumps more times than not equal the damage of the throw...plus keep them in a guessing game until they take a gamble and guess when you will end the string into another safe jump mix up?

Heres an example for ermac:

jp,2,2
crossover jp
another immediate crossover jp,b1,1
crossover jp,b1,1,4,tkl (or a lot of different combinations and options)

Its pretty difficult for opponets to read this kind of stuff and react in time to punish before your next safe jump. And I use ermac as an example because his mix up game is not his strength. If you take one of the characters who has great high low strings and free safe jump on block strings it just seems obvious to me that its better to keep your opponent on block and guessing than it is to just throw them off to safety with the wakeup option of their choice. The risk/reward seems to heavily outweigh a throw attempt.

D+3, or nj 1/2, or just crouch and wait to D+2
It actually isn't that hard to react to 2 jps in a short time span, a casual buddy who's starting to get better and better at the game reacted to that same situation and just uppercut me for free. Which is where the throw comes in.

 

[Dark_Rob]

Can somebody please tell me why I would ever throw my opponent say, after a blocked jump in punch? Nearly every character (maybe all, I dont know) in the game has some kind of high low mix up game that leads to full combos or another safe jump. Why would I ever let my opponent out of this guessing game while hes taking chip damage and is one wrong move away from getting 40%ed. So I can get 12% damage and let my opponent off the hook to regroup???

Maybe Im wrong and Im sure their are at least a few cases where a throw attempt is the correct play but I never feel like its right after a blocked jump in punch. It takes all of the pressure off of them, only does 12%, and it should be dropped from everyones game imo.

Throws are actually very valuable in this game. You can use them as a mixup, if your opponent is blocking all your strings you can use a throw to put them on notice that blocking isnt an invincible forcefield. Do it enough and they wont be able to ignore it. They will have to try and tech at some point and then you can actually hit them with your strings. Also bear in my mind the character your using can influence your throw use as well. Kung Lao is a great rushdown/pressure character. He lives to be in your face mixing you up with his strings so he doesnt need to rely on throws as much. But even a Kung Lao will throw you if your blocking if it will put you in the corner.
Someone like Noob Saibot wants to get away from you. If he can do a block string and mix in a throw he can A) put you back across the screen creating the distance he needs to zone properly or B) Put you in the corner where he can unleash his godly corner game.
Once my meter is built up all the way Im alot less interested in pressuring with block strings because I already have all the meter Im gonna get from you. At that point, I want damage, and throws are a good way to get it.

 

[9.95]

Throws in this game are good because the throw tech system is so bad. Because of that, you can throw, ALMOST with impunity for easy, free damage.

 

[FlsGd2BAgngsta]

Is their time to confirm the end of a block string and uppercut/punish a crossover jump punch without guessing when your opponent will stop the string or finish with a special? If so it cant be that many frames and requires alot of knowledge about the matchup. Ive been playing with quan chi and have never had so many flawless victories in so short of timeframe from doing shit like this.

j1,1
j1, 1,1 (confirm into full combo)
j1, b3,1+2,trance,eat 40%

And a lot of other combinations. Doesnt an opponent have to block until he sees if im going to finish the string and then see if i end with trance or otherwise just guess and hope he has me figured out or get full comboed if hes wrong? Against most players ill take the chance of getting uppercutted for minimal damage when its likely ive equaled it already from the chip damage if not made them eat 40%. I still feel like thows are great in the street fighter mix up game but almost irrelevant in mk9.....but a many a better players disagree with me so...maybe im wrong...anyone want to buy an r1 button?

 

[MKF30]

The tech system is pretty easy to do I'd say in this game but the timing isn't...

But even on a constant blocker would not the chip damage from block strings and safe jumps more times than not equal the damage of the throw...plus keep them in a guessing game until they take a gamble and guess when you will end the string into another safe jump mix up?

Heres an example for ermac:

jp,2,2
crossover jp
another immediate crossover jp,b1,1
crossover jp,b1,1,4,tkl (or a lot of different combinations and options)

Its pretty difficult for opponets to read this kind of stuff and react in time to punish before your next safe jump. And I use ermac as an example because his mix up game is not his strength. If you take one of the characters who has great high low strings and free safe jump on block strings it just seems obvious to me that its better to keep your opponent on block and guessing than it is to just throw them off to safety with the wakeup option of their choice. The risk/reward seems to heavily outweigh a throw attempt.

That's just the thing, use throws as mix ups well and you will have your opponent guessing out of pure mind games, and in Ermac's case since he gets a free jump in after EX force push slam, you can jump in and either throw, 50/50 up close(while he doesn't have any good mix ups up close) you can still mix it up with attacks.

Like Daihuu stated man, they can't guess right everytime and sooner or later will eat a combo if not a throw.

 

[Fulan]

1. throws give untechable knockdowns that some characters can take advantage of with continued pressure. And ermac likes throws because it pushes the opponent away where he wants them. Throws also take care of bad postitioning.

2. not everyone has safe high low mixups or even any good high low mixup to speak of and training your opponent to break or neutral duck throws means they will eat ANY attack you will throw at them.

3. lows beat high block, overheads beat low block, throw beats ANY block,, and ANY attack beats throw break or neutral duck. if you take away throws you simplify the guessing game and make it easier for the opponent to stay on point mentally.

Damage return is secondary, your priority is breaking your opponents defense. If you want big damage return you condition your opponent to leave themselves open for a big damage opportunity, part of that conditioning is hitting them with relatively low dmg options like throws. You will NEVER hit them with a damaging combo otherwise outside of punishment, especially with ermac and his lack of high low mixups.

also those situations you describe don't grant you safe jumps.

 

[Kelter Skelter]

Throws in this game are good because the throw tech system is so bad. Because of that, you can throw, ALMOST with impunity for easy, free damage.

lost a tournament last night and kept saying the same thing!

even knowing they were going to throw wouldn't put me in a position to be able to tech. just have to mash it out i suppose.

 

[Loot]

Throws are good because for some reason they have a button for each break and you can't tell which direction so its a 50/50, although from my experience very few people seem to do a forwards throw so teching with 1 is something I'm accustomed to.

 

[Rushdown]

Does your character have both low and overhead starters? If not then throws are obviously bomb.

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[oBryant]

Can somebody please tell me why I would ever throw my opponent say, after a blocked jump in punch? Nearly every character (maybe all, I dont know) in the game has some kind of high low mix up game that leads to full combos or another safe jump. Why would I ever let my opponent out of this guessing game while hes taking chip damage and is one wrong move away from getting 40%ed. So I can get 12% damage and let my opponent off the hook to regroup???

Maybe Im wrong and Im sure their are at least a few cases where a throw attempt is the correct play but I never feel like its right after a blocked jump in punch. It takes all of the pressure off of them, only does 12%, and it should be dropped from everyones game imo.

Fighting games need a rock paper scissor engine in order to be balanced.. you got your Low, high, throw. rock, paper, scissor. low > high block, high > low, throw > block, Counter hit > throw tech. If there was no throw then I could just block. but then again this is mortal kombat and there is chip damage. But still, its part of the mixup.

 

[THTB]

Throws are very good in MK9. Because of how much of a guess it is to break a throw, and because they will land on a crouch blocking opponent, they work well to open up the opponent.

Tbh, safe jumps are a lot more rare in MK9 than in the demo build, and not every character can rely on them. Chip damage definitely helps, too, but 12% at once is better than 12% at different intervals.

 

[oBryant]

lost a tournament last night and kept saying the same thing!

even knowing they were going to throw wouldn't put me in a position to be able to tech. just have to mash it out i suppose.

I don't know about you guys but throws are easy to tech. just keep in mind guys, when your blocking you cant tech a throw.. you must let go of block.

 

[Rushdown]

Throws are not easy to tech, there's no difference in the animations, it's a 50/50 every single time.

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[oBryant]

Throws are not easy to tech, there's no difference in the animations, it's a 50/50 every single time.

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...you dont have to press a different button for anything.. you press FP or BP and it gets teched.. if tis 50/50 everytime then this is ST

 

[chessmaster]

throws are in fighting every game. do you know what would happen if they didn't have throws in the game? maybe throws are not an important part of your game but they are not worthless.

 

[Hates]

Throws are a great way to position your opponent. Toss 'em into a corner, toss your way out of a corner, etc etc. I use throws as much for positioning as for damage.

 

[oBryant]

Throws are not easy to tech, there's no difference in the animations, it's a 50/50 every single time.

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I also just tested this out.. throws are 100% techable with FP...

 

[Konqrr]

I also just tested this out.. throws are 100% techable with FP...

Neutral throws (aka back throws) are teched with FP or FK. To tech a front throw (f+1+3), you must tech with BP or BK.

 

[oBryant]

Neutral throws (aka back throws) are teched with FP or FK. To tech a front throw (f+1+3), you must tech with BP or BK.

Oh ok, so they force you to press both, like street fighter it will OS (option select) between the two. (tested) So in his case it's 50/50 only cause he is pressing one.

 

[Konqrr]

Oh ok, so they force you to press both, like street fighter it will OS (option select) between the two. (tested) So in his case it's 50/50 only cause he is pressing one.

No, you can't option select both. You must guess. It is an educated guess though, as you base your guess on where you are in relation to the corner as it is very likely that you will be thrown there.

The window you have to press the right button and escape the throw only accepts the FIRST input. If you press the wrong button, you get thrown.