Current EVO Numbers For MKXL Release, Any Thoughts?

[dribirut]

https://www.facebook.com/NowThisNews/videos/1080161165407340/

We don't have this level of commitment

 

[trufenix]

Take pride in having 300+ players who want to travel and support our game a year later? Heaven's no. Let's talk about how many aren't going. It'll be great.

 

[Son ov Timett]

For me it's the core mechanics. Not worth a 4hr drive through the desert, and a few hundred bucks to boot, to tackle 50/50s and smothering offensive booty sweat. Such a shame, as I loved MK9 more than my left nut, and now dont even want to leave my apt to drive 10 miles for casuals to practice it's successor.

 

[Grape Juice City]

But which one is it?

On one hand, you have so many people complaining about broke stuff (mainly those who play the game), and you have those who claim they stopped playing it because of the patching.

Aren't these two directly contradictory? If you don't patch, there will be more broke stuff, and literally nobody wants that.

Actually in the case of MKX, the two are not contradictory. Despite the amount of patches it's received, consensus is, and seemingly always has been, that the game is still mostly imbalanced. I think the issue NRS has faced with its patches is that they've never actually succeeded in balancing the game to a point where players felt the majority of the cast were viable in tournament. Instead they've only ever succeeded in shifting the landscape of top and bottom tiers. The best example of this being Tanya and Alien, to where alot of people feel the latter is just a re-skinned, pre-patched version of the former. Which begs the question; what's the point of continuously patching the game when the end result is ultimately the same?

So in essence, they're not really solving one problem as much as they're creating a new one.

 

[coolwhip]

Actually in the case of MKX, the two are not contradictory. Despite the amount of patches it's received, consensus is, and seemingly always has been, that the game is still mostly imbalanced. I think the issue NRS has faced with its patches is that they've never actually succeeded in balancing the game to a point where players felt the majority of the cast were viable in tournament. Instead they've only ever succeeded in shifting the landscape of top and bottom tiers. The best example of this being Tanya and Alien, to where alot of people feel the latter is just a re-skinned, pre-patched version of the former. Which begs the question; what's the point of continuously patching the game when the end result is ultimately the same?

So in essence, they're not really solving one problem as much as they're creating a new one.

Is the concept really that complicated?

Capcom guys are against repeated patching. Which would inevitably lead to broken shit being kept in the game far longer than it should.

How is that not contradictory to repeated patching? By definition, it is.

The gripe with most from outside the community isn't that NRS isn't getting it right with the patches. They are against frequent patches as a concept. Have you guys not been here for the 292950 debates we've had about this on TYM, and arguments with Ultra David, Viscant, etc...?

 

[coolwhip]

I still find it humorous that some think the likes of Justin, PR Balrog, etc... would actually play the game seriously a year after its release had it not been for patches.

 

[ILuvFightGames]

1) 50/50's
2) Oh/low 50/50 mixups.

/thread

 

[Tweedy]

Man, what a problem to have.

"Guys, the developer is trying to improve and support the game too much."

Especially when you consider all the old MK9 heads who wanted, "one more patch." You can't have it both ways.

Also, most of the Capcom guys' central argument for being against patching was the talk that they would have to "start over," which roughly translates to, "I can't treat this game as my side piece and do well without staying current, it's the developer's fault."

Baffling nonsense.

Tbh i'm not sure if this is a good mentality. Patching definitely helps, but I think the main issue is that balance wise, these games aren't as far along as Capcom's games when they release. Yes Raiden was dumb. Still, if you're Justin Wong trying to qualify for Capcom Cup, play Marvel, etc, how annoying is it that when you do decide to pop in MKX, your character plays differently?

I think it's very telling that we're left with 200-400 people after every year, regardless of how popular the first year of each game was. We're left with the same people who really just play NRS games, and will play them through all of the patches. Players like Alucard, Justin Wong, etc, and a bunch of other people, just dropped it completely for SFV or another game.

The problem is that these games comes out so much faster than Capcom games, and they really try to change it up. This of course makes it a lot harder to get the game in a good state, balance wise, at release. It's just not really possible. The community and developers just have to decide if we're gonna let things rocks, in an attempt to keep offline regulars from signing up for Injustice 2/MK11, or are we just gonna drop patch after patch until only the hardcore boyz are left.

I think that's the reality atm. Just my 2 cents of course.

 

[Sutter Pain]

It seems maybe part of the problem is WB is setting a super strict schedule for them and they do not have time to properly balance the game\dlc before new game and more DLC comes out.

Regardless NRS\WB is fucking slaying it money wise with these 2ish year release cycles games always sell amazing.

 

[NaCl man]

__^__^__^__^____________ looks like we lost him... rip Mkx

 

[Asodimazze]

Is it strange that the games with the best online have the lowest number of registered players?

Since we have the new online here in EU we had Viennality with around 100 registered players (5k guaranteed), Hypespotting with 40 something (10k £ pot) Stunfest with 33 or so (3k € pot). Almost every PS4 ESL tournament had FAR more players than that...people don't really need to play offline to play a "real" match since the netcode is so good. ESL gives a lot of prizes too and the players don't have to invest 1$ to enjoy the competition....can't blame people for not going to events.

Having Foxy and Sonicfox dominating everything in EU and the US also doesn't help the situation, it's kinda sad but many players don't want to invest money because their victory is almost certain.

Also, I don't know how the other players see it but for me EVO is nothing more than another US major. The most prestigious tournament for MKX are the ESL finals.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

You're gonna have your Crimsonshadows of the world come in here and say opposite and try to spin this but the sauce is off the hot dog

1180 to 300 drop is what? 74% (I just woke up) ? That is extremely steep

This game day 1-now has had some of the most broken shit ever and it's infuriating and I think people are just overall frustrated w it.

Who Knows though, maybe 300-500 more will sign up in 3 weeks. I definitely expect 100 more between now and then

Estimating # at 418

I do agree our "evo" has become Esl

To me Esl > evo now and Mkx has succeeded heavily there. For Mkx I feel fine staying at home spending $0 money to compete w the coin flips but traveling I feel it's questionable

There's no spin.

We've always had major drop offs from the first year of any new game to the next, and in part this shows just how big MKX was in it's first year (and how many people crossed over from other games to play it).

But it's clear that this game is not engaging the broader FGC, and even within our own community it's highly controversial due to the design choices that were made. Many of these things were evident early on -- but the more people play the game, the more they start to come around and admit that they're true.

This shouldn't stop the people who love the game from playing/watching it (and kudos to those who will still go and represent the community; but I've always said that people shouldn't force themselves to play something they don't enjoy, and that applies here as well.

Everyone already knows that I still enjoy playing MKX, but I'm not deluded at all about the reasons it's not as attractive as it could be to many. Dave and I both pointed them out pretty early on.

 

[Rude]

Tbh i'm not sure if this is a good mentality. Patching definitely helps, but I think the main issue is that balance wise, these games aren't as far along as Capcom's games when they release. Yes Raiden was dumb. Still, if you're Justin Wong trying to qualify for Capcom Cup, play Marvel, etc, how annoying is it that when you do decide to pop in MKX, your character plays differently?

I think it's very telling that we're left with 200-400 people after every year, regardless of how popular the first year of each game was. We're left with the same people who really just play NRS games, and will play them through all of the patches. Players like Alucard, Justin Wong, etc, and a bunch of other people, just dropped it completely for SFV or another game.

The problem is that these games comes out so much faster than Capcom games, and they really try to change it up. This of course makes it a lot harder to get the game in a good state, balance wise, at release. It's just not really possible. The community and developers just have to decide if we're gonna let things rocks, in an attempt to keep offline regulars from signing up for Injustice 2/MK11, or are we just gonna drop patch after patch until only the hardcore boyz are left.

I think that's the reality atm. Just my 2 cents of course.

I'm sorry that Justin Wong, Viscant, and others can't treat NRS games as their side pieces and expect to stay relevant. How DARE they be expected to keep up like everyone else, right?

I think the false narratives, agenda-pushing of the first few months by community voices didn't help, either. When your community leaders are trashing the game because they're not instantly dominant (something we saw with the beginning of Injustice) it won't make people inclined to stay.

If vanilla MKX were allowed to "let rock," how long would it have actually lasted?

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

I too feel this whole "we quit cause over patching" is the biggest horse shit ever

Those people were gonna quit either way after 2-3 months. The patches just served as an easy way out for them

I'd like to discuss this on stream w anyone who felt they had to "quit" due to over patching

Please tag me (unless it's that madeofmetal egl jagged guy or prinz/aldazo guy. plz ignore this post altogether -
Do not contact me ever in any way)

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

There's no spin.

We've always had major drop offs from the first year of any new game to the next,

Usually it's a 30% maybe 40% drop

Not 74%

A 30%-40% drop is like week 1 civil war to week 2 at the movie theatres

74% is like Xmen apocalypse/batman v superman week 1 to week 2

 

[sirbuddrick]

Just shows u that most people don't take this game seriously no matter what nrs does their games die because they r broken

 

[sirbuddrick]

People need to stop with this esl excuse any fighting game will do big numbers when u can enter from home for free. Mkx is so unbalanced that people who go to evo for multiple games won't register for mkx. @PND_Mustard tried to insult me when I said mkx was dieing but hey guess who was right lol

 

[virtiqaL]

The only "myth" being spread is that this game was ever good to begin with.

I love Mortal Kombat as a franchise, but the game missed the mark when it comes to compelling gameplay/mechanics. The run feature paired with safe, forward-advancing normals, and the 50/50 coinflip shit makes for a game that doesn't have much staying power or generate much hype whether it be for players or viewers. It isn't a rewarding game to play, it's a fucking snooze.

And the argument people tend to make in defense of this game is that it has a good balance compared to MK9 (which I'm not sure you can say anymore with characters like Alien). Ok, you win, it has 'better' balance because every character either has both a low and overhead starter or some other absurd silly bullshit to deal with that at least gives them a chance. But fundamentally, the gameplay falls flat.

Regardless of how you feel about MK9 and those who 'reminisce' about it, it's pretty clear that the NRS community was much more enthusiastic about the game, and it FOR SURE as hell didn't have such a major drop-off in interest/hype after only barely being a year old. Hell, I didn't even enter my first tournament until MK9's second year.

Out of the gate, this game garnered a split reception among the NRS community. Initially, you had reputable players defending the game while implying anyone who had mixed or negative feelings about the gameplay or mechanics were simply scrubs. Then around the time the netcode got fixed, some of these same players started conceding and saying the same damn things the 'scrubs' were saying from the get-go.

So, apparently, the scrubs were right... the game is ass. Nuff said.

 

[OfficialYungmonster]

I think it's the whole "guess right" safe 50/50 gameplay. Oh and Also Alien

 

[SpiceWeasel]

Reason:

 

[sirbuddrick]

Oh and nrs should never make another rekka character they don't know what they r doing rekka aren't spose to be plus or involve mixups. In sf4 rekka were basically for combos and maybe some gimmick stuff. Tbh mkx is fun but it's about as balanced and competitive as an anime game.

 

[Raiderhorn]

I think what Mr. Aquaman is doing for the community with his events and his general attitude towards the game is what we need more of to keep community numbers stable at events.

I think this is also something to consider. A lot of people just aren't happy with this game. I know I've been upset with it a few times. There are just so many different things with or about this game that people get upset about. Things get patched, NRS forgot to fix a problem, or even patched the wrong thing altogether. New characters are announced, people aren't happy with the character choices. This character has X offense, it's too OP. This character has Y fundamentals, they're too weak. This character has Z game-breaking strategy or bug. The netcode isn't good enough. PC got screwed. Etc etc. Whatever it may be, I feel like in general I would RARELY see a thread that didn't involve people berating this game in some way like comparing characters, comparing games, comparing each other..
A big take towards a more relaxed attitude would help a game live longer.

 

[KiD INsAnitY]

You have to damn near relearn your character every other month. And not to mention the fact that we have like 1 or 2 dominant ppl in the community.. I haven't been watching any tournaments lately but it was just Sonic fox (This is evo Son , of course he's coming with the shits)..
Now not saying that's too big of a problem but I can see how ppl would refrain from even signing up.. I mean if the best in our little "Community" can barely take the kid out what does that say for the average Joe? They would just rather sit back and watch at this point... A little diversity in winning would most likely in courage more ppl to sign up and fight... I don't think this is the end all , be all to the problem but it has to effect the numbers alil

 

[Tweedy]

I'm sorry that Justin Wong, Viscant, and others can't treat NRS games as their side pieces and expect to stay relevant. How DARE they be expected to keep up like everyone else, right?

I think the false narratives, agenda-pushing of the first few months by community voices didn't help, either. When your community leaders are trashing the game because they're not instantly dominant (something we saw with the beginning of Injustice) it won't make people inclined to stay.

If vanilla MKX were allowed to "let rock," how long would it have actually lasted?

So you do think it's fair when characters like Raiden and Tanya get nerfed and characters like Mileena, Takeda, Cage, etc are buffed significantly or left alone?

I don't think that's fair. Liu Kang got nerfed and is still pretty good. It's like Paulo randomly decides how badly someone will get nerfed. I know that's not the case, but my point is that the patches are so fast, that they're always going to be unfair. With that in mind, the constant nerfs to characters more than anything, is a total buzzkill. Buffs and fixes should always be the bulk of what we get.

There's a difference between letting Raiden rock and nerfing him to where he's never seen top 16 at a major since the early stages of the game. It's not like people didn't play him either, people were forced into dropping him. For a player like Justin Wong, why would he continue to put time into MKX if his best and favorite character was nerfed from being dope to arguably not being viable at the highest level? It's one thing if the new kids on the block like Takeda and Mileena go even with him, or he beats one and loses to the other. He gets his butthole turned inside out.

 

[JTB123]

You have to damn near relearn your character every other month.

This is just flat out not true. You have to learn how to apply some aspects of your characters game differently or adapt your strategies/tech. Which doesn't take that long.

This "I had to relearn my character" is a massive bill that more often than not only exposes how little people actually knew about their character to begin with.