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Match-up Discussion Superman Matchup Discussion

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Raynex

Intelligence + Speed + Power
Doesn't the straight grapple end in a kick and knock opponents down? You're saying Superman can get up then punish him!?
 
Can someone here explain to me if its possible to block Superman's super? There's no Q&A thread so I figured I'd ask here. I've seen it be blocked before but whenever I try to I just get caught anyways.
 

Raynex

Intelligence + Speed + Power
- Be patient and work yourself into F23 range. You can punish her random force push with full combos.
- Don't shoot too many air heat visions, she can block and punish with force push from pretty much anywhere.
- DF+3 to sneak under fireballs or clip her for untechable KND from range. Once she's on the floor don't let up, she's not too good on wake-up.
- If you're able to get one heat zap off (hit or miss), you're allowed one free dash forwards. It basically covers your approach with it's great damage / chip / massive frame advantage / non-existent recovery period. It's a good way to start moving in from full screen.
- Backdash her 22 frame trap string if they're using it repetitively
- Better meter management, 2 Frame full screen super really helps in this match-up. Once you have it the scare factor alone will, at times, make the Raven not want to press anything. So by not even using the super (just having it stocked), the match-up actually becomes much easier. Though obv you should let it rip if you have a good read.
 
man, really hard to keep nightwing off when he pressures with stance d1 s and his other stuff. is my only option backdashing?
 

Raynex

Intelligence + Speed + Power
Aquaman has been giving me some trouble, any tips?
Punishing:
- Blocked tridents (DB+2) at close range can be punished with full combos; either F23 or 223
- Blocked Trident scoop (DB+1) can be punished with full combos even if blocked at max range; F23
- Water shield [DD+3) can be punished if Aquaman has no meter. Dash / walk / jump into point blank range. You can tag his forward or backward dash cancel out of the water shield with F23 into a full combo. Further testing required for [MB] Shield burst.
- Trident stabs [DF+1] can be punished with Super. More testing required; Superman's other normals are too slow afaik.

General:
- Aquaman has an embarrassingly transparent mix-up game. His most fearsome tool is his B12 string: a 9 frame low with the range of a sweep that leads to 43% combos (1 bar), then into a hard knockdown. His overhead is slow, so it is recommended you crouch block and react to the overhead attempt. The overhead most commonly used is B2 (+1 on block), so even if you block it he's still at minor advantage. You can always backdash or armor B+3 / F+3 to punish continued offensive pressure though.

- A very common tactic is B2 xx DB+1 (trident scoop). That is, an overhead combo starter into a low combo starter. Because Aquaman has no other overhead attack to mix-up with after B2, always block low after successfully defending the overhead. If they attempt to scoop and you crouch block, you get a free combo for their trouble.

- Blocked tridents at range leave Aquaman at such disadvantage it allows a minimum 1 free dash forwards. You cannot be punished for dashing after blocking his trident. Use this as a standard in the match-up and take appropriate risks to gain more ground based on the situation (i.e.: two dashes, dash once then jump, dash and block)

- Though this advice goes for any match-up, in this one particularly: ALWAYS have a well-reasoned plan for any jump or airdash approaches. Aquaman's D2 is 7 frames and completely disjointed. His trident functions as a hitbox independent of his body. If timed correctly, it is virtually unbeatable. Superman cannot perform actions until the end of his airdash and it is incredibly linear, ergo easy to AA. One of Superman's main strengths is spacing and whiff punishing with F23; as such he tends to dominate matches at mid-range. Stay grounded as much as possible to avoid giving Aquaman FREE damage. If you knock him down, jump & airdash pressure becomes a more viable option. Despite the heavy damage scaling after hitting D2s, the hits really begin to add up if you get tagged over and over again, so try to be patient and play a solid ground game.

- [MB] Trident stabs do INSANE chip damage. Pushblock as needed to get him off you!

- Aquaman has roughly 3 strings that are worth using in a match. None of them are tricky, so don't worry too much about complicated high / low nonsense. However, one you should look out for is F13. F1 clocks in at 7 frames (his second fastest move) and is likely to interrupt you during close range exchanges. The follow-up 3 is a delayed overhead which provides him with a free combo if it hits. That's pretty much all you have to watch out for.

man, really hard to keep nightwing off when he pressures with stance d1 s and his other stuff. is my only option backdashing?
Nightwing has the most ridiculous frame data in Injustice. His staff D1 is 6 frames AND +1 on block. If he uses it repeatedly that effectively makes his D1 5 fames, faster than any normal move in the game. Once he starts, it is best you backdash and get some breathing room, as no move you attempt will win or even trade. Pushblock (like the guy above me mentioned) is also a great option, albeit at the cost of one bar of meter.

The strategy I've had the most success with against NW.

- Optimal spacing is this match-up is F23 range or mid-range. When he gets close chaos ensues; everything is fast, everything is + on block, and he has that stupidly fast overhead (B2) that leads to a third of your life bar.

- Superman's high priority mid-range moves naturally counteract NW's range in escrima mode. A tight ground game nets you solid damage and forces NW to take risks to even out the exchange. He will likely try to dash or jump hastily as a result. Remember that if you begin to dominate him on the ground he will likely take to the air in frustration, so AA him! NW is fundamentally a close range character, so don't let his projectiles and decent pokes fool you. Keep your guard up and try your best to not let him bullrush you.

- On that note, J3 in escrima beats Superman's D2 for free. Dash underneath him and AA from behind to teach him to stop. His j1 and 2 aren't as good though, so no worries.

- NW's wake-ups are sub-par, so if you get him on the defensive feel free to RTSD.

- If NW switches to staff mode and pokes back at you from range, there a few things you can do:
*His staff normals are good on block but a tad slow on start-up, so put your focus into whiff punishing with F23 as his staff retracts.
*Heat Zap > Ground Spark. If you get a single Heat Zap on-screen and NW ducks or blocks it, you can shoot another one before he can Ground Spark you. You can use this to either move into advantageous spacing or just shoot some more. If he reverts back to escrima alter your game plan accordingly.

Hope I could be of help guys!

DeathAndHealing
 

Raynex

Intelligence + Speed + Power
Anti-Deathstroke Wake-up:

DS only has two moves that are viable wake-up options, Sword Flip and Sword Spin. The Sword Flip is more than -20 when blocked so punish it with whatever you please. You might even be able to squeeze in a B3 starter for style points! The Sword Spin is much better as a wake-up. The meterless version is completely safe if blocked. The metered version provides DS with a mix-up; he can go overhead or low. Both metered options are punishable by 223 and F23, so go to town if you defend correctly.

Strategy;

When you knock DS down and expect a wake-up attack, walk backwards out of Sword Spin range. When he does the spin and you see it whiff completely, punish with F23 after the second spin into a combo of your choosing. If he performs Sword Flip instead, because you are walking back you will naturally block the Flip and you can punish him with literally anything, as mentioned above. If for whatever reason you are too close and take the [MB] Sword spin high/low mix-up, use the Aquaman blocking strategy. Block low first then react to the high, because as usual the overhead is the slower of the two.


Random match-up tip:
F23 punishes Deathstrokes guns! When you're in range, instead of throwing the string out and just going ham on this guard with xx Breath, be patient. If he decides to shoot high guns or crouching guns you get a free combo. Use this to condition him to shoot less when at that range. This will open up jump opportunities or other approaches that would normally be shut down by his hail of bullets.
 
people say that superman naturally beats deathstrokes zoning. i feel its pretty even.


thank you for your input on the nightwing matchup and dealing with deathstrokes wakeup.


the biggest concern i have with supes is the start of the round. 90%of my opps (online that is) jump forward at me and i get decked if i stay grounded because of cr2's ass priority

I know i can pre-emptively jumpback 1 or 2, into f2,3.
but i dont really like backing off like that. i guess i could dash forward on reaction as well, though, so ill try that
 

Raynex

Intelligence + Speed + Power
I never use j1, and rarely jump back. I'm way too offensive...maybe I should implement that haha

If you F23 at the beginning of the match you'll clip their bodies mid-jump + get the 1st meter for a 47% combo right off the bat.
 
of course thats how i always used to start, but some characters have faster jump speeds, and those who know this derp strat either jump back or jump straight up.

so the f2 at the beg of the round is prob char specific lol. would be a good thing to test actually (what characters cant deal with f2 at the beg of the rnd)
 

Raynex

Intelligence + Speed + Power
Hmm...I haven't had that happen to me yet, but I'll take your word for it. I don't see why it's considered derp though. He's using a move in his arsenal with good range to sneak a hit in early. Sounds like the haters got to you!
 

Loth Ryo

of house Ryo krypton
This may seem like a super easy match up but im having trouble aganist doomsday, not sure how to punish ( its only aganist my friends doomsday)

We rarely uses trait, and when he does I usually can use mine to get it off so thats not the problem.

The biggest issue is that I have a hard time dodging his specials, and im also not sure how to punish when I do.

Also any good wake ups attacks to use ( he often will tele-jump right to me if he gets a knock down)

Quick edit- He also will try to go for doomsday d+3 trip alot
 
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