Match-up Discussion Shazams true Match up Chart.

[ColdBoreMK23]

Everyone needs to chill out on the OP. It's a game for fucks sake. Stop trying to compete with the COD community for immaturity and being jackasses.

You are acting like he killed your first born child when in six months from now nobody will care about this game anyway because the community failed.

Chill.


I broke my back... It's spinal.

 

[Heroic_Legacy]

Pretty sure a mix-up is placing the opponent in a situation that he has to guess which way to block, which implies advantage on the guy doing the mix-up, whereas a read is something more YOLO, I thought.

We need to get educated on most of the cast anyway, and that'll take a while to establish.

Instead of arguing here it seems we have clearly different definitions of what a read is so I'll drop it.

 

[Mortal Komhat]

Yeah. I'm not from a NRS background (though I try and get educated on all fighting games, to be honest) so that doesn't help matters, but when on TYM do as TYM members do. I'll try to change my vocabulary to match the accepted vernacular.

Gotta play more I:GAU to be honest. My Shazam be hella rusty.

 

[RYX]

I want to buy this thread flowers, take it to a nice dinner and have sex with it.

I still want to understand how people think Shazam is so dangerous when he has almost exactly the same gameplan as Frost, except being slower, weaker and less safe. Hell, even the one thing he does "well" in getting out of oki gives him essentially no reward and can still get blown up by a lot of people on a read.

Shazam and KF are nothing alike.

Shazam is fine as far as speed goes. An 11 frame grab that acts as a low with great reach and leads to 40% into AC for the mix up is pretty fucking good. His only major problems are b.2 deciding it doesn't want to land on crouching people (wow good overhead design) and him not having a safe advancing move (Pretty much all of the top tiers) or being able to stop advancing movement really well (Deathstroke does this best). That's it. Only problem is not having a safe ranged tool.

But he is a damn decent character.

 

[Duck Nation]

acts as a low

That right there. That's the ticket everyone misses. It's bizarre, inverted behavior, but his grabs aren't really grabs at all. Shazam is just a dressed up 50/50 character, which is exactly what Frost is all about. I don't know how people don't see the comparison when it's so staggeringly clear. The biggest differences are that Frost has iceberg and Shazam has teleport. Their core gameplans are similar, and they even share the same largest weakness of poor air control. It's just that Frost is safe when she comes flying in at you from half screen, as well as getting a combo and a setup off it.

Edit: and shit, even her d2 is better...

 

[RYX]

That right there. That's the ticket everyone misses. It's bizarre, inverted behavior, but his grabs aren't really grabs at all. Shazam is just a dressed up 50/50 character, which is exactly what Frost is all about. I don't know how people don't see the comparison when it's so staggeringly clear. The biggest differences are that Frost has iceberg and Shazam has teleport. Their core gameplans are similar, and they even share the same largest weakness of poor air control. It's just that Frost is safe when she comes flying in at you from half screen, as well as getting a combo and a setup off it.

I don't agree.

They play around the same footsie range, but one wants to get in and the other will hold you out until you put yourself there. IMO Shazam has superior oki due to ambiguous splats and the like, and he's also got really good interact set ups. KF wants to leave you standing, but Shazam will put you on the ground.

Shazam can also stop people from jumping a hell of a lot easier in b.2 range haha.

Billy is also fun and hype, KF will put anyone to sleep

 

[juicepouch]

Everyone needs to chill out on the OP. It's a game for fucks sake. Stop trying to compete with the COD community for immaturity and being jackasses.

You are acting like he killed your first born child when in six months from now nobody will care about this game anyway because the community failed.

Chill.


I broke my back... It's spinal.

"1v1 me fgt. Ill noscope 360 headshot the shit outa u!"--COD players, taking offense to you calling them childish. lol

 

[juicepouch]

Billy is also fun and hype, KF will put anyone to sleep

It's cause Shazam yelling his own name is hype as hell. Can you imagine if every time KF won a round she went "KILLER FROST!!"? lol

 

[Mortal Komhat]

It's cause Shazam yelling his own name is hype as hell. Can you imagine if every time KF won a round she went "KILLER FROST!!"? lol

It'd get older because it makes no sense for her to do so (though I do agree her lines leave me cold). Billy just doing it to show everyone you just got yo ass beat by a kid.

I'll try to find some time this week to get into the lab and online to just get my head back in there.

 

[Shawi]

That right there. That's the ticket everyone misses. It's bizarre, inverted behavior, but his grabs aren't really grabs at all. Shazam is just a dressed up 50/50 character

OMG thanks! Finally someone else has realised this! Everyone goes on and on "command grab" this command grab that - It is a F**KING lowwwwwwwwwwwwww.

 

[Mortal Komhat]

Let's be fair here, it's a low that punishes you for blocking low. So, uh, an overhead.

 

[Shawi]

Let's be fair here, it's a low that punishes you for blocking low. So, uh, an overhead.

??????

 

[RONALD ROGAN]

I find Grundy to be one of Shazam's trickier matchups. Unlike Bane, you can't really run away from Grundy as well due to his Swamp Hands and multiple hits of armor once he gets in. At first I thought it would be easy for Shazam, but I almost always lose to Grundy with Billy. Maybe I'm playing it wrong.

 

[Mikemetroid]

I find Grundy to be one of Shazam's trickier matchups. Unlike Bane, you can't really run away from Grundy as well due to his Swamp Hands and multiple hits of armor once he gets in. At first I thought it would be easy for Shazam, but I almost always lose to Grundy with Billy. Maybe I'm playing it wrong.

BlackBryan is really good at this MU.

All I can really say is that Shazam has the tools to blow up Grundy. Also has godlike movement.

 

[RONALD ROGAN]

BlackBryan is really good at this MU.

All I can really say is that Shazam has the tools to blow up Grundy. Also has godlike movement.

Usually when I question my tactics like this... the solution is to play lamer.

Losing with Shazam? Run away and punish people instead of going in and trying to open up armored characters.

Any tips BlackBryan ?

 

[MashPotatoTower]

Lately I haven't been able to jump over bane charge at all. was there any confirmed changes in the hitbox for it? it use to be free but now I just get AA'd even tho bane is storys below me.
has anyone else noticed this?

 

[RONALD ROGAN]

You can definitely still jump it. Jump later than sooner. Don't hit any air attacks during.

 

[BlackBryan]

Usually when I question my tactics like this... the solution is to play lamer.

Losing with Shazam? Run away and punish people instead of going in and trying to open up armored characters.

Any tips BlackBryan ?

Major major tip i would like to see all of the Shazam players start using. B2 Torpedo. It cant be punished by most of the cast, and is especially dirty on Grundy because anytime you see the start up of walking corpse, immediately B2 torpedo and you'll deal the damage, as well as phase right through Grundy. Not only do you evade the stupid 45% that WC can dish out, but it messes with his inputs to cancel as well. So if, and when, he whiffs on the other side, what do you know, you're perfectly placed for a b23 starter into 40%.

 

[Mortal Komhat]

??????

Essentially, the purpose of an overhead is to catch people blocking low. Raw AC pretty much does that but doesn't hit standing. Brain no worky correct sometimes

 

[ZigZag]

Throw me some Numbers for;
Hawk girl
Lex Luthor
Green Arrow
Martian Man Hunter

And honestly I think that's as close as we can get to the real MU chart for Shazam, at least from everything we gather right now.

 

[zoofs]

Throw me some Numbers for;
Hawk girl
Lex Luthor
Green Arrow
Martian Man Hunter

And honestly I think that's as close as we can get to the real MU chart for Shazam, at least from everything we gather right now.

id say 5-5 hawkgirl, 5-5 ga, possibly 6-4 mmh, and don't really know for lex, maybe 5-5 or slightly in lex's favour

 

[ZigZag]

id say 5-5 hawkgirl, 5-5 ga, possibly 6-4 mmh, and don't really know for lex, maybe 5-5 or slightly in lex's favour

I keep thinking 5-5 for HG too, I always play horribly against GA no matter what so Your input is as good as any but I dunno if it's 5-5 though.
MMH 6-4? I would imagine with his latest buffs and apparent butt rapery... (that's a word now) he would destroy Shazam.

Lex isn't the worst, I played a really good Lex a while back 5-5 could be right I suppose, but maybe 4-6 still.

These do make sense to me, still not that sure, thanks though.

 

[zoofs]

I keep thinking 5-5 for HG too, I always play horribly against GA no matter what so Your input is as good as any but I dunno if it's 5-5 though.
MMH 6-4? I would imagine with his latest buffs and apparent butt rapery... (that's a word now) he would destroy Shazam.

Lex isn't the worst, I played a really good Lex a while back 5-5 could be right I suppose, but maybe 4-6 still.

These do make sense to me, still not that sure, thanks though.

the only ones I really have some experience with are lex and ga, and i obviously have not played the xxl3g1t "top players" but from what ive seen other than small differences in tech it doesn't change too much for the matchup. Idk about mmh I could see how he could possibly destroy shazam, but to me there aren't that many things he can do to completely shut him out, at the very highest it would be 7-3 but id stick with a firm 6-4

green arrow is a superior character to shazam so I can see why you have problems with him, but matchup wise I don't think its any worse than 5-5

 

[ZigZag]

the only ones I really have some experience with are lex and ga, and i obviously have not played the xxl3g1t "top players" but from what ive seen other than small differences in tech it doesn't change too much for the matchup. Idk about mmh I could see how he could possibly destroy shazam, but to me there aren't that many things he can do to completely shut him out, at the very highest it would be 7-3 but id stick with a firm 6-4

green arrow is a superior character to shazam so I can see why you have problems with him, but matchup wise I don't think its any worse than 5-5

I just suck at guessing the crazy directions GA players go in when you're playing a really good one, Otherwise when I'm in it's usually not too bad I suppose.
I guess with MMH we'll see as he developes people still haven't cracked him yet, I would love more MU experience with Lex again as I think it's 5-5 but if anything he may have the smallest but of favour because of the trait being fairly useful against Shazam, People who use it right leave you at very few options to break it safely.

 

[Shawi]

Essentially, the purpose of an overhead is to catch people blocking low. Raw AC pretty much does that but doesn't hit standing. Brain no worky correct sometimes

Ohhh ur talking about AC, I was on about HM, but the point you raise is true and I had missed that.

HM is a low that whiffs when you block low and is full combo punishable i.e. A low that is -17 on block.

AC is an overhead that whiffs when you block high and is full combo punishable i.e. An overhead that is -17 on block.

(Frame data is off top of my head)

Actually looking at it like that makes Shazam seem even worse! Aquamans b12 was -17 on block and his b2 was the same, would he be considered rubbish?