Breakthrough - Kung Lao [EO Beta Closed] Kung Lao Beta Changes Discussion

[st9rm]

This is how they should've balanced Kung Lao (Tempest):
- remove kung laos hat from the game

i corrected your post

 

[THTB]

he was about as honest as a top tier character can be...cant wait to hear u cry about wrestler jax come march 1st

I already know Wrestler Jax is fucked up lol. Hell, Jax beats my character.

My character really isn't honest lol, so I give zero fucks.

 

[Krabman]

lmao some of you lao mains are pathetic. The nerfs could be much worse, Lao is still very very good.

 

[biggabarr]

I think that people widely agree on ex-spin being overpowered right now. Because of the huge range PLUS the armor it technically beats any other attack (apart from Goro's punchwalk maybe).

If you just slightly reduce the range and remove the armor, the tool will become just more fair. Kung Lao still has the fastest punishing-tool in the game. Yet he has to think more before using it defensivly. This will just make the character more honest. It is not like I would demand to add start-up frames or so...

Thus:

REMOVE ARMOR ON EX-SPIN AND KEEP ALL OTHER CHANGES. THEN HE SHOULD BE FINE!!!!

No it's not that he will be fine , it's so that you can win ,SCRUB!!!!

 

[WiseM0nkey]

lmao some of you lao mains are pathetic. The nerfs could be much worse, Lao is still very very good.

like how worse exactly? remove b321 and 112124?

it got hit pretty hard if you ask me. Not complety helpless. but as for now, he cant compete with some of thie dirts in this game (if they stay pre beta)

 

[Krabman]

like how worse exactly? remove b321 and 112124?

it got hit pretty hard if you ask me. Not complety helpless. but as for now, he cant compete with some of thie dirts in this game (if they stay pre beta)

Lao has never been dirty. He just has the fundamentals better than anything else. Lao has the best tools, arguably the best wake up, converts off anything, and still gets 30%+ meterless damage. I'm sorry you can't faceroll like you used to back in the day.

 

[Redux]

You are trolling me, right?

Armorbreaking (= double-hitting) attacks don't work on Kung Lao, while they work on everyone else. This is why Summoner Quan Chi has an even harder time when fighting Kung Lao e.g.! Overhead/low Setups dont work on him...

Besides when it comes to armor move vs armor move, Kung Lao almost always wins.

Removing the armor and slightly reducing the range feels like a reasonable nerf.

lol dude wth. Armor breaking moves do work on lao. his spin is fine chill & I don't even like Lao

 

[WiseM0nkey]

Lao has never been dirty. He just has the fundamentals better than anything else. Lao has the best tools, arguably the best wake up, converts off anything, and still gets 30%+ meterless damage. I'm sorry you can't faceroll like you used to back in the day.

pre beta lao didnt face roll lmao. again, 112124 and b321 follow ups after ex hat are pokable, it's huge considering those were his main pressure strings.

 

[THTB]

Lao has never been dirty. He just has the fundamentals better than anything else. Lao has the best tools, arguably the best wake up, converts off anything, and still gets 30%+ meterless damage. I'm sorry you can't faceroll like you used to back in the day.

Tempest was dirty, don't get it twisted. Hell, Lao had some dumb shit too in his core due to things like j2.

 

[Krabman]

pre beta lao didnt face roll lmao. again, 112124 and b321 follow ups after ex hat are pokable, it's huge considering those were his main pressure strings.

So you think 112124 ex hat should be guranteed pressure when you always have meter?

 

[PapaRegadetho]

Anti-airing Kung Lao felt sooo goood lol. But I do feel his ex hat shoud have stayed the same, sucks for you guys.

 

[WiseM0nkey]

Tempest was dirty, don't get it twisted. Hell, Lao had some dumb shit too in his core due to things like j2.

if you're talking about +27 orb hat that jailed into everything well, i agree.

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

Lao has never been dirty. He just has the fundamentals better than anything else. Lao has the best tools, arguably the best wake up, converts off anything, and still gets 30%+ meterless damage. I'm sorry you can't faceroll like you used to back in the day.

He hasnt got the best tools lol, he hasnt got the best mids, he hasnt got the best pressure, he hasnt got the fastest normals by quite a stretch.
His pressure was never even the best at any point in the games life, but now its just crap.

He had the best jump attack, but that worked for him because his grounded movement is crap too.
Now he cant get a B3 check after ex hat, his pressures dead.

 

[Saltea Moonspell]

Also folks complaining that the j2 nerf hurts his other variations. It was broken AF i dont care if it hurts, no character should have that

Tell that to FerraTor and othe other punks!

 

[WiseM0nkey]

So you think 112124 ex hat should be guranteed pressure when you always have meter?

goddamn, with ex hat at +12 you cant do 112124xxex hat loops. lmao it's not guaranteed, it's pokable. however you could do b321 to stop the poke attempts, and d4 to stop the armor attempts. so now that you've lost those mindgames for the opponent it's gonna be easier for him to do stuff after ex hat and get away with it.

 

[WiseM0nkey]

He hasnt got the best tools lol, he hasnt got the best mids, he hasnt got the best pressure, he hasnt got the fastest normals by quite a stretch.
His pressure was never even the best at any point in the games life, but now its just crap.

He had the best jump attack, but that worked for him because his grounded movement is crap too.
Now he cant get a B3 check after ex hat, his pressures dead.

i feel you.

 

[WiseM0nkey]

and yeah as @A F0xy Grampa said, stop upplaying his tools lol. wich tools are you talking about exactly?

 

[jokey77]

What Kung Lao is getting any mileage off of the ex spin lol? That's not a game winning move by a long shot, it's a move designed to stop people with bad fundamentals who like to jump around all day.

By your logic, Mileenas ball roll, Goro PW, Jax pumped up ex gotcha (also 7f), and so on are all OP.

If you're spinning in neutral or a lot of the time through people's pressure, then you're using the move 'wrong'.

This discussion has turned into an irrational slugfest, mostly because of the kung lao community being pretty blind when it comes to the problems with ex-spin. To be fair, this worked for Kenshi, who got plenty of buffs. Yet you all miss the point:

It is not like ex spin was solely an "Anti Ait tool" like Foxy Grampa said. It can even be used to punish most pokes! And it is fine as it is: a punishing tool! There is no need to turn it into a "get out of any pressure"-card as well.

Kung Lao got plenty tools to anti air, he doesn't even need ex spin for this. He just shouldn't be able to turn minus frames into a guessing game that is in his favour. Of course the opponent will try to press buttons once he gained frame advantage. Like every other character KL should have to respect said minus grames, given that he got into a disadvantageous situation because of bad fundamentals in the first place. Saying anything else is hypocritical! If you want diverse gameplay and fundamentals, then you must be against moves like spin.

I know for sure, that @StealthyMuffin @Udun @aieches @MK_Al @st9rm and some other respected TYM-members share my point of view and appreciate my way to speak things out - as honest, loud and clear as necessary.

 

[TheGoldenJew]

This discussion has turned into an irrational slugfest, mostly because of the kung lao community being pretty blind when it comes to the problems with ex-spin. To be fair, this worked for Kenshi, who got plenty of buffs. Yet you all miss the point:

It is not like ex spin was solely an "Anti Ait tool" like Foxy Grampa said. It can even be used to punish most pokes! And it is fine as it is: a punishing tool! There is no need to turn it into a "get out of any pressure"-card as well.

Kung Lao got plenty tools to anti air, he doesn't even need ex spin for this. He just shouldn't be able to turn minus frames into a guessing game that is in his favour. Of course the opponent will try to press buttons once he gained frame advantage. Like every other character KL should have to respect said minus grames, given that he got into a disadvantageous situation because of bad fundamentals in the first place. Saying anything else is hypocritical! If you want diverse gameplay and fundamentals, then you must be against moves like spin.

I know for sure, that @StealthyMuffin @Udun @aieches @MK_Al @st9rm and some other respected TYM-members share my point of view and appreciate my way to speak things out - as honest, loud and clear as necessary.

well respected tym members?? I didn't know people even respected TYM members. We respect foxy and str9m because they show up offline and play at the highest level and can comment on true matchup numbers...who exactly are you?
Maybe if you understood the double edged sword that is ex spin ud realize how irrational u are sir

 

[Trustypatches]

. He just shouldn't be able to turn minus frames into a guessing game that is in his favour. Of course the opponent will try to press buttons once he gained frame advantage. Like every other character KL should have to respect said minus grames, given that he got into a disadvantageous situation because of bad fundamentals in the first place. Saying anything else is hypocritical! If you want diverse gameplay and fundamentals, then you must be against moves like spin.

Are you suggesting that Lao is the only character who can armor at - frames? Some characters who are far worse (Lackey F/T) can do the same thing and be safe on block lol.

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

This discussion has turned into an irrational slugfest, mostly because of the kung lao community being pretty blind when it comes to the problems with ex-spin. To be fair, this worked for Kenshi, who got plenty of buffs. Yet you all miss the point:

It is not like ex spin was solely an "Anti Ait tool" like Foxy Grampa said. It can even be used to punish most pokes! And it is fine as it is: a punishing tool! There is no need to turn it into a "get out of any pressure"-card as well.

Kung Lao got plenty tools to anti air, he doesn't even need ex spin for this. He just shouldn't be able to turn minus frames into a guessing game that is in his favour. Of course the opponent will try to press buttons once he gained frame advantage. Like every other character KL should have to respect said minus grames, given that he got into a disadvantageous situation because of bad fundamentals in the first place. Saying anything else is hypocritical! If you want diverse gameplay and fundamentals, then you must be against moves like spin.

I know for sure, that @StealthyMuffin @Udun @aieches @MK_Al @st9rm and some other respected TYM-members share my point of view and appreciate my way to speak things out - as honest, loud and clear as necessary.

The guessing game is never in his favour when he's minus if he has to spin.
The risk = 1 Bar lost and opponents max damage bnb (usually more than 32%)
The gain = 32% and oki

Also, how can you say that being put at minus frames is a sign of bad fundamental play? You realise that Lao only has 2 ways to get + frames, 1. Using ex hat, and 2. landing a hit. So actually, by your logic having anything blocked by Lao is bad fundamental play?

If all those players agree with you, you're all wrong.
Every game has moves you have to bait, the spin is no different IF you're playing against a psycho that wants to spin. Also, what about moves like Cages ex nutpunch, Ferra Torrs uppercut etc. These moves all follow the same rules, and there are moves safer than that too.

 

[yucking]

This discussion has turned into an irrational slugfest, mostly because of the kung lao community being pretty blind when it comes to the problems with ex-spin. To be fair, this worked for Kenshi, who got plenty of buffs. Yet you all miss the point:

It is not like ex spin was solely an "Anti Ait tool" like Foxy Grampa said. It can even be used to punish most pokes! And it is fine as it is: a punishing tool! There is no need to turn it into a "get out of any pressure"-card as well.

Kung Lao got plenty tools to anti air, he doesn't even need ex spin for this. He just shouldn't be able to turn minus frames into a guessing game that is in his favour. Of course the opponent will try to press buttons once he gained frame advantage. Like every other character KL should have to respect said minus grames, given that he got into a disadvantageous situation because of bad fundamentals in the first place. Saying anything else is hypocritical! If you want diverse gameplay and fundamentals, then you must be against moves like spin.

I know for sure, that @StealthyMuffin @Udun @aieches @MK_Al @st9rm and some other respected TYM-members share my point of view and appreciate my way to speak things out - as honest, loud and clear as necessary.

What in the cuck is this my guy

 

[FrankOceansWaifu]

Sorry just skimming through this thread, but did Hat Trick get any changes?

 

[XxDark_]

He hasnt got the best tools lol, he hasnt got the best mids, he hasnt got the best pressure, he hasnt got the fastest normals by quite a stretch.
His pressure was never even the best at any point in the games life, but now its just crap.

He had the best jump attack, but that worked for him because his grounded movement is crap too.
Now he cant get a B3 check after ex hat, his pressures dead.

thank you.

 

[XxDark_]

This discussion has turned into an irrational slugfest, mostly because of the kung lao community being pretty blind when it comes to the problems with ex-spin. To be fair, this worked for Kenshi, who got plenty of buffs. Yet you all miss the point:

It is not like ex spin was solely an "Anti Ait tool" like Foxy Grampa said. It can even be used to punish most pokes! And it is fine as it is: a punishing tool! There is no need to turn it into a "get out of any pressure"-card as well.

Kung Lao got plenty tools to anti air, he doesn't even need ex spin for this. He just shouldn't be able to turn minus frames into a guessing game that is in his favour. Of course the opponent will try to press buttons once he gained frame advantage. Like every other character KL should have to respect said minus grames, given that he got into a disadvantageous situation because of bad fundamentals in the first place. Saying anything else is hypocritical! If you want diverse gameplay and fundamentals, then you must be against moves like spin.

I know for sure, that @StealthyMuffin @Udun @aieches @MK_Al @st9rm and some other respected TYM-members share my point of view and appreciate my way to speak things out - as honest, loud and clear as necessary.

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