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Strategy Corner Setups.

Burgesssssss

Burgesssssss

Noob
I mentioned in a previous thread that ending Corner BnBs with 112, Silly Slide, puts Harley in the corner, reversing the opponents wakeup, as well as allowing for a possible f2 due to the block confusion.

However, landing the f2 into Tantrum Stance comes with the problem that it'll eventually bring both players back to midscreen, so I devised a couple combos that keep your opponent in the corner, allowing for continuous pressure.

Here are, once again, some low quality videos to demonstrate. The combo at the start is simply an altered cornered BnB, which ends in 112 Silly Slide. This is simply to recreate the fight conditions as close as possible.

f2,3>Silly Slide>112>Tantrum Stance,1>12> Play Doctor. 36%

f2,3>Silly Slide>1>f1,3, tiny walk towards the corner>112>Play Doctor. 38%

f2,3>Silly Slide>1>f1,3>f1>Supermove>Play Doctor. 52%

After the Silly Slide, you must wait for your opponent to fall a little bit, otherwise, landing the 1 will cause it to hit your opponent to the other side.

Another note, the frame window for these to land is very small. So small, that if you record it in practice mode, sometimes they get dropped in playback lol I've been able to consistently land them in training mode though, so practice seems to be key.

*EDIT* After testing, it seems the Supermove doesn't connect on female hitboxes. So for female characters, remove the f1,3.

Also, upon practice, I've realised the perfect time to hit 1 after the Silly Slide is when the opponent is falling parallel to the ground. Hope this helps some people.
 
Burgesssssss

Burgesssssss

Noob
Just found out, if your opponent tries to spam poke d1 their way out of things (tested against Raven cause I know her d1 is 7), they'll eat the f2. Not sure if anyone has a faster d1 than that, but aye.

PS. I'm trademarking a thread called "Quintessential Quinn". Figured I'm gonna find lots more goodies with her and everyone loves a good pun.
 
1man3letters

1man3letters

Alpha Tarkatan - Moderator
Moderator
i recall Sabin mentioning (on i think it was his pre-release stream) that harley had some funky ass traps in the corner.
care to enlighten us good sir?
 
E

Eshi

Noob
1man3letters said:
i recall Sabin mentioning (on i think it was his pre-release stream) that harley had some funky ass traps in the corner.
care to enlighten us good sir?
Click to expand...
Harley has some hella dumb corner cross-ups. Actually, this trick works outside of the corner too, it's just even harder to tell.

Instead of Play Doctor, end a combo with Tantrum Stance > Forward roll, then neutral jump and j2. If the opponent did not emergency tech, the result is that Harley rolls right next to them on the same side she started... but the NEUTRAL JUMP crosses up on the other side. Once they're used to that, she can delay the neutral jump until they start waking up and it won't cross up. This has something to do with funky hitboxes on laying down opponents, I've seen other characters with similar setups too.
 
1man3letters

1man3letters

Alpha Tarkatan - Moderator
Moderator
Eshi said:
Harley has some hella dumb corner cross-ups. Actually, this trick works outside of the corner too, it's just even harder to tell.

Instead of Play Doctor, end a combo with Tantrum Stance > Forward roll, then neutral jump and j2. If the opponent did not emergency tech, the result is that Harley rolls right next to them on the same side she started... but the NEUTRAL JUMP crosses up on the other side. Once they're used to that, she can delay the neutral jump until they start waking up and it won't cross up. This has something to do with funky hitboxes on laying down opponents, I've seen other characters with similar setups too.
Click to expand...
thats sounds pretty mindfucky alright, i dig it. thanks for the info.
have u tested wakeups against this by chance? (also the odd crossup could fuck with there wakeup inputs which another plus if works)
 
Saint Connor

Saint Connor

Team F.Y.F.
Eshi said:
Harley has some hella dumb corner cross-ups. Actually, this trick works outside of the corner too, it's just even harder to tell.

Instead of Play Doctor, end a combo with Tantrum Stance > Forward roll, then neutral jump and j2. If the opponent did not emergency tech, the result is that Harley rolls right next to them on the same side she started... but the NEUTRAL JUMP crosses up on the other side. Once they're used to that, she can delay the neutral jump until they start waking up and it won't cross up. This has something to do with funky hitboxes on laying down opponents, I've seen other characters with similar setups too.
Click to expand...
Meh..this is sketchy at best. Was trying it on Superman, and while it does work, his AA throw was catching me if I j2 late and his dash punch and super were straight beating me out no mater when I j2. Its viable, but it may work better on some characters than others.

Edit- Was trying it some more just to make sure I was doing it fast enough and got the weird cross up on Supes...funny thing is he woke up with super into corner...I managed to jump it but the active frames are so damn long that when I was coming down with j2, it still fucking hit me, lolz. Superman OP.
 
E

Eshi

Noob
Saint Connor said:
Meh..this is sketchy at best. Was trying it on Superman, and while it does work, his AA throw was catching me if I j2 late and his dash punch and super were straight beating me out no mater when I j2. Its viable, but it may work better on some characters than others.

Edit- Was trying it some more just to make sure I was doing it fast enough and got the weird cross up on Supes...funny thing is he woke up with super into corner...I managed to jump it but the active frames are so damn long that when I was coming down with j2, it still fucking hit me, lolz. Superman OP.
Click to expand...
Rising Grab and Flying Punch have a directional input and it's a cross-up. If he guesses the wrong direction then you still win, the same as blocking in the wrong direction. His super is incredibly good and should always be respected. These are not good reasons to call the setup "sketchy" IMO.

EDIT: Actually, I found a character specific oddity that makes it really difficult to punish on reaction. On catwoman, all I have to do is vary the height that TS connects at and neutral jump immediately. If TS hits low to the ground, Harley lands in the front. if TS hits higher, Harley crosses up. I wonder how many other characters it applies to.
 
Burgesssssss

Burgesssssss

Noob
Another little trick. Say you've played a few sets with someone and they've caught onto your Silly Slide shenanigans. Delaying the input of Silly Slide after the 112 keeps your opponent in the corner, allowing for another normal corner bnb mixup attempt.
 
Saint Connor

Saint Connor

Team F.Y.F.
Eshi said:
Rising Grab and Flying Punch have a directional input and it's a cross-up. If he guesses the wrong direction then you still win, the same as blocking in the wrong direction. His super is incredibly good and should always be respected. These are not good reasons to call the setup "sketchy" IMO.

EDIT: Actually, I found a character specific oddity that makes it really difficult to punish on reaction. On catwoman, all I have to do is vary the height that TS connects at and neutral jump immediately. If TS hits low to the ground, Harley lands in the front. if TS hits higher, Harley crosses up. I wonder how many other characters it applies to.
Click to expand...
*shrug* It just feels inconsistant. Maybe it has something to do with that last part where it depends on how high they are on the TS.
 
C

Cypress131

Noob
Burgesssssss said:
Another little trick. Say you've played a few sets with someone and they've caught onto your Silly Slide shenanigans. Delaying the input of Silly Slide after the 112 keeps your opponent in the corner, allowing for another normal corner bnb mixup attempt.
Click to expand...
I saw this too! If you time the SS just right, and jump straight up, it looks like when you come down you hit them with a crossup but land infront of them. It's delicious.
 
Burgesssssss

Burgesssssss

Noob
In light of the recent patch fixing Harley's Super in the corner, the Super specific combo is no longer needed. You can simply replace Play Doctor with Super instead, allowing for the Play Doctor, or any combo ender, to come after. I'm pretty sure JF3, Oopsy Daisy is more damage, but personally I like mah standing reset :)
 
E

Eshi

Noob
I honestly don't think Play Doctor is a very good ender in the corner. It could depend on the match-up but in general it leaves harley at no advantage so it's just as risky for her as it is for the opponent.
 
Burgesssssss

Burgesssssss

Noob
Well anything with a knock down gives the opponent chance of a wakeup. I know some wakeups don't get proper invulnerability, while others do. Tantrum Stance for example, gives full blow invulnerability, so trying this corner setups against another Harley who catches on to your Silly Slide cross up, will see you eating her Trantrum Stance. MB Play Doctor also gives your combo an extra 6% unscaled damage. I'm sure every other MB in the game adds on maybe 1 or 2%. That's why Play Doctor is full of win. Sure you're neutral, but so much good can come out of it.

Another thread of mine gives a somewhat closer understanding to which moves get invulnerability on wakeup. Here's the link http://testyourmight.com/threads/cupcake-bomb-tech-you-say.30456/
Basicly all green moves do not get invulnerability, while any move of any other color, or any move not listed, does get it. I think... :S

Timing for wakeups also seems to be funky. Unlike MK9, where you could spam the inputs on the ground, it seems you have to wait until your character is actually getting up in order for it to come out as a wakeup attack.
 
Burgesssssss

Burgesssssss

Noob
Toying a little bit more, I've found that pretty much the same combo can be performed using d2 instead of f2,3. Sure, you give up damage, and it can be blocked, but it can be effective against wakeups without invulnerability. It' also blows up Batman's Super move cause it's 2 hits lol It doesn't seem to work if you do it before the "HAWWWWWWWWW" thing Batman does before a Super, but it works afterwards. Probs works on other moves that are slow to start up too.
 
xWEBSx

xWEBSx

Too old for this Shit
Burgesssssss said:
Toying a little bit more, I've found that pretty much the same combo can be performed using d2 instead of f2,3. Sure, you give up damage, and it can be blocked, but it can be effective against wakeups without invulnerability. It' also blows up Batman's Super move cause it's 2 hits lol It doesn't seem to work if you do it before the "HAWWWWWWWWW" thing Batman does before a Super, but it works afterwards. Probs works on other moves that are slow to start up too.
Click to expand...
Funny thing about her D2... It can hit 1 time or 2 depending how close you are to opponent.. Further you are from them, the more likely the first arm flail will miss, and second may connect causing one hit.. Think it is another awesome Harley character trait :)

Have also been playing with alternatives to J2,2,U3,1,1,2 (or F1,F3)...
Specially in corner..

J2,2,B3xxTS-1,TS-2
J2,3,3xxTS-1,TS-2

The thing I like about landing TS-2 in the corner is that they can't read what you will do once you get up cause you are both on the floor (ultimately ontop of one another) just wish she hopped up from TS-2 a bit quicker.. :)
 
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