Possible New Tech

[Pagan]

Anything that gives Scorpion even a remote edge is viable.

I was testing this earlier but for a safe E. Teleport setup. Since Scorpion's E. Teleport is advantage on block but easy to stuff, doing it off a jump kick means your opponent is obligated to block it and possibly whatever comes after the E. Teleport.

 

[Big Pampering]

nice research done there, but why is it so inconsistent?

 

[GGA soonk]

Assuming height of the kick.

 

[Big Pampering]

Assuming height of the kick.

No, there were some occassions were the jumpkick was lower than normal and it suddenly did get blocked. If that were to be true it would just be a just frame teleport and I dont think it is, because I already tried that possibility

 

[charlieonline]

SZ is a large hit box, if it works on SZ then it works on all chars up to large hit box.

The tele seems to whiff if the jik is below a certain height as the blocking opponent doesn't have time to auto correct block at this height after the teleport. The whiff seems to occur when the opponent is block the opposite way due to the fast low teleport.

My conclusion is that higher jik's give more time for the block to correct and switch sides.

 

[GGA soonk]

No, there were some occassions were the jumpkick was lower than normal and it suddenly did get blocked. If that were to be true it would just be a just frame teleport and I dont think it is, because I already tried that possibility

So if the jump kick was lower than normal and it was blocked, then the variable would be the the height of the kick. From what I saw it seems the kick has to be somewhere right around the knee, any higher or lower and it gets blocked.

 

[GrandMasterson]

No, there were some occassions were the jumpkick was lower than normal and it suddenly did get blocked. If that were to be true it would just be a just frame teleport and I dont think it is, because I already tried that possibility

It's the height of the kick for sure, but it seems random with certain characters like Jax. Others are just harder to pinpoint (Sub-Zero), others are totally forgiving and vulnerable (Reptile), and some are rigidly specific (Ermac).

My conclusion is that higher jik's give more time for the block to correct and switch sides.

Could the same be said about the deep JIPs, though? Is the character's auto-correction or Scorpion's teleport properties?

I will mess around with the remaining cast and post the results here later today. This seems like it could be a handy match-up tool rather than an all-around strategy.

 

[GrandMasterson]

After some experimentation in the lab, I've come up with the following results. Those listed in the first block are the most vulnerable because a safe teleport can be performed from a deep blocked JIP, which is the easiest to learn and execute.

The second block of characters are immune to the JIP and their ease of performing a safe blocked JIK teleport is listed from easiest to hardest.

I should also add that the JIK hitboxes are also dependent on the stance of the character. Everyone listed had their chest facing the camera when I tested this. I haven't tested it with their backs facing the camera, so that has yet to be explored.



Reptile - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is upper to mid thigh. Very forgiving and consistent hitbox.

Ermac - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is upper to mid thigh. Forgiving and consistent hitbox.

Cyrax -Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Forgiving and consistent hitbox.

Scorpion - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Forgiving and consistent hitbox.

Noob - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is mid to lower thigh. Forgiving and consistent hitbox.

Baraka - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Forgiving and consistent hitbox.

Smoke - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Kano - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving but consistent hitox.

Shang Tsung - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is right above knee. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Kabal - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Kenshi - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is right above knee. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Rain - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Sindel - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is mid thigh. Very unforgiving hitbox.

Kitana - Vulerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is mid thigh. Very unforgiving hitbox.

Sektor - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Very unforgiving hitbox.

Raiden -Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is right above knee. JIK hitbox is too far out of Scorpion's reach to perform consecutively.

Quan-Chi - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is mid to lower thigh. Unforgiving and seems random.

Skarlet - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving and seems random.




Freddy - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Forgiving and consistent hitbox.

Liu Kang - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is right above knee. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Kung Lao - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is right above knee. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Sub-Zero - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is right above knee. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Mileena - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox

Nightwolf - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox

Sheeva - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is right above knee. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Johnny Cage - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Very unforgiving hitbox.

Stryker - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Very unforgiving hitbox.

Cyber Sub-Zero - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving and seems random.

Jade - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is too random to be effective.

Sonya - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is too random to be effective.

Jax - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is too random to be effective.

 

[charlieonline]

After some experimentation in the lab, I've come up with the following results. Those listed in the first block are the most vulnerable because a safe teleport can be performed from a deep blocked JIP, which is the easiest to learn and execute.

The second block of characters are immune to the JIP and their ease of performing a safe blocked JIK teleport is listed from easiest to hardest.

I should also add that the JIK hitboxes are also dependent on the stance of the character. Everyone listed had their chest facing the camera when I tested this. I haven't tested it with their backs facing the camera, so that has yet to be explored.



Reptile - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is upper to mid thigh. Very forgiving and consistent hitbox.

Ermac - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is upper to mid thigh. Forgiving and consistent hitbox.

Cyrax -Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Forgiving and consistent hitbox.

Scorpion - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Forgiving and consistent hitbox.

Noob - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is mid to lower thigh. Forgiving and consistent hitbox.

Baraka - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Forgiving and consistent hitbox.

Smoke - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Kano - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving but consistent hitox.

Shang Tsung - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is right above knee. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Kabal - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Kenshi - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is right above knee. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Rain - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Sindel - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is mid thigh. Very unforgiving hitbox.

Kitana - Vulerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is mid thigh. Very unforgiving hitbox.

Sektor - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Very unforgiving hitbox.

Raiden -Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is right above knee. JIK hitbox is too far out of Scorpion's reach to perform consecutively.

Quan-Chi - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is mid to lower thigh. Unforgiving and seems random.

Skarlet - Vulnerable to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving and seems random.




Freddy - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Forgiving and consistent hitbox.

Liu Kang - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is right above knee. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Kung Lao - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is right above knee. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Sub-Zero - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is right above knee. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Mileena - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox

Nightwolf - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox

Sheeva - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is right above knee. Unforgiving but consistent hitbox.

Johnny Cage - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Very unforgiving hitbox.

Stryker - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Very unforgiving hitbox.

Cyber Sub-Zero - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is lower thigh. Unforgiving and seems random.

Jade - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is too random to be effective.

Sonya - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is too random to be effective.

Jax - Immune to deep JIP, JIK hitbox is too random to be effective.

We need some sort of sick graph to easily display this information reading that, while informative, makes me forget all my stats formulas for class.

 

[Pagan]

Maybe I'm more used to crazy timing from playing Guilty Gear but the JIP is actually quite doable on a lot of them you just have to delay the teleport.

 

[Big Pampering]

Maybe I'm more used to crazy timing from playing Guilty Gear but the JIP is actually quite doable on a lot of them you just have to delay the teleport.

the opponent wont wait for you to be around their lower part of the body to counter you, you will probably eat an uppercut or even a good spaced D1

 

[Pagan]

the opponent wont wait for you to be around their lower part of the body to counter you, you will probably eat an uppercut or even a good spaced D1

I'm not understanding your grammar here.

Do you mean if you delay the JIP?

I'm talking about the teleport. You only delay it by maybe 3 frames at the most. That's not too big a difference in timing.

 

[GGA soonk]

I think he means you're going to have a hard time going for a deep punch and will prolly be anti-aired before the right time to punch.

 

[Truth]

I'm not sure if this is related but I have seen on PL's stream, him intentionally whiffing the JIP and then doing scorpion's teleport which for some reason doesn't hit the opponent similar to the video.

 

[Pagan]

I think he means you're going to have a hard time going for a deep punch and will prolly be anti-aired before the right time to punch.

Ah okay, that's what I thought. That's not what I was talking about anyway. I meant delaying the teleport after the JIP. The timing on canceling air attacks vs ground attacks is way different and you can do a special after recovering from a normal =)

 

[GodsLonelyman]

Gotta love the inconsistent hitboxes on characters in MK9.

 

[GGA soonk]

Gotta love the inconsistent hitboxes on characters in MK9.

It's like that in other fighters, too, I think, and makes sense if each character is a different size. My complaint is with hurtboxes that extend past the model(also happens in other fighters, but still annoying).

 

[Big Pampering]

I think he means you're going to have a hard time going for a deep punch and will prolly be anti-aired before the right time to punch.

jup, thanks for clearing it up.

 

[The-Sky-Cries]

Current queston.
Is Scorpions D-1 or standing a better AA? D1 is quicker, but loses to air kicks, but will standing 3 beat air kick? If so, D-1 is universally the better anti air.

Hey guys, I was wonder if someone could answer my question which is "Is Scorpions B-2 A viable anti air"?

I know it has anti air properties, but what I'm really asking is like can I use B-2 on reaction whenever someone jumps and catch them with it..... Or to AA someone with it, you gotta rely on luck.

If it isn't I guess I'll have to practice D-1 people in the air.

What I found that works for AAing
- D1 will work as you'd expect

-Standing 3 is amazing for AA too, and you can teleport after it for a combo.

-And finally, B-2 Is a terrible anti-air (For On reaction) If they are in a certain range, (The range is about how far your characters are apart when you start a fight.) But if you are in a D-4 range, It's great, because It can catch them even if they don't jump, and if they do jump while they are that close, your blade will catch them anyways.

Can anyone test if after a standing 3 AA for a Standing 3,3 AA, can you follow up with a teleport to combo.?

 

[Lord Beef]

Hey guys, I was wonder if someone could answer my question which is "Is Scorpions B-2 A viable anti air"?

I know it has anti air properties, but what I'm really asking is like can I use B-2 on reaction whenever someone jumps and catch them with it..... Or to AA someone with it, you gotta rely on luck.

If it isn't I guess I'll have to practice D-1 people in the air.

Its a pretty decent anti air, plus it leads to vortex set up, so I would say go for it, I know I've been caught by it a time or two. Why I was jumping in in scorpion when it wasn't a whiff spear punish....ill never know.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk

 

[The-Sky-Cries]

Its a pretty decent anti air, plus it leads to vortex set up, so I would say go for it, I know I've been caught by it a time or two. Why I was jumping in in scorpion when it wasn't a whiff spear punish....ill never know.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk

Thanks for trying to help, but I was asking more like can I use it on reaction whenever someone jumps, or is it too slow to do that. Instead of asking can I Hit confirm something, I'm asking can I anti-air confirm it lol.

 

[emerc]

It's a bit too slow to use on reaction, but it's very strong otherwise. d1 or standing 3 are much quicker options.


I like to use it in 'corner jailing' situations, much like sub-zero ice clone, because it has a different timing.. When I got a good read on when the opponent will jump, it does the job of bringing the hurt.

 

[Sasuga]

A friend of mine uses it as an anti air on reaction. Pretty consistent. When I try to cross him up I sometimes eat it when I've already jumped over him. This thing has a hitbox the size of Russia.

 

[OutworldKeith]

its good but can be stopped by jik's
d+1 & standing 3 are better and less punishable

 

[Big Pampering]

it is pretty slow and you have to be seeing people comin from a mile away, at the same time it may be stuffed by cross up. either way D1 is much better