no more useless moves pls

[imblackjames]

I dont think any moves or strings are useless theyre for swag. Theyre also for bragging, cuz if you het hit by one of them then thats your fault for doing something wrong

 

[Barrogh]

I dont think any moves or strings are useless theyre for swag. Theyre also for bragging, cuz if you het hit by one of them then thats your fault for doing something wrong

I feel that this approach to designing MK is responsible for like 75% of what's wrong with the game.

 

[Wetdoba]

I dont think any moves or strings are useless theyre for swag. Theyre also for bragging, cuz if you het hit by one of them then thats your fault for doing something wrong

A move can still be stylish while having a purpose and actually be applicable at a high level. Then there's shit like Noob's F43 that's fucking 8 years on start up for a high high string that does less damage than his others and only combos into teleslam and ddoesnt even set up a portalgimmick. The definition of useless.l, and what's worse is he only had what 6 strings? And 3 were garbage, the other 3 were average. Mkx looks like it's giving normals the respect they deserve though, better stay that way for Noob when he gets announced (I believe!)

 

[Pterodactyl]

I do think there should be some "swag-yolo" strings and special normals but they should be risk-reward not risk-risk, if you know what I mean.

Sort of like pre-patch Fulgore's laser.

 

[Tony at Home]

Kitana F312. Looks so cool, but you can poke between the 1 and 2 and it added no combo unless you were in the corner and caught the d1 cutter x3. But it looks swag so...

But I agree, no more useless moves. Make every string have something decent for it. I think they did that with Arrow, I use all his strings because they are all situational. Even his b13 and 113. Even though you dont see them too often.

Doesn't this move hit overhead at one point? Ergo allowing the move to be canceled into her low-kick for a bit of a mix up?

You can argue that it's useless in a well developed metagame where each character has been optimized properly, but I don't see how that string is useless from a developer's standpoint.

It's a game made for a wide audience, I don't think they're gonna consider a move useless because players can d1 out of it.

 

[EarlyReflections]

Funny everyone talks about useless normals and Jade isn't mentioned anywhere

 

[PunkMafia83]

I think someone should to a poll for most useless move in injustice and mk9.

 

[Pterodactyl]

Who are the characters that legitimately have no useless moves in MK9?

I think someone should to a poll for most useless move in injustice and mk9.

It would just be a tie between Baraka's u4 and Ermac's lift.

 

[Barrogh]

Sort of like pre-patch Fulgore's laser.

I'm afraid not everyone here speaks fluent KI though...

It would just be a tie between Baraka's u4 and Ermac's lift.

I think you meant levi slam. Then again, I've seen people using that thing as a bait or something. Not sure.

 

[Ray'sGoodLiquor]

I think you meant levi slam. Then again, I've seen people using that thing as a bait or something. Not sure.

It's mostly used for punishable gimmicks. You can cancel it full screen to try to bait jumps, you can delay the slam by holding the button which is always a bad idea, and you can teleport out of it. Most of the cast can blow it up pretty easily.

 

[IrishMantis]

I thought they did a decent job in Injustice more useful moves over MK9 but still some weird moves (Batman and nightwing)

 

[xInfra Deadx]

You're wasting your breath.

 

[rev0lver]

You guys are doing it wrong. Stop trying to justify the usefulness of a useless move in MK9/Inj. As much as you want to credit-whore for tech, what op means is that moves/strings should be given a CLEAR purpose. Or even an unclear one.

Why? The purpose is swag.

Srsly though, we give purpose to these things. Not everything has to be obvious. I think it's a fun part of the game to learn what you can do with every tool you have. It's how fighting games evolve. You're not necessarily fleshing out next year's high level play in game design anyway, you're just making things look good and not too broken.

 

[1man3letters]

this is like what I want most from MKX besides Noob Saibot's return.

why does NRS make some moves look amazingly swaggerific and then give them some of the most laughable frame data ever? Why can't I make cool things happen with Baraka's U4?

Why are there strings that don't even lead to anything? There's no knock up, sometimes not even frame advantage, and there were pokes in MK9 that left YOU at a disadvantage(???).

so, please, NRS, reconsider when you give Noob's really sick new move a 40 frame start up. And then confirm Noob for MKX. thanks

ah baraka's u4, the ultimate disrespect

http://testyourmight.com/threads/the-misadventures-of-u4.24552/

 

[Gesture Required Ahead]

im not sure if i missed some sarcasm or something but reptiles 2 3+4 is useful, if u end a combo with the 2 and the 3+4 OTGs them you're like +10

Thats the kind of move that gets good as the meta evolves.

Uhh, wtf are you talking about? 2 3+4 is -24 and why do that when 2 F3 1+2 does more damage and leaves you at +8?

 

[trufenix]

Dear NRS, please stop putting variety and creativity in your games. All these options are getting in the way of everyone playing the game the exact same way.

signed,
your smallest consumer base

 

[Sage Leviathan]

Referring to the casuals who buy the game, play it for 30 minutes, and never touch it again?

Yeah, f8ck those guys. No more useless moves.

 

[Barrogh]

Dear NRS, please stop putting variety and creativity in your games. All these options are getting in the way of everyone playing the game the exact same way.

signed,
your smallest consumer base

If NRS actually bothered to put decent options in movelists, you wouldn't see us "playing exactly the same".
What you call creativity is lack of one to me - what interesting properties do those shit moves have to justify their terrible framedata? Nothing. Instead we just have a ton of shit that is fast, safe and lead to big damage, and then you have stuff that offers nothing from that list and nothing else either. Special properties? What's that, never heard of it.

 

[trufenix]

If NRS actually bothered to put decent options in movelists, you wouldn't see us "playing exactly the same".
What you call creativity is lack of one to me - what interesting properties do those shit moves have to justify their terrible framedata? Nothing. Instead we just have a ton of shit that is fast, safe and lead to big damage, and then you have stuff that offers nothing from that list and nothing else either. Special properties? What's that, never heard of it.

The bad (good) news is, nobody at NRS is as genius (closed minded) as you that they can predict (wildly assume) the worth and value of every (the few you understand) move in the entire game (one character you use) day one (years after release) and therefore trim the fat (cripple the longevity) of the game before its released and forgotten (enjoyed by millions). Nobody is going to waste time (enjoy exploring the game with all their friends) when they could just play a well respected (nobody cares or even remembers) game like Virtua Fighter or Dive Kick or Skullgirls because complex (inflexible and uninteresting) games always (never) outlast the ones with tons of fluff (creativity). After all, no game (marvel, guilty, blaz, tekken, kof, doa, street fighter, fucking mortal kombat 9) with excessive and frankly baffling (all figured out with ease) movelists options has ever (always are) been any fun to play competitively.

 

[7L]

Doesn't this move hit overhead at one point? Ergo allowing the move to be canceled into her low-kick for a bit of a mix up?

You can argue that it's useless in a well developed metagame where each character has been optimized properly, but I don't see how that string is useless from a developer's standpoint.

It's a game made for a wide audience, I don't think they're gonna consider a move useless because players can d1 out of it.

That's her f41.
This move she kicks out then swings her fans upward, launching them awkwardly lol

 

[Barrogh]

The bad (good) news is, nobody at NRS is as genius (closed minded) as you that they can predict (wildly assume) the worth and value of every (the few you understand) move in the entire game (one character you use) day one (years after release) and therefore trim the fat (cripple the longevity) of the game before its released and forgotten (enjoyed by millions). Nobody is going to waste time (enjoy exploring the game with all their friends) when they could just play a well respected (nobody cares or even remembers) game like Virtua Fighter or Dive Kick or Skullgirls because complex (inflexible and uninteresting) games always (never) outlast the ones with tons of fluff (creativity). After all, no game (marvel, guilty, blaz, tekken, kof, doa, street fighter, fucking mortal kombat 9) with excessive and frankly baffling (all figured out with ease) movelists options has ever (always are) been any fun to play competitively.

Sorry, but bad moves were never a requirement for memorable fluff, so I don't get what you're trying to imply here.
They don't even add personality to picture of a character we're looking at because as those moves never used, they don't grow upon it and won't really be associated with character in question.
The only other part of your post I can make sense of and think is valid is that game designers can't be perfect, but that's why we're saying for years that NRS should not drop support so soon (while being super energetic with patches early on, I should mention), and in fact quite willing to pay for that.
As much as you're trying to be above the crowd of "crybabies" on this forum, I suggest you to drop that cloud of sarcasm so thick it obscures your sight on the substance of discussion and try to contribute. Like, explaining logically why obviously bad moves (most slow, unsafe, not damaging, not leading to any setups, even punishable on hit) must be in the game in order for it to have good fluff and be fun competitively (see, I can twist words too).

Before you reply, please understand that "no more useless moves" doesn't mean "give us a single right move instead of multitude", but quite the opposite, because you see, it's not "excessive move list" where only 1-2 normals are worth using, it's quite the opposite.

I hope that clarifies a bit what exactly we are talking about.

 

[Tony at Home]

That's her f41.
This move she kicks out then swings her fans upward, launching them awkwardly lol

Ohh that one.

Forgot about it because I never use it... In which case, point taken

 

[Wemfs]

Noob's F43 was kinda meh for corner combo dmg and portal setups. He had other combo enders that did more dmg and left the opponent in the exact same position for a portal setup. I mainly used his F43 for a fatality finisher.

 

[RYX]

Dear NRS, please stop putting variety and creativity in your games. All these options are getting in the way of everyone playing the game the exact same way.

signed,
your smallest consumer base

I guess if you want to miss the point of the thread entirely, that's up to you.

You can make moves look good and creative while still making them actually useful in a way that isn't the equivalent of teabagging.

Conversely, I'd find it far more engaging as a player to have more moves with a clear purpose, because those are the ones that usually evolve to become better.

 

[dittO]

I believe there are some moves that seem "useless" only because there are some other moves "overpacked" with many beneficial properties (see Mileena's d4 in MK9 for example).
NRS can simply nerf...or just avoid giving too many properties on certain moves/strings so that almost everything can be "useful" at some degree.
Although I have to admit, it's very rare in a fighting game character to not have one or two (sometimes more) completely useless moves.