The Power Nth -- Hawkgirl General Discussion Thread

[Tiger Wong]

I may be thinking too much about Sinestro, but I'm thinking her bad matchups would be helped with a good, fast way to close distance--one that the opponent can't see coming a mile away. Maybe if you could meter burn ground mace toss immediately instead of waiting for her to spin her mace for an hour. (It doesn't really matter if the mace comes out or not, that's kind of immaterial in this scenario.)

I want her to have a swooping move from Flight/jumping. Like she swoops down and grabs you. Non tracking of course. Like Firebrands Bon Voyage move from UMvC3 (commonly called "Kidnapped").

But I guess that's for Injustice 2. They're not gonna create any new moves for the characters they already have.

 

[Duck Nation]

I'd rather just buff they game's walk speed,that would be great for getting in on zoners.

I guarantee that my suggestion would do less damage to already stable matchups, and improve the ones she loses a lot more.

Also, I feel like people are discounting the idea that they necessarily WILL block - just because you can, doesn't mean you're always going to. She'd still have to actually manage to not get hit with random bullshit while moving in, this would just allow her to have some answer instead of none at all in the matches she loses.

 

[shaowebb]

Whats the fastest way to cancel into air mace toss? If only I could IAFB that thing I'd MB it and stay on folks.

Also if we're talking Injustice 2

• faster walk speed
• pushblock is free
• guard breaks
• King of Fighters rolls incorporated
• universal air dash
• no unblockable interactions
• scaled down interaction damage
• more environmental tools that are combo extenders and less that are projectiles to promote rushdown
• less damage, but more linkable hits on combo strings
• new breaker tool. Spend half your guard gauge for a breaker...suffer easier guard breaks. Get ballsy and use it twice and go all in with no block left!
• clashes put you at neutral starting position distance instead of at full screen
• MB D2 for armor
• Universal Air throw
• Stance button replaced with RUN. Can be block, jump, or crouch cancelled

 

[Tiger Wong]

Only thing I want for Injustice 2 is a tag button.

 

[Duck Nation]

You want her to block Batman's grapple, batarang, and trait? After that..... what else can he do?
You want her to be able to block Arrow's arrows (ha. That's funny to say. Arrow's arrows)? After that. what else can he do?
How would Cyborg hurt her if he can hurt her in the air.
What about Raven? Can she hit her with anything else?

I think that unless you let her block the projectile, but fall from the ground after it...... she'd be broken.

I do kinda get what you're saying....... DD's Supernova, WW's demogoddess attacks, GL's lantern's might and turbine smash Batgirl's teleport and jumping attacks could kinda still make her hurt........ But in WW's case and GL turbine smash, a simple horizontal mace would throw those off.

Maybe if...... you double the block damage? Or make 1.5 more chip damage than usual?

Oh, and as for this - if Batman could make her block trait then he'd still have extremely deadly things he could do off it. Just because she blocked his bats, doesn't mean she's going to block his air-to-air normal, or his follow-up combo. He wouldn't be able to dick her over from the other side of the screen any more, though, and he's got plenty of tools to tangle with her up close. He'd be fine.

Green Arrow doesn't need to fight from range either. Take away his ability to shoot her down and oh hey, he still has the best j3 in the game and extremely good ground mobility.

Cyborg would still be able to spam the shit out of you. He's just not going to rob you of the air completely anymore, and have to be a little more judicious with his FB usage. This would likely become completely even.

I don't think Raven's soul crushes or GL's lift count as projectiles. They certainly don't behave like them! Is Raven a bad match, anyways?

 

[Duck Nation]

Also if we're talking Injustice 2

*snip*

I don't want to play this game. At all.

 

[shaowebb]

Green Arrow doesn't fight at a distance. He's a rushdown with tools to punish. He can't afford to keep away unless you are near death. Most times he will use his dash to close distance like crazy, D1 into Ice arrow, F2d13, j3 or just straightup fish for AA off of D2 or one of his specials. He's an in and out fighter with low damage...if he is doing anything its to get in and its unlikely he will zone his way in without electric as ice arrow is needed for extenders and safe frames.

 

[shaowebb]

I don't want to play this game. At all.

I likes it in your face, but just remember rolls aren't just to avoid zoning but to go behind stuff for mixups and to get out of the corner. Its KoF meets MK baby! lol

 

[Tiger Wong]

Trying to air-to-air HG when it's the only option you have, is not as easy as you think when I can MC, dive kick, or even 3 you away from me. Or I can simple fly backwards.

Just giving GA J3 to deal with HG's flight...... that's asking for trouble. J3 can't beat MC in the air. That I know.

IDK. TBH..... I'm kinda warming up to the idea, but I just think it's gonna make her OP. I guess she can only block while in Flight right? No jumping? So all I would have to do is jump into FL to not worry about stuff. And then I could possibly punish a move or two after Flight blocking.

Lantern's Might isn't a projectile, but I believe Raven's pillar is. Soul Crushes can't hit HG when she's at the top of the screen so those don't matter.

BTW off-topic, NRS really needs to make GL's stupid minigun a projectile. How it's not a projectile is beyond me.

 

[Duck Nation]

I don't think trying to air-to-air HG is a magic fix, no. But the characters who'd be practically required to do it have lots of options anyways. Green Arrow would not live or die by whether he can hit HG with jump or diagonal arrows, which are already pretty easily telegraphed and countered anyways. He'd still be able to screw with her no matter what, for the same reason any projectile character could.

If you jump into flight and trick somebody into doing something punishable... good. I accounted for that in my head already, and I don't think it would be harmful at all, because both parties would be having to make a correct read in that circumstance.

Raven would also have teleport available to her in demon stance. If her pillars become blockable, well, she has other options.

 

[Jon Berg]

I want her to have a swooping move from Flight/jumping. Like she swoops down and grabs you. Non tracking of course. Like Firebrands Bon Voyage move from UMvC3 (commonly called "Kidnapped").

But I guess that's for Injustice 2. They're not gonna create any new moves for the characters they already have.

I hope they scrap her and give us the better hawk for injustice 2 =P.

 

[Jon Berg]

Snip

Yea hell no. Only thing I really want are real rounds like other fighters, an offensive comeback mechanic, and better walk speed.

 

[EmInEnTShAdOw]

I likes it in your face, but just remember rolls aren't just to avoid zoning but to go behind stuff for mixups and to get out of the corner. Its KoF meets MK baby! lol

This game you've proposed sounds alot like "Blazred"...

 

[TrulyAmiracle]

tbh for fixes/improvements for the game he's what I have

-better walkspeed or a "run button" will be more than enough, the reason alot of matchups in this game are dumb is coz mobility sucks gorilla dick.
better dashes and/or walkspeeds would make getting in on zoners easier, would make "footsies" actually be there even if you're playing a character thats not Aquaman/Supes/GL.

-the kof style "you dont get meter from projectiles unless they connect would help, I dont like this game's zoning style at all. in other games you use zoning as a tool to get some room, build meter, bait a mistake or to cover some space. In this game you chuck shit to kill... its so whack and boring for both sides coz more often than not its fuckin risk free for the zoner.

- smaller stages or less zooming out when you're both on opposite ends, with how shitty the walkspeeds and most dashes are the stages should not be this fuckin huge, its retarded.

- re-think the safety of a LOT of the moves in the game, everything's too safe in this game, unseeable 50/50s and insane pressure strings that have no risk at all just blows my mind. If you have a good tool that goes into stupid damage or into a vortex/mixup there better some risk into using it.

- take out this stance switch garbage, i never understood the point of this BS or why there's a button for that shit. I only use it as a taunt >__>



oh and if they add MK9 breakers I'm quitting the game, if i open you up and get a fuckin hit on you i better be able to fuck you up. Its one of the reasons i quit MK9 and why i wont touch KI3. Combo breakers are fuckin stupid.

tbh i think my problem is that NRS doesnt know how make games or how to balance shit and it bothers me lol. Their games are fun and have so much potential but they just dont think shit through. So many characters feel like they just added whatever they felt would be cool and went with it, they never considered matchups and what the moves will do to the character's neutral/mixup/zoning/anti-zoning game.
Shit like fast hitting teleports or overhead projectiles or whiff cancellable jump ins or how you dont go into blockstun when they opponent is doing a move and many other things show a clear lack of NRS' experience with game making when there isnt a block button involved. They also cant animate coz there isnt a single move in this game that looks natural, the way the characters move and do things looks so awkward and robotic is just.. ugh. No human would actually move like that lol.

/rant over

<__< i dont think anyone's gonna read that but w/e, had to get it out lol.

 

[Tiger Wong]

Just throwing this out here since I don't think it merits a thread in itself - if HG could block projectiles while in flight mode, would that solve her really bad matches? Would it make any way too good for her?

Edit: tagging colt, since I feel the discussion has largely shown favorable results towards it.

Yknow something? I've been thinking about this a bit and i think that this could work. This is a really good idea and it won't give her a big advantage over anybody really.

Like you said before, you have to choose to block. And to block, she would have to fly backwards. Her flight is slow, with moving around in trait mostly resorted to MCs and MT MBs. You can still creep and not have trait be pretty much unused in matchups vs DS, Cyborg and Sinestro. These matchups turn from being laughers to much more manageable AND having a new element of mid-air strategy.

Because you may be able to block projectiles, but not any physical attack. So what's to say, DS jumps like he's gonna shoot, I hold back to block in the air, DS does an empty jump, dashes, and then jumps with J3? Or maybe i can block in the air, and then quickly MC closer or maybe even punish the projectile if they jump too high as they shoot?

You know what? I think this is a damn good idea, that's not gonna break a fucking thing. It would only close the gap between HG and her really shitty matchups.

Bravo Duck Nation.

 

[shaowebb]

Um...doesn't that mean she can chicken block and generally say FU to aa and then divekick the shit out of it though? Call me crazy but I see a lot of potential for jump in flight cancel block...you could damn near do them instantly up, 4,b would be really fast and easy and I'm not exactly for giving someone chicken blocking options...especially if they are a bird. My God the stream salt...

 

[Duck Nation]

Projectiles only, and in flight but not jump.

 

[Boodendorf]

As good as the idea sounds and would fix all of HG's bad matchups (but clearly would killl some chars like Harley), I highly doubt they're gonna make a new air blocking animation just for HG .

 

[Tiger Wong]

Probably not.

But other than making a different move OP or nerfing something badly, nothing else is gonna change her so fairly. Giving her a brand new move would be about the only thing that could change her getting smoked by Sinestro etc.

 

[HushoftheWind]

so Martian Manhunter coming out this tuesday, anybody look for a buff towards HG? I know there's a wide discussion on this(i said my piece in the thread), but i really wish they make it where you can do air normals after a flight cancel and i wish she was able to move right after landing from flight.

 

[regulas]

Note: technically it's not that walk speed is that slow, it's that full screen is almost twice as large for the same walk speed.


What they should do? They should make (Air)Wing Evade.

 

[Icy Black Deep]

I didn't think Wing Evade had any actual invincibility, but maybe it does when you're at the top of the evade?
You can avoid the end-of-stage "break-the-glass" intractable on Atlantis if you do wing evade just as the bottom of the wave is reaching you.
I saw Husky Brown do it (by accident?) in tournament last night and can do it pretty reliably in the lab this morning.




I suggest we call this maneuver "Surfin' Bird."
DarthArma

 

[DarthArma]

I didn't think Wing Evade had any actual invincibility, but maybe it does when you're at the top of the evade?
You can avoid the end-of-stage "break-the-glass" intractable on Atlantis if you do wing evade just as the bottom of the wave is reaching you.
I saw Husky Brown do it (by accident?) in tournament last night and can do it pretty reliably in the lab this morning.




I suggest we call this maneuver "Surfin' Bird."
DarthArma

sick, awesome that you took it to the lab. That was a pretty hype moment when husky brown did that last night. Too bad the stream was too laggy to look again

 

[TrulyAmiracle]

Yeah WE does have invul, go to practice vs Aquaman and make him do the trident toss, timed right the WE can make it go right through you every time. t works with interactables and a couple of other things too, Its awesome.

 

[Boodendorf]

Yeah WE does have invul, go to practice vs Aquaman and make him do the trident toss, timed right the WE can make it go right through you every time. t works with interactables and a couple of other things too, Its awesome.

I just noticed that yesterday when I was fighting a lex, by timing WE right you can avoid his j3 every time. Pretty damn useful, wasn't sure if it worked on jump ins but now I know it does.