Sajam's NW Matchup Chart (Subject To Change)

[Sajam]

So while bored in class/doing write ups for matchups I decided to make a chart to stir up some discussion. I'm sure this whole thing will change whenever the patch comes out (2015?), but I can update it at any time.

Note: I consider 6-4's to be winnable against player's of even skill, but not usually the outcome. Most people call 7-3's 6-4's on this site for some reason, but there isn't a 6-4 here that I think isn't winnable at even levels. A few matchups are borderline 7-3's against NW IMO, but I'll let them rock.

Edit: I have updated the MU list post patch a bit, but mostly everything stayed the same for NW.

Here we go:

Aquaman: 5-5

Ares: 6-4

Bane: 6-4

Batgirl: 5-5

Batman: 5-5

Black Adam: 4-6

Catwoman: 5-5

Cyborg: 4-6

DS: 4-6

Doomsday: 6-4

Flash:5-5

Green Arrow: 6-4

GL: 4-6

Harley: 5-5

Hawkgirl: 4-6

Joker: 6-4

KF: 4-6

Lex: 6-4

Lobo: 6-4

MMH: 5-5

NW: 5-5 (6-4 in escrima's favor, under most circumstances)

Raven: 4-6

Scop: 6-4

Shazam: 6-4

Sinestro: 3-7

Solomon Grundy: 5-5

Superman: 4-6

WW: 5-5

Zatanna: ?

Zod: 5-5 (Could be 4-6)

 

[Rude]

Hmmm. Nightwing in Staff Stance can give Batman nightmares. Of course, we DO have Mechanical Bats. I wonder.....I almost feel like NW can better zone Bats than Bats can with NW. So.....now I don't know why I wrote this.

Sounds even-ish, even if I think Staff Stance is a pain.

 

[Sajam]

Hmmm. Nightwing in Staff Stance can give Batman nightmares. Of course, we DO have Mechanical Bats. I wonder.....I almost feel like NW can better zone Bats than Bats can with NW. So.....now I don't know why I wrote this.

Sounds even-ish, even if I think Staff Stance is a pain.

If Batman gets started though, he can do a really good job of zoning staff. NW does have good defensive tools to blow up Batman's pressure though.

For now I'll leave it, but it might change over time/ with the 2025 patch.

 

[Rude]

You're right. 2099 patch changes everything.

 

[AssassiN]

Why is DS 4-6?

 

[Sajam]

Why is DS 4-6?

Trading in staff can quickly go bad for NW, normal left/right mixups don't work because of his ability to do reversels on both sides easily, escrima struggles to close the distance, wing dings aren't very useful, DS's normals are good against NW as long as he isn't in staff, not easy to AA j3, etc.

It could be 5-5 for sure, but I'm keeping it 6-4 for now based on experience.

 

[xKhaoTik]

Agree with the KF mu. I think its best for NW to stay in staff stance in this match IMO.

 

[Sajam]

Agree with the KF mu. I think its best for NW to stay in staff stance in this match IMO.

Yeah, but the problem is that daggers to a strong job of shutting down NW's zoning tools in staff. Wing dings are absolutely terrible because of slide and how easy it is for her to punish it early/late if the spacing isn't amazing. It's an interesting matchup though.

Staff is also better at dealing with her options after slide. Escrima gets eaten alive by her when she's in.

 

[SonicBoomBrad]

Doomsday: 5-5

PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFT "Somtimes I have trouble hitting the trait button." Got it.

 

[Sajam]

PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFT "Somtimes I have trouble hitting the trait button." Got it.

You're just upset you can beat every NW that isn't me <3

 

[SilverKeyMan]

DS: 4-6

I must only face horrible Deathstrokes then, because this matchup is almost a free win.

Hawkgirl: 4-6

I'd give this one a 3-7 before I ever did the Superman matchup. This is probably because I haven't spent enough time learning how to punish all of her crap, however.

Solomon Grundy: 5-5

Not in Nightwing's favor? This matchup seems really easy to me. Staff stance and proper spacing shut Grundy down pretty hard, and wingdings tear apart most Grundys. Although there may be ways around this, it's up to Grundy to find them... we have more than enough tools at our disposal.

Superman: 3-7

As much as I hate Superman (and I really do), I think it's a little more fair than this. Maybe 3.5/6.5?

 

[Qwark28]

Why do you feel joker wins vs NW?

 

[Sajam]

I must only face horrible Deathstrokes then, because this matchup is almost a free win.


I'd give this one a 3-7 before I ever did the Superman matchup. This is probably because I haven't spent enough time learning how to punish all of her crap, however.


Not in Nightwing's favor? This matchup seems really easy to me. Staff stance and proper spacing shut Grundy down pretty hard, and wingdings tear apart most Grundys. Although there may be ways around this, it's up to Grundy to find them... we have more than enough tools at our disposal.


As much as I hate Superman (and I really do), I think it's a little more fair than this. Maybe 3.5/6.5?

I explained DS above.

HG is a dumb matchup, but if you play it patient and don't get frustrated it's not to bad. Ground spark cancels to mask your approach help a lot.

There was a very large discussion about Grundy in the matchup thread, but the long and the short is that he has all the tools in the world to shut down NW. No good Grundy should lose to wing dings, and staff can often be a problem in this matchup since you are giving up mobility against a giant walking armored 50% combo dealing monster. Check out the matchup discussion thread for more info on Grundy, but I'll have my write up out soon.

Superman is 7-3, easily. Better zoning, more damage, virtually zero risks on his offense compared to yours, best normal is half the speed with the same/slightly more range and better options out of it, better forward and backwards dash, NW's options against f23 can easily be baited and whiff punished, etc. I'm confident that my Supes I haven't practiced since a month or so before EVO could beat pretty much body any NW free, and my Supes sucks.

 

[Sajam]

Why do you feel joker wins vs NW?

By probably worse, I meant probably worse for Joker.

 

[Qwark28]

By probably worse, I meant probably worse for Joker.

I have it a solid 6-4, zoning is a problem for joker and the frametraps are bad but parry, damage, jokers vortex vs nightwing and J3 almost even it out.

 

[Sajam]

I have it a solid 6-4, zoning is a problem for joker and the frametraps are bad but parry, damage, jokers vortex vs nightwing and J3 almost even it out.

NW can air to air Joker with j2 in staff, plus bait parry with nj shenanigans in staff, does similar damage as long as the player is optimizing his combos. By vortex do you mean his wall kick/teeth stuff or just his setups overall. I've never had a problem blocking any of his setups on reaction, including wall kick stuff, but I'd agree I'm not moving the matchup to 7-3 or something. It could be worse, but I don't have it set there at the moment.

 

[C88_Real_Harris]

How is the MMH matchup 6-4?

 

[TakeAChance]

Batgirl is 5-5 to me. They both have 6-4 situations in the matchup

I have Aquaman as 6-4 Nightwing, but I haven't played a great aquaman in a long time.

Batman definitely 5-5. Get stuck full screen and you are fucked.

Other than that a really solid list. I really agree with the Doomsday 5-5. He just has to much mobility and armor to effectively feel comfortable doing anything.

That, and his splash negates a lot of Nightwings wakeups.

 

[xInfra Deadx]

What makes the Ares matchup 6-4?

 

[Sajam]

How is the MMH matchup 6-4?

A couple of things.

NW's staff zoning is good against Martian because of the slow speed on most of his zoning. NW can also abuse ground spark dash cancels to bait his pillars and get it quick if he doesn't have a MB orb up/predicts well. Teleport is easy to bait in staff, and up close and without trait Martian struggles against both stances. While trait is up MMH can play footsies against NW, but without it it's not hard for him to crawl all over MMH. His wake up is solid and does prevent lots of NW's left/right mixup game, but if you play patient and bait it then NW's pressure game proceeds like normal. Basically his zoning isn't fast enough to contest NW's, his normals up close aren't the best for dealing with his offense, but his wakeup does help relieve some pressure if NW is playing too aggressively.

 

[Sajam]

Batgirl is 5-5 to me. They both have 6-4 situations in the matchup

I have Aquaman as 6-4 Nightwing, but I haven't played a great aquaman in a long time.

Batman definitely 5-5. Get stuck full screen and you are fucked.

Other than that a really solid list. I really agree with the Doomsday 5-5. He just has to much mobility and armor to effectively feel comfortable doing anything.

That, and his splash negates a lot of Nightwings wakeups.

Batgirl is really hard if her reads are on point. Against an vortex character a significant portion of the matchup is going to be keeping them out, and guessing right when you have to. If you guess right, you should probably never lose, but if you guess wrong consistently, then pack it up.

Yeah, I only kept Batman 6-4 because people still have the idea that he can't deal with NW from full screen. Whoever gets started up first is going to control the pace of the matchup pretty significantly.

Aquaman/NW is like fighting a more mobile version of staff NW. It's an interesting matchup for sure, but I have it as 5-5 for now.

 

[astronout]

NW does not win against catwoman. ill explain in further detail once I have the time.

 

[Sajam]

What makes the Ares matchup 6-4?

NW's staff zoning is strong against Ares, he struggles dealing with any pressure from NW because of bad backdash/wake up options. Godsmack can be backdashed/flying grayson'd out of on reaction. Ares can get going in this matchup with a decent setup and a good teleport, but he lacks real speed/mobility to make it happen often enough.

 

[Sajam]

NW does not win against catwoman. ill explain in further detail once I have the time.

I did a write up about the matchup in our matchup thread. He has tools for lots of different situations against her, and can pressure her if he plays patiently. I've played/beaten Krayzie in tournament and feel comfortable in the matchup, but I'd be interested if you had a different take.

 

[Qwark28]

NW can air to air Joker with j2 in staff, plus bait parry with nj shenanigans in staff, does similar damage as long as the player is optimizing his combos. By vortex do you mean his wall kick/teeth stuff or just his setups overall. I've never had a problem blocking any of his setups on reaction, including wall kick stuff, but I'd agree I'm not moving the matchup to 7-3 or something. It could be worse, but I don't have it set there at the moment.

Not unless on a read, J3 reaches very far and very fast and can be done before he even reaches max height, at which point he is +-1/2

can NW do 48% with his combos? thats the damage joker does with J2 and he can get up to 29% meterless/35% 1 bar off of a J3 on hit

J3 is an awesome aspect of joker because it has great advantage, its like a ridiculously awesome JIP.

By vortex I mean this setup, its nearly 100% a guess if the sweep is done at lowest height and sometimes not even the joker player will know which side hes gonna end up in. http://testyourmight.com/threads/huge-new-ambiguous-crossup-tech.35875/

Both have answers to each other but i dont feel NW has something that straight up breaks the fundamentals of jokers gameplan, especially since joker loves low mobility in his zoners and a sub par aerial game compared to J3