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Match-Up Discussion - Dragon Naginata Vak's Dragon Naginata MU Chart *Updated*

The Celebrity

The Celebrity

Professional Googler
yungmonster12 said:
High Tech jacqui has no 8-2 mu
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Honest.. How do you play against GM? That is probably the only matchup in the game that I think might be close to 8-2. The only decent thing about it is the fact you can sit full screen and absorb all day long hoping he makes a mistake.
 
Generalbit

Generalbit

The blade of osh-tekk is stale.
To be constructive:
Why is the match different for blood and sun god? Against naginata they play the same, with the exception that blood god takes reduced damage. So if anything blood god should be a harder matchup, and if ur talking about SG's really good AA converts into bigger damage than BG I can see where you come from. But I must still respectfully disagree, against DN who is mainly focused on air game we are essentially looking at barebones kotal. BG nor SG make it easier to keep people out of the air than the other, so they wash on that, SG has bigger conversions but BG reduces ur effectiveness for when you do inevitably tag me. So for this reason I think BG is a harder matchup for DN, but I do believe they are both 5/5. I can easily see how WG beats naginata, but I don't see how it's a 6/4 for BG or SG. Yes b1 is good, d2 is good, d1,d3 are good, but if you counted every character with a viable anti air as beating naginata, you would have no winning matchups. As for the ground game, kotal definitely has better buttons. But even these don't shut you down enough *in BG or SG to take away any of ur options, so for this reason I think SG and BG are both 5/5 and I don't understand why SG was a better matchup for kotal than BG in the 1st place. Tell me tomorrow when we talk and maybe I missed something obscure. Though I doubt it, outside of war god, Kotal's variations are very similar in terms of AA'ing , converting, and dealing with naginata on the ground.

To be deconstructive:
LOL, boo hoo. Ur character sucks waaaah, at least you had your fun at the top

JK though, but do you really think you have this many 7-3? I think we need to go over the definition of a 7-3 mu... Buuuut I guess when you are alone on the island of naginata you can have whatever opinions you want with no consequences. Sometimes I wish I was the only Kotal player, that way I could downplay all I wanted and no one could contradict me. It would be great... jk?
 
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Zoidberg747

Zoidberg747

My blades will find your heart
This is akin to Sheeva's MU chart in MK9. I think some of these might be a tad exaggerated.

CHange the 3-7s to 4-6s and the 2-8s to 3-7s and its a solid chart for sure.
 
Vak Phoenix

Vak Phoenix

Warrior
Generalbit said:
To be constructive:
Why is the match different for blood and sun god? Against naginata they play the same, with the exception that blood god takes reduced damage. So if anything blood god should be a harder matchup, and if ur talking about SG's really good AA converts into bigger damage than BG I can see where you come from. But I must still respectfully disagree, against DN who is mainly focused on air game we are essentially looking at barebones kotal. BG nor SG make it easier to keep people out of the air than the other, so they wash on that, SG has bigger conversions but BG reduces ur effectiveness for when you do inevitably tag me. So for this reason I think BG is a harder matchup for DN, but I do believe they are both 5/5. I can easily see how WG beats naginata, but I don't see how it's a 6/4 for BG or SG. Yes b1 is good, d2 is good, d1,d3 are good, but if you counted every character with a viable anti air as beating naginata, you would have no winning matchups. As for the ground game, kotal definitely has better buttons. But even these don't shut you down enough *in BG or SG to take away any of ur options, so for this reason I think SG and BG are both 5/5 and I don't understand why SG was a better matchup for kotal than BG in the 1st place. Tell me tomorrow when we talk and maybe I missed something obscure. Though I doubt it, outside of war god, Kotal's variations are very similar in terms of AA'ing , converting, and dealing with naginata on the ground.

To be deconstructive:
LOL, boo hoo. Ur character sucks waaaah, at least you had your fun at the top

JK though, but do you really think you have this many 7-3? I think we need to go over the definition of a 7-3 mu... Buuuut I guess when you are alone on the island of naginata you can have whatever opinions you want with no consequences. Sometimes I wish I was the only Kotal player, that way I could downplay all I wanted and no one could contradict me. It would be great... jk?
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Sun god armors through ex bf2, pogo 4,3,1 and i eat that. Blood god cannot parry pogo options and has to take it. Yes he may take reduced damage, but once tanya goes fullscreen and troll and then when kotal goes for sunray, if shes close enough she teleports on him and punishes hard, probably with corner carry. Naginata oki is pretty solid and can only be escaped by certain characters, where as kotal has to take the chip after f43, f42, flip and b2 knockdowns. You cannot wu parry b32 on oki.
Armor against naginata is crucial because everything that she has is fake, if you are keep mashing armor you will probably hit her in the gap and murder her.
 
Espio

Espio

Kokomo
KGA Prosaic said:
Vaks.... Getting anti air isn't on the character, man. Zoning, and anti airs don't contribute to matchups.
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You are mistaken in believing this. A character who is extremely reliant on being in the air and air mobility versus a character with great space control and anti-air capabilities is very likely to give the aforementioned character problems if not outright beat them. Kitana for example has zoning and anti-air conversion capabilities that alone really hurt Dragon Naginata Tanya. Whereas a character that's meant to be played almost entirely on the ground may go even with or even beat Kitana because their core game is not taken away from them when fighting Kitana.

This is pretty meta level one stuff in regards to Naginata Tanya. I don't use her, but it's pretty obvious even from a basic understanding of the character why characters with great air control, zoning or even safe armor are a problem for her design to cope with in match ups.
 
KGA Prosaic

KGA Prosaic

RM Prosaic
I can safely say there isn't anything like Zod vs Luther in this game. Nice sneak diss on the basic meta comment. But really, you all make it seem like you have to play this character one way and one way only. You're blaming an entire match outcome because d2 anti airs. Well of course it does. That's the sole purpose of the move. Doesn't mean it dictates the entire outcome of the matchup. You shouldn't be predictable with the teleports. Stay grounded and space it out.
 
xKhaoTik

xKhaoTik

The Ignore Button Is Free
Assassin does better than RS? Not saying I disagree because she wins either way but I would think RS would do better
 
Vak Phoenix

Vak Phoenix

Warrior
xKhaoTik said:
Assassin does better than RS? Not saying I disagree because she wins either way but I would think RS would do better
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You can freely zone as usual and parry my b2, you take away tanyas important tool against zoners, assassins lift is better in this mu too because it punishes f2 tele pogo on block, where rs tanya can jump over rs lift. But since i cannot check u with b2 and u parry me, its a tough tough match.
 
YoloRoll1stHit

YoloRoll1stHit

Publicly Educated
ismael4790 said:
Playing a character since day one allows you to see his weaknesses, where others can clearly overestimate him for example giving him the same mu numbers as A-List, which is never the case. I was told fisticuffs was still good for months since june 2015 nerf, until people realized that the nerf was actually an overnerf and that he is currently trash.

You can stagger, yes, but the followups after that are not great since his famous nerf, that's why fisticuffs has no real pressure. You see speedbag stop? Just poke or backdash. Even with a bad reaction you will get out with his current frames.

The fact that a character can armor or not through speedbag's gap is a huge thing, believe me. It changes how much they have to respect it. If Cage has to be afraid of doing more than two reps, his "pressure" gets severely hurted. Also if the opponent has fast armor or not changes things. That's why Tremor still suffers vs fisticuffs.

I didn't say he is in the bad situation vs her, but the matchup is not a 6-4 for him.

But anyway, thanks for the observations, at least you made an effort to explain the situation.
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You have to play a DN to see how bad she is. Your shadow kick and fire ball take away all of her long range options and force her to fight melee range. You don't even need to try the buffs on or the B12 stagger. D4, F2, B2, F34 are enough to body her
 
xKhaoTik

xKhaoTik

The Ignore Button Is Free
Mournful? I understand RS and Assassin but I never ever tried the match with mournful lol
 
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