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Question - Kenshi Who is worse than Kenshi?

Awkward Sloth

Lamest Harley, still better sloth than Jer
No this is just tym and not my English class lmao. I don't write ain't on a paper but if I want to use it on an Internet forum I'm allowed to use it and whatever slang I please. Also I said arguably. Someone can argue with you that kitana is top 10 and provide facts and situations and you can oppose them. Either way it comes down to an opinion. On the other hand if someone says kenshi is arguably top 10 that persons argument can get overshadowed by the overwhelming evidence that kenshi is nowhere near top 10. And as far as tanya goes I look at it like this. Base kenshi is worse than Tanya. Now let's look at what they get variation wise. Tanya's tools are better than kenshis. Pyro DOES lose to kenshi. Not denying that. He eliminates the jumping and tele as an option. But as far as the rest goes she probably has more favorable matchups
What are these tools that base pyro Tanya possesses? What kinda nonsense are you talking about?

Gaps for days in 80% of her strings. No real overhead combo starter (f3 fully charged does not count so don't you even) sub par zoning.

She loses to almost every other zoner in the game and is free to pressure rush down characters. It's actually hard for me to think of a winning match up for her. Prolly High tech Jacquie but that's like a freebie to most characters. She use to have more favorable match ups but patches continuously Nerfed her all the while buffing the other characters she could beat before.

She has low damage output meterless and metered. Low 20s meterless high 20s for a bar. They've nerfed her damage 3 times now when before she could get 31% for a bar.

She annoys with her air mobility till you realize everything she's doing is punishable.

@Vak Phoenix Can you think of winning match ups for Pyro?
 

exflyingbooty

This dream has a sad ending
What are these tools that base pyro Tanya possesses? What kinda nonsense are you talking about?

Gaps for days in 80% of her strings. No real overhead combo starter (f3 fully charged does not count so don't you even) sub par zoning.

She loses to almost every other zoner in the game and is free to pressure rush down characters. It's actually hard for me to think of a winning match up for her. Prolly High tech Jacquie but that's like a freebie to most characters. She use to have more favorable match ups but patches continuously Nerfed her all the while buffing the other characters she could beat before.

She has low damage output meterless and metered. Low 20s meterless high 20s for a bar. They've nerfed her damage 3 times now when before she could get 31% for a bar.

She annoys with her air mobility till you realize everything she's doing is punishable.

@Vak Phoenix Can you think of winning match ups for Pyro?
She beats grand master funny enough and she can get 33% for one bar but she needs shroud u__u
 

colby4898

Special Forces Sonya Up-player
And those ones you mentioned should also get help, of course.
I always said it. People should stop thinking about variations as part of the same character, in most cases they only share the name. Fisticuffs Cage for example, has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING in common with A-List. So saying, "hey, you have other variations that are good, play them", adds nothing, it's a nonsense way to comfort people and try to make them forget the reality, which is that a bad job has been done with some variations.

So even if Kenjutsu and Possessed were very good (which is not the case), that wouldn't be an excuse for Balanced to be that bad as he is now.

All variations should be viable, those extreme differences are annoying and prevent the game from being fully balanced.
I agree, I don't think people should just play other variations. But maybe the Kenshi community bitch about it all too often.
 
What are these tools that base pyro Tanya possesses? What kinda nonsense are you talking about?

Gaps for days in 80% of her strings. No real overhead combo starter (f3 fully charged does not count so don't you even) sub par zoning.

She loses to almost every other zoner in the game and is free to pressure rush down characters. It's actually hard for me to think of a winning match up for her. Prolly High tech Jacquie but that's like a freebie to most characters. She use to have more favorable match ups but patches continuously Nerfed her all the while buffing the other characters she could beat before.

She has low damage output meterless and metered. Low 20s meterless high 20s for a bar. They've nerfed her damage 3 times now when before she could get 31% for a bar.

She annoys with her air mobility till you realize everything she's doing is punishable.

@Vak Phoenix Can you think of winning match ups for Pyro?
Naginata?
 

exflyingbooty

This dream has a sad ending
Who told you she beat grandmaster?

Opening people up while they have shroud on them is hard. ;-; and if you take too long opening them up and do that combo the shroud wears off. I've lost matches that way.
WELL, i have an extremely easy time beating grandmaster players with pyro to the point where it feels like she just beats him. Sub has an extremely hard time trying to catch her and she really doesn't give two fucks about ice-clone when she has a life lead.

Also i agree with shroud the best i usually can catch people with is f+3(run cancel) into b+3 u_u
 

colby4898

Special Forces Sonya Up-player
Many of us are annoyed and disappointed not only with Kenshi's current state (specially Balanced), but also with some nrs guys talking down to us as if we had no idea, and trolling us.
I understand that but it's been a year now and the bitching hasn't seemed to have eased even slightly. It's getting old is all. So many individual threads talking about how bad he is with slightly different titles. It's just unneccessary. There should be one thread where all the complaining you want should be restricted too.
 

ZigZag

That Welsh Guy
I thought the Kenshi community levelled up but they really do just not understand their character, like they really have not used anything but balanced correctly.
Drop balanced, live a better life... perhaps not the best life but a better one.
 

Major Moron74

I'm not paying for your beliefs
I thought the Kenshi community levelled up but they really do just not understand their character, like they really have not used anything but balanced correctly.
Drop balanced, live a better life... perhaps not the best life but a better one.
The Kenshi community needs to level up? Are you kidding me? It's not a lack of good players, it's a lack of a competitive character. The recent patch did little for Kenshi and a lot for most other characters, leaving Kenshi in the dust balance-wise. Pig said it himself, us Kenshi players haven't found any Kenshi tech because there is none. We know how to use balanced, we're not stupid. The reason we complain is because every match is an uphill battle. Balanced is a zoning variation that can't zone. So all he's left with is bad normals and a poor neutral. Like many of us have said before, if you think you can do better with Kenshi, then pick him up and prove us wrong. We'll shut up as soon as it happens, I promise.
 

haketh

Noob
The Kenshi community needs to level up? Are you kidding me? It's not a lack of good players, it's a lack of a competitive character. The recent patch did little for Kenshi and a lot for most other characters, leaving Kenshi in the dust balance-wise. Pig said it himself, us Kenshi players haven't found any Kenshi tech because there is none. We know how to use balanced, we're not stupid. The reason we complain is because every match is an uphill battle. Balanced is a zoning variation that can't zone. So all he's left with is bad normals and a poor neutral. Like many of us have said before, if you think you can do better with Kenshi, then pick him up and prove us wrong. We'll shut up as soon as it happens, I promise.
Pick a different variation if you wanna compete JFC. We get it, Balanced sucks but you have two viable variations you can pick. And if they aren't enough? It sucks but pick another character if you're really serious about competing.
 

ismael4790

Stay focused or get Caged
Pick a different variation if you wanna compete JFC. We get it, Balanced sucks but you have two viable variations you can pick. And if they aren't enough? It sucks but pick another character if you're really serious about competing.
The thing here is, if nrs actually cared about their own game in the degree that the users expect, more variations and characters would be viable, and that would enrich the game as a whole, including the competitive part.

As this is not a reality, some characters/variations are rarely seen in competitive environments because picking them is a suicide, and this is sad.

The testing and balancing in this kind of games is without doubt a very hard and long task. But nowadays developers can have access to a highly valuable and free tool: players experiences and observations. These surely make this process easier. But for some reason, nrs seems not to appreciate it enough, and even ignore it in some cases. This is holding mkx back from being even a greater game.
 
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Major Moron74

I'm not paying for your beliefs
Pick a different variation if you wanna compete JFC. We get it, Balanced sucks but you have two viable variations you can pick. And if they aren't enough? It sucks but pick another character if you're really serious about competing.
That takes all the fun and passion out of competing. If you have been loyal to a character since they were created, then you want to use them. You want to represent that character and the community. That's really hard to do when your character gets zero help. Instead of being forced to use a different character, why can't NRS start competently balancing their games? By some miracle, this game turned out to be fairly well balanced, but it's still obvious NRS makes too many knee-jerk balance decisions. Half of the people on TYM could propose better balance decisions than what we got in this last patch. I love Midway, NRS, and all their games, but that's all the more reason to point out when they mess up.
 

Yoaks

A spaceman
generaly speaking mileenas ex roll is BAD as a reversal. 16f -31. But if your opponent is blocking low and afraid of it then the ex roll is an overhead. And who has ever said Laos spin is bad? It's 7f and switches screen position. That was stupid to bring up Laos spin. Not even relevant to the discussion
So I guess we need ex roll and ex db4 to be safe for them to be good than? Thats what your saying is that its bad because its punishable? So you want it to be safe and have no consequence for being wrong when you use said reversal? It being punishable balances these moves.

Predators players would love reversals like ex roll or db4.
 

Yoaks

A spaceman
Don't forget that Balanced and Possessed also have really good unbreakable damage.

Up to 29% or 31% for 2 bars and depending on the starter.