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Zod is getting nerfed to the ground, apparently.

SimSim

Norwegian Lab-work Champion
If normals can't be canceled to trait grab anymore, I think that's it for me with Zod:/ Not to sound like a whiner, but that's one of the things I found really interesting about him, and without it he just doesn't have as much appeal to me.

We were told earlier that it was supposed to stay though, so why the sudden change?
 

14K

Noob
If normals can't be canceled to trait grab anymore, I think that's it for me with Zod:/ Not to sound like a whiner, but that's one of the things I found really interesting about him, and without it he just doesn't have as much appeal to me.

We were told earlier that it was supposed to stay though, so why the sudden change?
honestly i dont even think the Normals into to Grab is supposed to be this "hard" or a "bug" ... seems stupid i mean the Grab is a Special, a trait special but a special non the less... it should he straight forward you should be able to cancel strings into Lazer Beam or Grab for a mix up (God nows he doesnt have many to speak of)... its a really good mix up but i mean cmon... you can actually nerf him on other areas he may strive but actually fix the Strings into Grabs so we dont have to struggle like we do, to do it... i play mostly online and yeah.. that mix up is not even possible or very rarely does it work... but i do find the Trait CDown is a tad fast... tha tmight be ajusted
 

SimSim

Norwegian Lab-work Champion
honestly i dont even think the Normals into to Grab is supposed to be this "hard" or a "bug" ... seems stupid i mean the Grab is a Special, a trait special but a special non the less... it should he straight forward you should be able to cancel strings into Lazer Beam or Grab for a mix up (God nows he doesnt have many to speak of)... its a really good mix up but i mean cmon... you can actually nerf him on other areas he may strive but actually fix the Strings into Grabs so we dont have to struggle like we do, to do it... i play mostly online and yeah.. that mix up is not even possible or very rarely does it work... but i do find the Trait CDown is a tad fast... tha tmight be ajusted
Hmm you are right, that might be a normalization indeed.

I was of the opinion that he is top 10 and not top 5 as Pig and Jailhouse advertise, so I don't really see a reason to nerf him a lot, except for fixing his bugs.. Let's see what NRS does.
 

14K

Noob
Hmm you are right, that might be a normalization indeed.

I was of the opinion that he is top 10 and not top 5 as Pig and Jailhouse advertise, so I don't really see a reason to nerf him a lot, except for fixing his bugs.. Let's see what NRS does.
Yeah i mean. if they take out the trait mix up, he will move down the list ALOT in my opinion... and i really feel that his gameplayt revolves around getting his trait out to control the opponent... the mix up is really good but in no way is it unescapable... there are many characters with the power to escape even getting put in that situation so... honestly the only thing i would do to him would be

Increasing the CD maybe 1 2 secounds... increasing the downtime by just a tiny tiny bit between trait slaps... and fix the Grab to be cancelable from strings
 

14K

Noob
Godlike



I think they are just taking away his trait and all of his zoning so you probably have nothing to worry about...

So what your saying is they will make him a vegatable of a character... his zooning and his trait are the only things this character is good for...
 

SimSim

Norwegian Lab-work Champion
This is what I think they will do to Zod, followed by comments of what I think they should do instead:
What I think NRS will do = -
What I think they should do= *

-Remove the glitch where he can initiate an animation cancelation "tool" after doing an air normal in the air and then grabbing/trying to grab the opponent with the trait within the first couple of frames he lands.

*They should not remove this, but only fix the shaking/flame carpet he can create, eternity knockdown he can get from a back/neutral throw cancel. By letting this stay, you could set up situations where you sacrifice damage for a mid throw mix up, mid MB laser mix up, faster recovery on 1 zod rifle shot to set up a mix up. This would add to the depth of Zod and not be overpowered as you are giving up guaranteed damage for a mix up that is hard to execute.


-Remove or make his normal cancels in to trait throw easier

*They should leave this alone, since it is a good but very important tool for Zod, that is only available when he has his trait out. Removing it will be a huge loss to Zod and making it easier to execute just makes this tool too available for my taste. I like that you have to set up this technique right to make it available and it adds to the depth of Zod's gameplay.


-Remove his dash cancel in to trait grab

*Another important tool that Zod needs if his trait is going to be more than annoying when activating it from a distance.


-Remove the hard knock down on d1 and d12

*By removing this you take away a LOT of Zod's pressure with trait out, and you are essentially saying: the trait is supposed to be used from far away to annoy the opponent. These 2 strings, if canceled in to trait, gives Zod a way to pressure up close, and without them, Zod will need to use the 123 ender which does not set up a mix up since they can just jump out of a ground laser, or to use it from a distance where he can't pressure.
 

14K

Noob
-Remove or make his normal cancels in to trait throw easier

*They should leave this alone, since it is a good but very important tool for Zod, that is only available when he has his trait out. Removing it will be a huge loss to Zod and making it easier to execute just makes this tool too available for my taste. I like that you have to set up this technique right to make it available and it adds to the depth of Zod's gameplay.
I disagree with this... the set up from normals into trait grab seems like a glitch and not even meant to be as is... leaving it as is just so its harder to perform seems stupid and unpolished... the characters should have all available tools at their disposition, this game has already a small window of normals to special moves... , ~leaving it as is just makes sure that for instance ppl online could never take advantage of what i think his ol game revolves...cause the window is so small in certain strings that you would never EVER be able to pull it off... ofc Online is full of casuals and casuals dont matter if thats what your thinking... but leaving this as is is a bad move and a stupid one, they need to fix it one of 2 ways either fix it and let it have a string into special like anyother move... or take it out complitly and let the character be a mid tier
 

SimSim

Norwegian Lab-work Champion
I disagree with this... the set up from normals into trait grab seems like a glitch and not even meant to be as is... leaving it as is just so its harder to perform seems stupid and unpolished... the characters should have all available tools at their disposition, this game has already a small window of normals to special moves... , ~leaving it as is just makes sure that for instance ppl online could never take advantage of what i think his ol game revolves...cause the window is so small in certain strings that you would never EVER be able to pull it off... ofc Online is full of casuals and casuals dont matter if thats what your thinking... but leaving this as is is a bad move and a stupid one, they need to fix it one of 2 ways either fix it and let it have a string into special like anyother move... or take it out complitly and let the character be a mid tier

And I disagree with this:p I think NRS stated at one point, that they left the ability to grab off of normals the way they did, because they thought it would be a neat thing to be able to do, but that would be hard to do consistent. At this point I can do the normal cancel in to trait grab with several strings and normals without a problem even online. It just comes down to practice. My bnb in to trait is d1 ender xx trait, cross up j2, slash, f2 xx trait grab. I can't remember the last time I missed this cancel.
 
Paulo also said in another stream chat that the normals cancelled into trait grab was in fact intentional. I was just speculating
 

Vagrant

Noob
He's a really glitchy character. Theres alot of shit to fix with him.

Stop overreacting to changes that haven't even happened yet and wait for the fucking patch.
 

SimSim

Norwegian Lab-work Champion
He's a really glitchy character. Theres alot of shit to fix with him.

Stop overreacting to changes that haven't even happened yet and wait for the fucking patch.
Yet the only real glitch stems from one single situation: Where you trait grab as you land after a jumping normal. (Edit: Also the glitch where the trait becomes useless as someone dashes/tp's etc. as the trait tries to grab - so 2 I guess)

So if NRS does not choose to let some of this glitch stay in the game for the same reasons I posted above (Which I doubt), then we are reacting to the sentence "lets play a game: guess the number of zod normalizations." which implies that he will have a lot of nerfs, while the glitch is just 1 single change.

I agree with you that we need to wait for the changes though, but my hopes are dim as my characters always seems to be patched out of the game.
 

SimSim

Norwegian Lab-work Champion
Normalization isn't synonymous with nerf
They might just normalize Zod's trait so that it works the same as the other monsters that the other characters can summon and therefor normal:p

I know it might mean "removing glitches" etc, but as I said, there really just is 2 glitches that they can remove: "The animation cancel" and the "trait grab loop" that makes the trait useless.
 

Marcus

Mortal Kombat Philippines / Injustice Philippines
If normals can't be canceled to trait grab anymore, I think that's it for me with Zod:/ Not to sound like a whiner, but that's one of the things I found really interesting about him, and without it he just doesn't have as much appeal to me.
Yea, and its not that OP. The mixups is easier to block compared to Doomsdays earth shaker and TRAIT GRAB IS PUNISHABLE.
The reward is high but the risk is of equally high too!

You guys are all getting trolled and Paulo is sitting in his office loving this thread
I would love to think that this is the case.