Ways I'd Nerf The Top Five

[Chernyy Volk]

Most of my complaints about MK11 are entirely systemic, but if we accept the game for what it is, I think the commonly agreed top 5 just need like 2 to 3 changes each to bring them in line, tone down some of the more random/scrambly elements of them etc. I'll just post my suggestions without explanations, if you want those, watch the video.

Joker:

1: F142 loses all it's pushback and leaves Joker point blank when blocked
2: F212 is -9 but has it's pushback halved
3: F212's second hit has a 20 frame startup up from 16

Liu:

1: 123 is now a triple high
2: Loses double throw KB, now has a forward throw KB only

Johnny:

1: D4 is 13 frame startup from 8
2: D4 has 30+ recovery on whiff up from 20

Cetrion:

1: 112 now has a flawless block gap
2: Natural Barrier cannot be amped on block

Jacqui:

1: Neutral leap in Upgraded also costs a defensive bar
2: Dash Punch is now -11 on block
3: B22 has 30+ recovery on whiff up from 21

 

[NaughtySenpai]

What about shrapnel blast and her stupid ass 9f mid being -2?

 

[Szkarad]

Not having two throw KB should be universal... The point of that KB is adding a layer of mindgame which is lost when both options are equally good (even tho in Liu's case backthrow is slightly better... not that important when 31% is at stake IMO)

 

[DarksydeDash]

-Make Joker's Jack N the Box require being held down to have the pushback thus making it interruptable, remove plus frames from cancelling fatal blow from blockstrings.

- Give Cetrion's teleport more recovery, backdash starts up slower, wall now costs one offensive and defensive bar.

- Make Jacqui's air shrapnel blast require 1 offensive and defensive bar, slightly increased damage scaling so she's not getting 40% unbreakable, F3 becomes 12 frames and is -4 instead of -2, F12 becomes -6 instead of -2.

- Make Liu's B1 11 frames and remove special cancel from B124, meterburn fire ball no longer has a hitbox above Liu's head, change bicycle kick Krushing Blow requirement to something like "triggers when 2nd amplification reaches the corner."

 

[deathstroke187]

imo , Jacqui: Neutral leap in Upgraded also costs a defensive bar. Is a bit much. but im cool with the rest.

this is also too much , Joker: F212 is -9 but has it's pushback halved

 

[YellowOrWhite]

99% of matches are played online so i don't understand why the game should be balanced based on offline strengths and weaknesses. And online the only two op chars from your list are Upgraded and maybe Liu but your suggestions would make them unviable.

 

[Wigy]

Man that would make johnny horrible to play, it cements so many of his tools together. Fear of d4 is how he operates without any good mids.

 

[Zer0_h0ur]

Liu should also have bicycle kick KB upped to 5 amp kicks, this would tone down his overpowered to hell zoning and also take away his round 3 trump card that he leans on 99% of the time in round 3. That KB is the most ignorant KB in the game in terms of requirements. Esp in light he can get 2/3 the way there on one touch.

 

[Mikemetroid]

Dartboard balancing just like NRS

 

[Rodney Quillz]

Dartboard balancing just like NRS

Lmao bruh MORE Johnny nerfs might as well delete him from the game.

 

[xKhaoTik]

99% of matches are played online so i don't understand why the game should be balanced based on offline strengths and weaknesses. And online the only two op chars from your list are Upgraded and maybe Liu but your suggestions would make them unviable.

Wtf is this lol

 

[Mikemetroid]

Lmao bruh MORE Johnny nerfs might as well delete him from the game.

I admit he needs changed but that nerf is totally off the market after last nerf.

 

[Wrenchfarm]

And online the only two op chars from your list are Upgraded and maybe Liu but your suggestions would make them unviable.

Yes, making 123 all highs and removing one of Liu's throw KBs would make him "unviable." I believe this because I have cement for brains.

My god, the lengths people will go to to downplay their favs.

 

[Rodney Quillz]

I admit he needs changed but that nerf is totally off the market after last nerf.

Lol what else could he possibly need in terms of nerfs though, is this character ever going to actually Get their issues fixed before the possibility of another round of nerfs? Lol

 

[deathstroke187]

most of those nerfs seems more like kill the character more than tune them down. just my opinion

 

[YellowOrWhite]

Yes, making 123 all highs and removing one of Liu's throw KBs would make him "unviable." I believe this because I have cement for brains.

My god, the lengths people will go to to downplay their favs.

You are right, he wouldn't be unviable, but why cripple his only advancing string. I prefer nerfing some of his KB's and/or wd speed. I don't play him btw.

 

[Mikemetroid]

Lol what else could he possibly need in terms of nerfs though, is this character ever going to actually Get their issues fixed before the possibility of another round of nerfs? Lol

I think he should lose Fatal Blow (for that round) if he lands the sunglasses KB. That's about it really. I would like it if his buttons/forceballs would hit normally as well but its been over a year now. They aren't going to fix it. It was a problem in MKX as well lol but they did fix it... only to have other hitbox problems arise.

 

[scrubjesus111]

Liu should also have bicycle kick KB upped to 5 amp kicks, this would tone down his overpowered to hell zoning and also take away his round 3 trump card that he leans on 99% of the time in round 3. That KB is the most ignorant KB in the game in terms of requirements. Esp in light he can get 2/3 the way there on one touch.

Close, but the most ignorant KB in the game is V2 Terminator’s nut stomp because he can combo into it off of his fastest string.

 

[Chernyy Volk]

Liu should also have bicycle kick KB upped to 5 amp kicks, this would tone down his overpowered to hell zoning and also take away his round 3 trump card that he leans on 99% of the time in round 3. That KB is the most ignorant KB in the game in terms of requirements. Esp in light he can get 2/3 the way there on one touch.

I think all you need to do is make it so that double amping it doesn't count towards it so he would have to combo into it 3 times separately. That's my take.

 

[Chernyy Volk]

most of those nerfs seems more like kill the character more than tune them down. just my opinion

This is a baseless statement with no explanation when I gave pretty thorough explanations in my video. Please respond with actual reasoning if you're going to comment.

 

[Chernyy Volk]

You are right, he wouldn't be unviable, but why cripple his only advancing string. I prefer nerfing some of his KB's and/or wd speed. I don't play him btw.

You are seriously a downplaying Liu Kang zealot.

Advancing Liu Kang strings.

F43
B142
343

Almost everything on this character advances. You haven't addressed my reasoning explanation in the video, which I said you had to watch to figure out why. It's because the string leads to lots of ugly kind of random scramble scenarios because it's super awkward to whiff punish and you can KNOW the Liu is gonna do it and still get hit. This adds consistency to the neutral game against Liu Kang, as well as takes away his absurd wakeup game on knockdown. A rushdown character should not have one of the best wakeup options in the entire game.

 

[Chernyy Volk]

I admit he needs changed but that nerf is totally off the market after last nerf.

124 and 34U3 shouldn't have gotten hit but that would require NRS to require Johnny Cage players to think. My suggestion was to make the last hits of 124 and 34U3 duckable so that he had to condition you with the other options, but NRS players don't want to have to actually take a risk and just want free plus frames LOL

 

[Chernyy Volk]

Dartboard balancing just like NRS

Mike, you gotta provide an actual argument with an explanation bro lol

 

[Rodney Quillz]

I think he should lose Fatal Blow (for that round) if he lands the sunglasses KB. That's about it really. I would like it if his buttons/forceballs would hit normally as well but its been over a year now. They aren't going to fix it. It was a problem in MKX as well lol but they did fix it... only to have other hitbox problems arise.

Man they need to put +6 back on forceballs it cost meter for Christ sakes

 

[deathstroke187]

This is a baseless statement with no explanation when I gave pretty thorough explanations in my video. Please respond with actual reasoning if you're going to comment.

i didnt mean to insult you or anything man. that was just my opinion.