It's not you who are missing stuff, it's people who miss either his options or MK9 Cagecan anyone telle me why anyone would demand to buff johnny stund double? He is my main and i know that he does not lack pressure game. I A-List is ok too not that bad. what did i miss ?
It is almost guaranteed that one variation no one uses is secret top tier. F/T is my main I know they are good (hell I could see all three variations being viable.) but I barely see them ever and doesn't wonder chef play a ton of characters.They were actually played on tourneys and winning fights that were considered hard at the time. WonderChief used them. That's already more than most of the cast can boast.
And if you take into account particular variations, it gets worse.
Shaolin? Ronins? Stormlords? Ethereals?* Hello anyone?
You can say the same about F/T variations, but at least Lackey has serious backing up here on TYM, although they don't show anything yet...
* - non-Bojutsu, non-SR, non-TG... and maybe non-Piercing would be more accurate, but whatever. Some variations are really obscure at the time. Not sure if anyone even remembers that those exist.
I cannot disagree with any of that, just saying that currently F/T has more representation than some other movesets literally played by nobody - at least yet.It is almost guaranteed that one variation no one uses is secret top tier. F/T is my main I know they are good (hell I could see all three variations being viable.) but I barely see them ever and doesn't wonder chef play a ton of characters.
I'm not even reading this. I posted that several days ago.Here we go again. Was about to say it anyway, so thanks for giving me another reason...
So hey NRS, Thundergod is a problem now apparently, he needs nerfs, okay? So let's nerf his f1, f2, b2 and b3, introduce more scaling on b14 and shit like that. Congratulations, you have better balanced character, right?
Nope, because now MoS and DP are even worse for no reason and their unique tools are still not applicable to anything and don't do anything more straightforward characters can do without hassle of setups.
Another variation doesn't do anything for you when you're playing particular matchup, just like having backup secondary doesn't make your main's bad matchups better. Nerfing some broken variation won't make the rest good. Changing some moveset because you change another one that was having/causing problems makes no sense whatsoever. How the hell can you even justify the opposite?
Oh, and to stick to the topic, that was my prediction in the second paragraph.
Actually I don't think sonya has instant recovery, it has a few frames of recovery because she can't move as fast as mk9 kung lao after a divekick. It is almost instant recovery though. But the difference is that sonyas divekick isn't freaking 5 frames man. You can't downplay kung jins divekick it is better than kung laos for christs sake. Also stop whiffing divekicks then, you are using it wrong if you keep whiffing it.Fool, the entire game is rush down oriented with limited to no zoning.
Kung Jin is legitimate. The dive kick is highly punishable on block and whiff. Do you know whose dive kick is not? Sonya's. Her dive kick has no whiff recovery frames.
Im not saying Jacqui is broken tier and crying for the nerfbat, but id rather they designed her to be an interesting zoner than a newbie swatter. if it hurts the experience for newcomers and possibly the future of this game then im all for changing itLol. Anyone suggesting nerfing Jacqui's machine gun clearly knows very little about the game.
And nah, bow swat is fine. If you wanna nerf Jin, make his njp much more unsafe on block so he can't just throw it out and plow through anyone's attempts at poking. Or, give bow swat and bow swing higher damage scaling.
It's ok though because people still talk about thatI'm not even reading this. I posted that several days ago.
Wouldn't a buff be more fitting? To nerf something generally means to make it worse. >_>Can they nerf Shinnok's Necro hands? It looks stupid.
Or they can make him have nerf hands!!Wouldn't a buff be more fitting? To nerf something generally means to make it worse. >_>
More like it means to make something weaker / less pronounced. So if you nerf his "skeleton-ness", then some will consider it a buff to appearance...Wouldn't a buff be more fitting? To nerf something generally means to make it worse. >_>
Absolutely not, fool.Can they nerf Shinnok's Necro hands? It looks stupid.
W/e Shinnok is free anyways.Absolutely not, fool.
How would you have them make her an 'interesting zoner'? I couldn't care less if you can't be bothered to go into training mode to spend literally two minutes to figure out how to get around constant guns. Seriously, they're not even difficult to get around (if anything they need a buff). She needs her guns the way they are, unless they wanna buff all her normals and make them faster to compensate, how is she to compete?Im not saying Jacqui is broken tier and crying for the nerfbat, but id rather they designed her to be an interesting zoner than a newbie swatter. if it hurts the experience for newcomers and possibly the future of this game then im all for changing it
I never had too much a problem with Vanilla Deathstroke but i agree he needed some sort of nerf. in SF4 zangeifs high priority Lariat got made easier to punish in the update because you could mash that move over and over on some players because they didnt know the right timing to sweep him. there can be a middle ground here, i think of MK games as a more accessible fighter with the depth for competitive play so stuff like this im all for changing.
p.s LOL
"Not interesting character" is not the same as "powerful", "unfun to play / play against" and whatnot.How would you have them make her an 'interesting zoner'? I couldn't care less if you can't be bothered to go into training mode to spend literally two minutes to figure out how to get around constant guns. Seriously, they're not even difficult to get around. She needs her guns the way they are, unless they wanna buff all her normals and make them faster to compensate, how is she to compete?
His suggestion was to make rockets an ex move and not MB so you have to commit to the bar at the very beginning and they can see the ex version is gonna come out from the start. My point was this doesn't make her anymore 'interesting' in the slightest."Not interesting character" is not the same as "powerful", "unfun to play / play against" and whatnot.
That said, I have no idea what original poster wanted her to be.
Definitely not, but that wasn't is that same message, so I don't think he means it. Sounds like "they didn't make it interesting, could as well do X and Y instead". Motivation is explained later.His suggestion was to make rockets an ex move and not MB so you have to commit to the bar at the very beginning and they can see the ex version is gonna come out from the start. My point was this doesn't make her anymore 'interesting' in the slightest.
Remember what I said about finding a middle ground. If she relies so heavily on one move that a slight nerf on her projectile makes her not fit for competitive play than maybe some more changes are required? Then she could hopefully be more fun to play VS and also be viable. I may not know the best answer to rebalance her, thats why im here to discuss things. if you want to talk more about how bad you think I am at this game then feel free.How would you have them make her an 'interesting zoner'? I couldn't care less if you can't be bothered to go into training mode to spend literally two minutes to figure out how to get around constant guns. Seriously, they're not even difficult to get around (if anything they need a buff). She needs her guns the way they are, unless they wanna buff all her normals and make them faster to compensate, how is she to compete?
Fun is subjective. I find her very fun to play against. There is absolutely no reason to change her. She doesn't 'rely' on one move, it's just an important part of her toolset that without would make her much worse. Her toolset as a whole is balanced around controlling horizontal space. Limit one of the moves she uses to do that, and there goes a lot of her game plan. With the ridiculous amount of rushdown in this game, the fact that you can't run in as you please doesn't mean there's anything wrong with her.Remember what I said about finding a middle ground. If she relies so heavily on one move that a slight nerf on her projectile makes her not fit for competitive play than maybe some more changes are required? Then she could hopefully be more fun to play VS and also be viable. I may not know the best answer to rebalance her, thats why im here to discuss things. if you want to talk more about how bad you think I am at this game then feel free.
It's only a problem for them because they refuse to learn how to get around it. This isn't even 'prepatch deathstroke frame trap' guns, this is, 'fully avoidable by neutral crouch and easily blockable on reaction' guns. You have 0 excuses for not being able to get around someone 'spamming' this move; it's not even that good.I believe she can still be a good zoner whilst receiving some sort of nerf on her machine gun I doubt it has to be one or the other. And like I said before Im not for nerfing her completely but rebalancing how she plays. I know that alot of peole on this site may have no problem with her and that you enjoy the match up. But its a problem for many players and I dont see how anyone can find it entertaining to watch.