Match-up Discussion Nightwing Matchup Discussion

[Big Pampering]

never thought I would be playing the same main character as some players I have seen posting in this forum, its really weird.

 

[NightwingDayZero]

Hey

I'm a pretty shitty NW but I wanna get very good w him and at this point declaring him as my main

All help is welcomed and ill help however I can

Escrima is very useful for punishing, it took me a couple of days, but you'll soon find you have much better range with the kali sticks than you realize.

Escrima Go To Pokes:

B2 - this is a 6 frame overhead that reaches somewhere around 1/4 of the screen. This poke is safe on block, and if you can convert can be cancelled into DF2 F3 ji3xxdb2 for ~35% damage. You can also convert on the ground bounce if you don't react quickly enough - but the timing is much more strict.

B112 - this string is cancelable on the second hit and reaches 1/8 of the screen. This is the farthest reaching string we have. It's got great priority and is safe on block. The last hit of the string is a kick that will send your opponent flying into their corner.

D12 - this is a quick two hit mid, safe on block. great start up. can be cancelled into DF2 for full combo.

My strategy for getting in thus far:

jDB1 controls a lot of space in the air and builds meter fairly well. A lot of my opponents online like to jump - this blows them up and trains them into staying grounded. The closer I get, the lower on the ground I'll DB1. If I feel like they might punish me, I'll delay the MB option and keep pressure up. Nightwing's walk speed is very good, and as soon as I'm in range for any of the above mentioned - let the mind games begin. Feel them out with B2. Train them into blocking low with D12 and then hit them with B2. Just be really disrespectful. If they're not blocking the 6 frame overhead, keep pounding them with it.

ji3 is +1 on block. If you feel like you can get away with a jump in, this isn't a bad option. I've found the spacing on the ji2 cross up is really strict.

Also, if you're expecting a jump in and can't get a solid AA off - MBb3 will armor up your b3 and blow their shit up with a wall bounce.

These are just my observations. I played Guile in Vanilla SF4, I played Adon in SSF4, and Reptile in MK9. This is the first fighting game I'm going to try and get competitive with. I truly believe Nightwing has the tools to make that a reality.

As a side note: Ares j1 will blow up every jumping attack we have and will beat out wingdings if he's close enough. I don't even bother with Escrima against him. Out zone him with staff db2 and when he teleports counter his bs block strings with d1.

 

[DocCeaser]

D12 - this is a quick two hit low, safe on block. great start up. can be cancelled into DF2 for full combo.

D12 is two mid hits. Most people online tend to block it low anyway but I really don't see a reason to block low a lot against Nightwing in escrima. He gets nothing off of them except a knockdown,which is scary but its not 30% damage like he gets off of overheads.

 

[7r17r1]

Working on stance change in a string to land a staff ground spark MB against people who don't want to block low

after b1 or 33 for example

 

[DocCeaser]

The only string that I know of that gives enough advantage on block to do that and not get interrupted is 112. Even then you can see stance change xx ground spark coming easily.

 

[Saitsu]

Working on stance change in a string to land a staff ground spark MB against people who don't want to block low

after b1 or 33 for example

That's pretty good actually, should work that in.

Like a b11 or d12~4 xx MB db3. If it's blocked, you're + and can do whatever. If it hits, 35-40% (except in the corner, been having trouble doing things off of MB Ground Blast in the corner).

 

[Chongo]

Hey

I'm a pretty shitty NW but I wanna get very good w him and at this point declaring him as my main

All help is welcomed and ill help however I can

Before you begin to do what these people are recommending, you gotta get the Dick puns down first.

Priorities man.

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Alright well, dealing with a character with a good AA can be tough. Thankfully, we have Wing Dings. Solid projectile and it halts your air trajectory meaning it will fuck with AA timing. Between that and j3, the opponent will have an annoying time dealing with a jumping Nightwing.

B2 is a tool you should use a good amount. It's Nightwing's farthest reaching normal in Escrima, safe on block to everything except Kyrptonian Crush and leads to solid damage on hit.

D12 should be abused like his d1 in Staff. It's +8 on block (supposedly...it's definitely + though so it doesn't matter that much) and can cancel into Escrima Fury or just into Staff Stance (and from there into Staff Spin or MB Ground Blast).

Now the main way to open someone up in Escrima, other than frame traps and pressure brought with d12 is his Flip Kick. That is his money. If you're close enough (and you'll be surprised of how generous of a range you're given to do this) it will CROSSUP. If you've ever played or watched SFxT, watch a Hwoarang use an EX Dynamite Heel for the same effect. This shit is deadly. If you use it normally, it's 10% and a hard KD. MB it, the opponent just lost 35-40% AND gets put into a Hard KD again (if you decide to finish the followup combo with Flip Kick rather than another ender). This leads to a vortex where the opponent has to worry about either Flip Kick or F3. Whereas other character's pressure is done with high/low or a grab game, NW's is with Left/Right. And most will not see that coming.

He also has ways where you can finish juggles with f213, and cancel the last hit with Ground Spark and dash cancel that forward, granting a quick boost in momentum. Doing that into a Flip Kick sends opponents into fits.

Of course, at any time you can do strings or finish juggles going into Staff Stance and work that way too.

Lastly for now since I really want to go to sleep, REMEMBER THE AUTO WAYS THAT FORCE A STANCE SWITCH. What I mean is, I'm sure you've noticed that there are times where a certain action will do an automatic stance switch. I'll list them here.

Forced into Escrima:
Start of Match
Throw
Clash

Forced into Staff:
Dark as Night

Remember this if you do or do not want to enter certain stances at certain times.

Great great info thanks

What combo r u doing off of db3 MB in escrima?

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

never thought I would be playing the same main character as some players I have seen posting in this forum, its really weird.

Lol yea I feel same way

I know I'm the grey duckling in the room lol

High guys I'm pig, I play Kenshi but now using NW

***receives the stink eye

GuamoKun help me out we r CSz brothers

 

[GuamoKun]

Great great info thanks

What combo r u doing off of db3 MB in escrima?

just follow it up with b3 into whatever

 

[Saitsu]

Great great info thanks

What combo r u doing off of db3 MB in escrima?

MB db3, b3, j3, f213 xx db3. Solid damage and grants that hard KD to continue the vortex. You could also...

MB db3, b3, j3, j3 xx j.db1 Think that's the highest damage and grants range. And lastly.

MB db3, b3, j3, f213~4 xx db3. Puts you in Staff Stance if you want to start annoying that way.

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Before you begin to do what these people are recommending, you gotta get the Dick puns down first.

Priorities man.

Lol yea I wanna get him so I can take my dick to tournaments and penetrate everyone in pools

Lmao

 

[Saitsu]

Lol yea I wanna get him so I can take my dick to tournaments and penetrate everyone in pools

Lmao

Alright, you're officially one of us. Welcome to the club buddy.

 

[Chongo]

Alright, you're officially one of us. Welcome to the club buddy.

This, my friend, is how men bond.

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Saitsu

Can I get u to play sabin's lantern so I see what to do in that MU?

I feel it's tough currently for NW to get in and he can't out zone lantern IMO

I see what to do vs aqua man thanks to u and chef

 

[Saitsu]

Uh...sure. But even I don't know what to do in that matchup, I face very few Lanterns. But I always relish a chance to play Sabin. I'm still salty about him knocking me out in KOF at NEC a while back.

 

[Saitsu]

Alright double post but necessary. I have to revise the semi-vortex. I didn't take into account that when close, Dick often completely whiffs f3 against a ducking opponent and when really close, Flip Kick has the same problem. Flip Kick's is easily solved by just adding a string before hand or just taking a slight step back. f3 is just not going to work though.

I could try doing f213 xx Flip Kick and f213~4 xx Ground Blast as a potential mixup but idk if that would be good enough. If anyone has any ideas, feel free to share.

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Uh...sure. But even I don't know what to do in that matchup, I face very few Lanterns. But I always relish a chance to play Sabin. I'm still salty about him knocking me out in KOF at NEC a while back.

Thus far I feel like this could be a problematic MU for us and we should put our heads together on it

 

[Saitsu]

Thus far I feel like this could be a problematic MU for us and we should put our heads together on it

Agreed. From what I've noticed from playing NW since launch, he struggles against characters that can stay at the top of the screen. GL, Supes, Hawkgirl. He really doesn't have much to deal with them doing so. But these matchups I feel showcase why Escrima can be important. We NEED that huge burst of offense once we get in and land a hit. When we grab the momentum we cannot afford to lose it until we get a sizeable life lead, in which case we can Staff away a win.

 

[DocCeaser]

Alright double post but necessary. I have to revise the semi-vortex. I didn't take into account that when close, Dick often completely whiffs f3 against a ducking opponent and when really close, Flip Kick has the same problem. Flip Kick's is easily solved by just adding a string before hand or just taking a slight step back. f3 is just not going to work though.

I could try doing f213 xx Flip Kick and f213~4 xx Ground Blast as a potential mixup but idk if that would be good enough. If anyone has any ideas, feel free to share.

Why not try b2 instead of f3? You lose the benefit of jumping with both attacks but b2 is much harder to react to. By the time they realize that you didn't do flip kick they probably will have been hit already.

 

[Saitsu]

Why not try b2 instead of f3? You lose the benefit of jumping with both attacks but b2 is much harder to react to. By the time they realize that you didn't do flip kick they probably will have been hit already.

Yeah, that can work to.

I also figured a couple of things.

First, in juggles, using a f213~4 xx db34, dash forward ender will get you in good position to start. If only it was a pixel more forward it'd be perfect for an ambiguous setup. It's still solid though.

And another, the main thing to notice about the original vortex failing is...it relies on the opponent ducking. Nightwing has no threatening lows in Escrima and his two vortex options are overheads. Unless opponent's are reading this thread it probably won't occur to them too early to duck to avoid the overheads as it's a complete contradiction to the usual thought process. When they do figure it out...we still have B2 so yeah.

Feel free to play around with this more to see if you find things I missed.

 

[GuamoKun]

vs. DeathStroke:

use Ground Spark in Staff Stance to counter his zoning. You still have to be patient but you can stop his shenanigans.

 

[AssassiN]

Yeah, that can work to.

I also figured a couple of things.

First, in juggles, using a f213~4 xx db34, dash forward ender will get you in good position to start. If only it was a pixel more forward it'd be perfect for an ambiguous setup. It's still solid though.

And another, the main thing to notice about the original vortex failing is...it relies on the opponent ducking. Nightwing has no threatening lows in Escrima and his two vortex options are overheads. Unless opponent's are reading this thread it probably won't occur to them too early to duck to avoid the overheads as it's a complete contradiction to the usual thought process. When they do figure it out...we still have B2 so yeah.

Feel free to play around with this more to see if you find things I missed.

Maybe work in the use of 4~DB2 MB into that vortex.
What I'm doing at the moment is using B2 to make them block, then cancel into flipkick/ground spark/4~ground spark.
Only played this game for a couple of hours, so I don't know much yet about Nightwing.

Any advice against Black Adam?

 

[GuamoKun]

Maybe work in the use of 4~DB2 MB into that vortex.
What I'm doing at the moment is using B2 to make them block, then cancel into flipkick/ground spark/4~ground spark.
Only played this game for a couple of hours, so I don't know much yet about Nightwing.

Any advice against Black Adam?

Against Black Adam you kinda wanna be a bit more patient since he will win the trade in zoning and has better mobility, but Nightwing has the advantage upclose so its all about getting in.

 

[Saitsu]

Maybe work in the use of 4~DB2 MB into that vortex.
What I'm doing at the moment is using B2 to make them block, then cancel into flipkick/ground spark/4~ground spark.
Only played this game for a couple of hours, so I don't know much yet about Nightwing.

Any advice against Black Adam?

Yeah, I'm considering that too. Right now here are the options.

(MB) Flip Kick
(MB) f3
b2
4 xx db2 MB

Left/Right/High/Low

Just have to make it flow well.