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Political Discussion Thread

Zoidberg747

My blades will find your heart
Appearently you don't understand. Our government cant create currency without creating debt. FACT. And honestly other than petty ethical choices I honestly fail to see the difference between the parties as well. Neither one has our (I mean the american peoples) best intrest in mind. If this isn't the case, allow me to ask you a question: Why is it that, even though every so often, the different parties gain and lose control over the senate/congess/presidency, nothing ever gets any better? I really feel in my gut, like deep down inside, that one day our reptillian overlords will reveal themselves and feast upon the entrails humanity. Okay that last part was a joke, but in all seriousness: WE ARE ALL SLAVES AND PAY THE COST OF OUR OWN SLAVERY.
To say that liberals and conservatives are even remotely similar shows a complete lack of political understanding.

And while the government can create currency without debt, that would cause inflation making said currency worth next to nothing.
 

SquirtMcGirt

Purple balls covering the screen
No it can't lol. The treasury has to pledge bonds to the federal reserve, bonds are basically little peices of paper that say, I will pay back said amount of money plus intrest. So to simplify it (and this isnt exactly how it works im just trying to give you an idea): if the treasury needs money say 1$ they have to borrow it from the fed at intrest. lets say for every dollar they borrow, they have to pay back a dollar of intrest. so i borrowed my dollar, now, where do I get the other dollar to pay back the two dollars I owe the fed? My only option at this point is to borrow another dollar. Our currency is inflated. If you compare the value of a dollar today to the value of a dollar in 1913 (When our country adopted the federal reserve system and fractional reserve banking) you will find that the dollar today is worth a little less then 4 cents. Thats over a 96% DEVALUATION of american currency. Things don't cost MORE than they did back then. Our money is worth LESS then it was back then. Inflation is a hidden tax on the american people.
 

SquirtMcGirt

Purple balls covering the screen
The only way TOO make more currency (what we think of today as money isn't money it's currency, there is a difference) is for the government to borrow it at intrest from the fed. Look into I am right.
 

SquirtMcGirt

Purple balls covering the screen
I take that back, the money supply can also be expanded through fractional reserve banking, but that is just as messed up.

Sent from Sam Wheat in the Phantom Zone.
 

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
I don't think the government should be involved in things like health care and marriage, I more of a libertarian than anything really.

I think anyone should be able to get married if they want to without government getting involved.

I'm against gun control

I'm kind of against abortion to be honest.

I'm against Obamacare... Being forced to buy health care or you get fined is not something I would call constitutional.

Syria should be up to congress. The reason being is because the executive branch was the one most likely to try to go to war. This is why that power was left to the congress.
 

Zoidberg747

My blades will find your heart
No it can't lol. The treasury has to pledge bonds to the federal reserve, bonds are basically little peices of paper that say, I will pay back said amount of money plus intrest. So to simplify it (and this isnt exactly how it works im just trying to give you an idea): if the treasury needs money say 1$ they have to borrow it from the fed at intrest. lets say for every dollar they borrow, they have to pay back a dollar of intrest. so i borrowed my dollar, now, where do I get the other dollar to pay back the two dollars I owe the fed? My only option at this point is to borrow another dollar. Our currency is inflated. If you compare the value of a dollar today to the value of a dollar in 1913 (When our country adopted the federal reserve system and fractional reserve banking) you will find that the dollar today is worth a little less then 4 cents. Thats over a 96% DEVALUATION of american currency. Things don't cost MORE than they did back then. Our money is worth LESS then it was back then. Inflation is a hidden tax on the american people.


The only way TOO make more currency (what we think of today as money isn't money it's currency, there is a difference) is for the government to borrow it at intrest from the fed. Look into I am right.
Money is a part of currency.

Things do cost more now than in 1913, but that is because of inflation. Inflation is not a hidden tax either, it is a part of the economy. The government can't decrease inflation without increasing unemployment and decreasing GDP. Of course too much inflation is a bad thing but so is total deflation. Any health economy has some inflation.

As for your other points, like I said before, there are ways to reduce the government debt. They probably will never be implemented, but that is because both sides would never agree to any of them.
 

TheSpore

Nurgle Chaos God of Death and Disease
I typically do not get involved in this topic, but I will make an exception for TYM. I try to stay on the side of impartiality when it comes to these topics, I try to make assessments based off facts and logic rather than base them on opinions.

Abortion: This issue I am on the fence I see the rationality of why it should be allowed and why not. Judging by what I know thus far on the subject. A woman’s body is hers alone to make the call as to what she should do with it not the decision of the government’s. I see abortion should be allowed, but there should be a cut off mark, a stopping point on depending how far along the child is developed. I do not see a late term abortion being allowed. By that time the baby is more developed and is thus far a living breathing child. NO woman should be forced to bare a child they do not want nor have the ability to care for, they should have the ability choose what is right for themselves, especially if the health and welfare for the mother is at stake. There have been cases where the mother has died due to birth complications that could have been resolved by the use of abortion, in which in many of those cases the child was already a still born. Also it should be noted that with giving women the option to safely have an abortion it reduces the factor of the mother going out and finding more illegal and unsafe means to abort the child.

Gun Control: Here is a big issue in its own. Guns are not the issue studies and statistics have shown and proven this multiple times and taking guns away will only make matters worse. Morons will get their guns even if they have to do it illegally plain and simple. It is written within the Constitution and we should never allow our government the ability to circumvent it, for if we do we now give them the free pass to remove and take away more rights and freedoms within our country. This doesn’t mean there exist no issue with gun violence in the country, there is enough evidence to prove there does exist an issue in the US. With that said the factors that are being over looked are that often these guns used with in crimes are not owned by the criminals who commit the acts and in the different cases the recent mass shootings show that the mental health of these individuals is part of the problem itself. If we must place restrictions on weapons, then I say place a registry on weapons, honestly why is it we have to register a vehicle, but not a dangerous weapon that serves the purpose of only taking life. Mental health of the buyers needs to be questioned as well. Better background checks on the level of what is needed to obtain a security clearance IMO is the only way that this is going to be able solve this issue. Oh yeah and less conspiracy theorists coming up new insane ideas about false flag operations too.

Marijuana legalization: It has been proven scientifically to be useful in the world of medicine, proven to be far less harmful than tobacco and alcohol, which are legal. It has cost way too many lives and way too much money to fight against. There are currently people serving prison time simply for even possessing it. It is one of the leading causes of crime and is one of the reasons the drug cartels continue to profit from the US and has aided in funding many of the anti-American terrorist groups that wish to do harm on the US. If the fed. Government were to legalize it, it most likely would reduce crime and the government could manage it like alcohol is managed allowing only people of a certain age and above to have access to it. If it were to be grown and harvested and taxed, it would allow the government to gain a large amount of revenue it wouldn’t even be funny. The fact that it is still illegal is absolutely insane.

Syria: I’ll get back this one later!!!

Obamacare: The scourge of the shutdown. There is so many issues here it’s unreal. For one the insurance companies currently are the gate keepers of medical care and the current for profit medical system is falling apart and has de-evolved into being all about greed and money. There is a reason the republicans do not want this, because it threatens those corporations ability to hold medical care for ransom. No Obama Care is not a perfect system, it will raise taxes and will hurt the economy in the beginning, but in time as the loose ends of this system are tied up, it will become a beneficial part of America. There is a boat load of misinformation about it circulating that many do not understand what it even will do. My favorite argument here is this exact statement I hear everyday “I have to pay for health care fuck you if you don’t money to pay for your own”. Great way thinking in all, but go tell that to the little child who is suffering and dying of a treatable illness, simply because their parents cannot afford to help them. I suffer everyday of my life with Type-1 Diabetes, if I didn’t have medical benefits with my current employer I would be dead now and have to leave a 6 and 3 year old without their father. No one should have to decide their life and health over how much will it cost. The shutdown happened simply, due to two parties refusing to work together to better solidify this act and the sad part is everyone blames one over the other. The republicans wouldn’t let shit happen to move their own agenda and the democrats decided to stubborn and childish over it. Both are at fault not one over the other.

War on terror: Will get back to this later!!!

Gay Marriage: For the love of God, if a person’s only reasoning why this is illegal is simply because “God said its wrong” and they follow a book that tells them how to live their life, then they need to shut it. There has yet to be any valid argument outside of religion that states why this should and needs to be illegal. Folks this why church and state are separated, if we allow religious views to dictate decisions within our government, then we gonna be burning witches at the stake eventually and stoning woman who cheat on their husbands.

Sorry for such a long post, but these are my views and I hope you enjoy reading them J



I
 

Duck Nation

Dicks with a future
I'm against Obamacare... Being forced to buy health care or you get fined is not something I would call constitutional.
Then you really don't know anything about the constitution. Obamacare is no more unconstitutional than social security. It's taxation and well within the rights of the federal government.
 

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
Then you really don't know anything about the constitution. Obamacare is no more unconstitutional than social security. It's taxation and well within the rights of the federal government.
Social Security is also unconstitutional, it's another forced insurance policy. If SS was a choice (you're not forced to pay and maybe collect it) then I'd be all for it. Who is the government to tell me "hey bro pay this now and we'll hold you down later" when I can just manage the money myself? Not to mentioned the program is a failure financially.
 

Zoidberg747

My blades will find your heart
I typically do not get involved in this topic, but I will make an exception for TYM. I try to stay on the side of impartiality when it comes to these topics, I try to make assessments based off facts and logic rather than base them on opinions.

Abortion: This issue I am on the fence I see the rationality of why it should be allowed and why not. Judging by what I know thus far on the subject. A woman’s body is hers alone to make the call as to what she should do with it not the decision of the government’s. I see abortion should be allowed, but there should be a cut off mark, a stopping point on depending how far along the child is developed. I do not see a late term abortion being allowed. By that time the baby is more developed and is thus far a living breathing child. NO woman should be forced to bare a child they do not want nor have the ability to care for, they should have the ability choose what is right for themselves, especially if the health and welfare for the mother is at stake. There have been cases where the mother has died due to birth complications that could have been resolved by the use of abortion, in which in many of those cases the child was already a still born. Also it should be noted that with giving women the option to safely have an abortion it reduces the factor of the mother going out and finding more illegal and unsafe means to abort the child.

Gun Control: Here is a big issue in its own. Guns are not the issue studies and statistics have shown and proven this multiple times and taking guns away will only make matters worse. Morons will get their guns even if they have to do it illegally plain and simple. It is written within the Constitution and we should never allow our government the ability to circumvent it, for if we do we now give them the free pass to remove and take away more rights and freedoms within our country. This doesn’t mean there exist no issue with gun violence in the country, there is enough evidence to prove there does exist an issue in the US. With that said the factors that are being over looked are that often these guns used with in crimes are not owned by the criminals who commit the acts and in the different cases the recent mass shootings show that the mental health of these individuals is part of the problem itself. If we must place restrictions on weapons, then I say place a registry on weapons, honestly why is it we have to register a vehicle, but not a dangerous weapon that serves the purpose of only taking life. Mental health of the buyers needs to be questioned as well. Better background checks on the level of what is needed to obtain a security clearance IMO is the only way that this is going to be able solve this issue. Oh yeah and less conspiracy theorists coming up new insane ideas about false flag operations too.

Marijuana legalization: It has been proven scientifically to be useful in the world of medicine, proven to be far less harmful than tobacco and alcohol, which are legal. It has cost way too many lives and way too much money to fight against. There are currently people serving prison time simply for even possessing it. It is one of the leading causes of crime and is one of the reasons the drug cartels continue to profit from the US and has aided in funding many of the anti-American terrorist groups that wish to do harm on the US. If the fed. Government were to legalize it, it most likely would reduce crime and the government could manage it like alcohol is managed allowing only people of a certain age and above to have access to it. If it were to be grown and harvested and taxed, it would allow the government to gain a large amount of revenue it wouldn’t even be funny. The fact that it is still illegal is absolutely insane.

Syria: I’ll get back this one later!!!

Obamacare: The scourge of the shutdown. There is so many issues here it’s unreal. For one the insurance companies currently are the gate keepers of medical care and the current for profit medical system is falling apart and has de-evolved into being all about greed and money. There is a reason the republicans do not want this, because it threatens those corporations ability to hold medical care for ransom. No Obama Care is not a perfect system, it will raise taxes and will hurt the economy in the beginning, but in time as the loose ends of this system are tied up, it will become a beneficial part of America. There is a boat load of misinformation about it circulating that many do not understand what it even will do. My favorite argument here is this exact statement I hear everyday “I have to pay for health care fuck you if you don’t money to pay for your own”. Great way thinking in all, but go tell that to the little child who is suffering and dying of a treatable illness, simply because their parents cannot afford to help them. I suffer everyday of my life with Type-1 Diabetes, if I didn’t have medical benefits with my current employer I would be dead now and have to leave a 6 and 3 year old without their father. No one should have to decide their life and health over how much will it cost. The shutdown happened simply, due to two parties refusing to work together to better solidify this act and the sad part is everyone blames one over the other. The republicans wouldn’t let shit happen to move their own agenda and the democrats decided to stubborn and childish over it. Both are at fault not one over the other.

War on terror: Will get back to this later!!!

Gay Marriage: For the love of God, if a person’s only reasoning why this is illegal is simply because “God said its wrong” and they follow a book that tells them how to live their life, then they need to shut it. There has yet to be any valid argument outside of religion that states why this should and needs to be illegal. Folks this why church and state are separated, if we allow religious views to dictate decisions within our government, then we gonna be burning witches at the stake eventually and stoning woman who cheat on their husbands.

Sorry for such a long post, but these are my views and I hope you enjoy reading them J



I
I agree with you 100%.

Great points.
 

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
The founders did not intend for the government to take from one and give to another. The way the country is now we really can't live without the social safety nets but it's because people were made to rely on it. How are people supposed to ever get on their feet when a lot of programs like welfare give no incentive to get off?Guy on welfare works hard, gets a raise, loses benefits and makes less money than when he collected. It's almost like it's designed to keep people at the bottom.
 

Zoidberg747

My blades will find your heart
The founders did not intend for the government to take from one and give to another. The way the country is now we really can't live without the social safety nets but it's because people were made to rely on it. How are people supposed to ever get on their feet when a lot of programs like welfare give no incentive to get off?Guy on welfare works hard, gets a raise, loses benefits and makes less money than when he collected. It's almost like it's designed to keep people at the bottom.
But what is the alternative? How is someone going to get off the bottom if they have absolutely nothing? Welfare is designed to give people a chance, a chance which unfortunately more often than not does not work out.
 

TheSpore

Nurgle Chaos God of Death and Disease
The founders did not intend for the government to take from one and give to another. The way the country is now we really can't live without the social safety nets but it's because people were made to rely on it. How are people supposed to ever get on their feet when a lot of programs like welfare give no incentive to get off?Guy on welfare works hard, gets a raise, loses benefits and makes less money than when he collected. It's almost like it's designed to keep people at the bottom.
I do agree here, welfare is a good program, but is badly executed. I think part of the issue with welfare is that as time has progressed inflation has caused prices to rise and yet the min. wage has mostly remained unchanged. Min. wage currently cannot support one individual yet alone a small family. Welfare, needs a time limit on it and another issue I see in the US is constant outsourcing which is definitely affect the amount of jobs available within the country as well.
 

rev0lver

Come On Die Young
Oh yeah and less conspiracy theorists coming up new insane ideas about false flag operations too.

I
Thank you.

I like how whenever a mass shooting happens, people start flocking to the idea that it's a government conspiracy to convince us to put more restrictions on guns, rather than acknowledging the capacity of ordinary humans for evil.

As far as the late-term abortion issue, I don't see why it makes a difference, but I understand why people are against it. Realistically, a human fetus has the same (or probably a lesser) psychological capacity than the animals we kill for food. They may feel physical pain, I don't know the extent of that to be honest, but it's largely irrelevant if we consider that the only reason we feel differently about a fetus is because it's a human. But, in a philosophical and psychological sense, it's not a human yet, which is why it doesn't matter to me. There's still the human attachment and connection though when they're more physically developed like that. Which makes it weird. I don't think I could be involved personally because of that.
 

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
I do agree here, welfare is a good program, but is badly executed. I think part of the issue with welfare is that as time has progressed inflation has caused prices to rise and yet the min. wage has mostly remained unchanged. Min. wage currently cannot support one individual yet alone a small family. Welfare, needs a time limit on it and another issue I see in the US is constant outsourcing which is definitely affect the amount of jobs available within the country as well.
And the outsourcing is usually do to high taxation. Seriously why tax the shit out of big business if you're just going to bail them out with taxpayer money when they're in trouble?
 

Duck Nation

Dicks with a future
"I don't like this" =! " This is unconstitutional." That is not how things work. If you don't like it, well, move to another country that engages in more serious laissez-faire capitalism.

Except, oh wait, America is the only country dumb enough to still have a very small and loose social welfare net. Anywhere else you go in the world, you're going to be taxed more - and frankly, receive more benefit for it too.
 

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
Thank you.

I like how whenever a mass shooting happens, people start flocking to the idea that it's a government conspiracy to convince us to put more restrictions on guns, rather than acknowledging the capacity of ordinary humans for evil.

As far as the late-term abortion issue, I don't see why it makes a difference, but I understand why people are against it. Realistically, a human fetus has the same (or probably a lesser) psychological capacity than the animals we kill for food. They may feel physical pain, I don't know the extent of that to be honest, but it's largely irrelevant if we consider that the only reason we feel differently about a fetus is because it's a human. But, in a philosophical and psychological sense, it's not a human yet, which is why it doesn't matter to me. There's still the human attachment and connection though when they're more physically developed like that. Which makes it weird. I don't think I could be involved personally because of that.
How much of a psychological capacity does a newborn baby have? Whats the difference if you abort the baby before or after it leaves the womb? Is it ok to kill something because it can't yet think for itself?
 

TheSpore

Nurgle Chaos God of Death and Disease
Thank you.

I like how whenever a mass shooting happens, people start flocking to the idea that it's a government conspiracy to convince us to put more restrictions on guns, rather than acknowledging the capacity of ordinary humans for evil.

Have to admit though some of the theories are quite entertaining to read like the Lizard people theories lol

As far as the late-term abortion issue, I don't see why it makes a difference, but I understand why people are against it. Realistically, a human fetus has the same (or probably a lesser) psychological capacity than the animals we kill for food. They may feel physical pain, I don't know the extent of that to be honest, but it's largely irrelevant if we consider that the only reason we feel differently about a fetus is because it's a human. But, in a philosophical and psychological sense, it's not a human yet, which is why it doesn't matter to me. There's still the human attachment and connection though when they're more physically developed like that. Which makes it weird. I don't think I could be involved personally because of that.
Here is the thing a child 10 weeks and under is nothing more than a zygote, after 10 weeks a heart beat is developed and then the child is considered human.

And the outsourcing is usually do to high taxation. Seriously why tax the shit out of big business if you're just going to bail them out with taxpayer money when they're in trouble?
It is perfectly logical that we tax big business more than the small business. If there was less outsourcing then we would see it like this, more jobs = more spending = better economy. Outsourcing puts more American out of a job so the big business can reap more money and get richer. With less outsourcing the system would run like a well oiled machine.
 

Raidenwins

Raiden Practitioner
"I don't like this" =! " This is unconstitutional." That is not how things work. If you don't like it, well, move to another country that engages in more serious laissez-faire capitalism.

Except, oh wait, America is the only country dumb enough to still have a very small and loose social welfare net. Anywhere else you go in the world, you're going to be taxed more - and frankly, receive more benefit for it too.
If America is a dumb country perhaps you should consider moving to another country. And wait a moment, are you actually arguing that being taxed more is a good thing?!
 

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
"I don't like this" =! " This is unconstitutional." That is not how things work. If you don't like it, well, move to another country that engages in more serious laissez-faire capitalism..
How about if I don't like it I should speak against it? Why would I leave the country? This is America right? People have the power to change things right?

Except, oh wait, America is the only country dumb enough to still have a very small and loose social welfare net. Anywhere else you go in the world, you're going to be taxed more - and frankly, receive more benefit for it too.
Ok so I will pay more money to get more of a return? Why not just not pay the extra money and do as I please with it? Why does the government have to make the choice of how to spend my money? Also why are we the global superpower if everyone else is doing everything right?