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People who think counter-picking is "sleezy or impure"

Peckapowa

Peckapowa

Noob


First off, i'm pulling a perfect legend by making 2 threads as today is my first day back from my ban, and i REALLY crave attention....

My philosophy is this, if you have the confidence and skill to play more than one character at a high level, why not exploit that fact... you go to tournaments to win, period. Now it goes along way, and i've learned the hard way, playing with more than one character can fuck you over because people like woundcowboy MASTER one character and it shows..

Now i think your sleezy if you play doomsday and it kills me to see the better players like reo (though he needs to work on the mu) and playing to win lose in tournaments when they seem like the strongest players, but at the end of the day fighting games, especially injustice are 90% systematic exploitation.

People who travel to tournaments and expend resources and time to play characters like lex luthor, joker, or 50% of the cast are nuts, and deserve to be counter-picked, unless they have a strong secondary to counter-act their bad matchups. I think, if you want to be the best, you are foolish not to pick a top tier character or even two to play with, and foolish not to exploit matchups if you know them...

People may call this dishonorable and/or scrubby but the same people are nursing on the tits of the scrubby shit in this game...

that being said i could never bring myself to pick up scrubby ass sonya
 
A

arde5643

Noob
Some people can do it and prosper, some people can't and yet still prosper.

Fortunately Injustice, besides being a heavy match-up based game, have enough gimmicks and shenanigans where with the right brackets, NON-TOP TIER character loyalists can still eek it out to top 16 or at times even top 8.
 
Matix218

Matix218

Get over here!
Does anyone actually care about people counter picking (or expect people not to if they have the ability to play a character that helps give them the edge)?

That is the advantage of having multiple characters that you can play at a high level. The disadvantage is that I feel that your main character will inherently never become as strong as it could potentially be because you are focusing on multiple characters rather than learning every nuance/match-up of just 1 character.

But if you are in a tournament and want to counter pick rather than play your main character... Go for it, who cares? Your opponent shouldn't care, the option is always available for them as well.

I mean look at King and 16 bit at Evo in MK9, that is a HARD counterpick right there, but do you really think 16 Bit thinks that it is "wrong" that Forever King did this? If anything he probably took it as a compliment because basically King is saying "look, I fear your main enough that I don't even want to play my own main, I am going to use this other character due to the match-up being massively in my favor" which is essentially giving Props to 16Bit.

Unless the rules of a tournament are "character lock" there is no reason to be complaining that your opponent is "sleazy or impure" if they counter pick you. You always have the option to either overcome the counter pick by out playing them or to counter pick yourself.

Last time I checked there were no 10-0 match-ups in either IGAU or MK9 (some bad ones yes but no 10-0).
 
Justice

Justice

Noob
arde5643 said:
Some people can do it and prosper, some people can't and yet still prosper.

Fortunately Injustice, besides being a heavy match-up based game, have enough gimmicks and shenanigans where with the right brackets, NON-TOP TIER character loyalists can still eek it out to top 16 or at times even top 8.
Click to expand...
A you seriously suggesting that 16 Bit only got second because of an easy bracket? And people think I'm nutz...
 
RoboCop

RoboCop

The future of law enforcement.
Administrator
Premium Supporter
Counterpicking in a tournament is a perfectly acceptable strategy, but these assholes in online casuals who refuse to pick a character until you do and then run down the timer so the stage is random can burn in hell.
 
Mr. Mileena

Mr. Mileena

Noob
arde5643 said:
Some people can do it and prosper, some people can't and yet still prosper.

Fortunately Injustice, besides being a heavy match-up based game, have enough gimmicks and shenanigans where with the right brackets, NON-TOP TIER character loyalists can still eek it out to top 16 or at times even top 8.
Click to expand...
You're an idiot.
 
SoundsLikePAUSE

SoundsLikePAUSE

Neptune's Beard!!!
I don't know, I've seen counter-picking backfire more often than not. If someone's entering a tournament with a "low tier" character, most likely they know their bad MU's pretty well.

I have no issue with it, it is what it is, but I think you're always better off just sticking with your main.
 
F

Fred Marvel

It's actually Freddy Marvel
i dont think sleazy and impure are the right words its just a scumbag thing to do BUT in a tournament with money on the line i completely understand it and its reasonable
i just dont get why people counterpick online lol
 
Gesture Required Ahead

Gesture Required Ahead

Get on that hook
karaokelove said:
Counterpicking in a tournament is a perfectly acceptable strategy, but these assholes in online casuals who refuse to pick a character until you do and then run down the timer so the stage is random can burn in hell.
Click to expand...
This.

That's why, for online it should be like in SF or Soul Calibur where you don't get to see the opponent's character until after. But at the very least we have hidden select.
 
juicepouch

juicepouch

blink-182 enthusiast
Fred Marvel said:
i dont think sleazy and impure are the right words its just a scumbag thing to do BUT in a tournament with money on the line i completely understand it and its reasonable
i just dont get why people counterpick online lol
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I was playing a long set online yesterday and I was using grundy vs this guy's DD for a while, then I went to my not-even-good-enough-to-be-called-an-alt Raven, I beat him by one hit and he immediately picks DS. It's immediately apparent that he knows even less about DS than I do about Raven and I bodied him hard :rolleyes:

I just don't get it. I didn't even kill his DD, it was a close game that I think we both learned from, but I guess he'd rather jump to a character that he didn't play so he could claim to be better if he won, and even that didn't work
 
DOOMSDAY-15RUS-

DOOMSDAY-15RUS-

i'LL DESTROY YOU ALL
my main is DD forever, dont care about him in tier list but i still have 2nd BG just for fun and yeah i dont like people who exploite the game and pick top tier just to win and add 2nd top tier to counter
 
Justice

Justice

Noob
I'm a loyalist. Always have been and always will be. I firmly believe that working through a character's bad matchups instead of picking a counter shows failings as a player. I also believe that it's the loyalists that develop the meta more by forcing themselves to find dirt or strats or whatever. I will not blast the counter-picker because at the end of the day, games are meant to be fun and not everyone can slug it out with only 1 character for say 1.5 yrs without going bonkerz. It takes both to make the world go round.

I'm reminded of a DoA grand finals match. One player got ahead 2-0 but his opponent was running it back. So the score is 2-2 with the first player sitting on the character select screen wondering what to do. And all they talked about on commentary was "We know he has a X-character sub, but does he really want to give his opponent the mental edge going into the last round but changing his character, basically admitting that his main got beat?" For the record, he did stick with his main, tweaked his strategy and won the tournament.

This is the kind of things that com to mind for me when discussing this issue. Sure, at the end of the day, P1 counter picks and gets the duke. But everyone watching (and most importantly hi opponent) knows that he couldn't get the job done with his main.
 
Peckapowa

Peckapowa

Noob
I prefer to play challenging mus because its fun and teaches me online
Justice said:
I'm a loyalist. Always have been and always will be. I firmly believe that working through a character's bad matchups instead of picking a counter shows failings as a player. I also believe that it's the loyalists that develop the meta more by forcing themselves to find dirt or strats or whatever. I will not blast the counter-picker because at the end of the day, games are meant to be fun and not everyone can slug it out with only 1 character for say 1.5 yrs without going bonkerz. It takes both to make the world go round.

I'm reminded of a DoA grand finals match. One player got ahead 2-0 but his opponent was running it back. So the score is 2-2 with the first player sitting on the character select screen wondering what to do. And all they talked about on commentary was "We know he has a X-character sub, but does he really want to give his opponent the mental edge going into the last round but changing his character, basically admitting that his main got beat?" For the record, he did stick with his main, tweaked his strategy and won the tournament.

This is the kind of things that com to mind for me when discussing this issue. Sure, at the end of the day, P1 counter picks and gets the duke. But everyone watching (and most importantly hi opponent) knows that he couldn't get the job done with his main.
Click to expand...

the stronger the community, the longer a game is played, the number of viable characters decreases significantly, this game similarlly to mk9 which has kenshi freddie sonya kabal, has characters that cause many lopsided matchups (zod, aquaman, martian manhunter)

if we had 20 reos mk9 would have been VERY VERY VERY different and much more mundane
 
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