General/Other - Tremor Tremor General Discussion Thread

[1man3letters]

Not the laughable one you have. Crystalline's strenght wasn't about EX Low shatter alone - it was addition to already powerful tool set he had including flash parry, crystallisation, crystall summon for resets and shit. No offense Dave but when I look at myself, or lets say Tournament level players like RZA, Leoholic, KillerXinok - the difference of character understanding and the way you could use his toolsets are NIGHT and DAY between them and you. From all the videos I saw you in, you were doing same shit all over and over again - F121, F121 EX Low Shatter, repeat. Can't remember you doing a single flash parry for armored/safe jailing, mixups, reversals etc, or crystall summon for combo resets and frame traps, OR using crystall armor for letting the block away and then punishing strings after that - nothing. The most basic Tremor to date.

So when you cry about universal changes that were also aplied to Crystalline, while it still has the best tool in his arsenal - flash parry, armor, boulder, safe low regular/ex shatter + NOW faster D1, F1, B1 + on block F4, F2 etc - it makes your point of view completely "Abysmal" as actual Tremor tournament players seem to have radically different opinion on the subject.

you lost me after crystal summon, that move is pretty booty and there are no "resets" with it, i know rza recently called a video that but there are in no way resets

 

[1man3letters]

Crystalline mainly. Aftershock against good zoning char like pyromancer, mileena ethereal or quan chi summoner. and metallic for Johnny Cage, lao & liu !

btw, dont miss Ketchup & Mustard stream tonight, I got an FT10 versus my bro St9rm at 8:30 CEST.
Let's bring some hype

ah good stuff, mustwatch that.
in your opinion was is the variation of choice for SR and ronnin?
i like crystal for sr and aftershock for ronnin

 

[ShArp]

you lost me after crystal summon, that move is pretty booty and there are no "resets" with it, i know rza recently called a video that but there are in no way resets

It's booty but that booty gives you booty combo possibilities on summon aswel as another hard knockdown. Im all for that booty.

 

[ShArp]

How you guys handle Jax/Kano MU? The low profiling is 2 damn stronk.

 

[1man3letters]

It's booty but that booty gives you booty combo possibilities on summon aswel as another hard knockdown. Im all for that booty.

unsafe combo possibilities and avoidable plus frames.i wouldnt even check on that, let alone all in (sorry playing alot of poker last while haha)
ye the hardknockdown is good when throwing a random one in zoning and is teamed well with ex dd4 after for some nice chunky damage but there is no comparison between flex and crystal summon.
crystal summon is a non-issue when talking about how good or bad crystalline is to any variation

 

[YUZU_RZA]

ah good stuff, mustwatch that.
in your opinion was is the variation of choice for SR and ronnin?
i like crystal for sr and aftershock for ronnin

lmao I think the same as u !!!

 

[ShArp]

unsafe combo possibilities

You won't use it on opponent who has atleast 1 bar anyway since it never was intended that way, but you will blow out anyone who will try to press a button that is slower than 6f. You can use it as additional pressure tool in the corner/mid once you out of stamina for shatter cancels or just making unsafe strings safe.
It has done wonders for me in the corner tho.

And nobody's talking about armor to have lower priority than that, lmao. But the fact that you can bait and punish with it on block-free expossure, which most Crystalline's dont even do. They just put it on because it's additional armor, but not with the mindset of baiting that armor to be broken to get that combo punish potential.

 

[YUZU_RZA]

Why would Metallic be good against Johnny Cage and Liu Kang.

or After Shock against a character like Pyromancer who spends much of their time in the air and over the range of Air Quake?

It's not a general opinion. against liu & JC, my problems was on the meaty cuz they can break every single armor of tremor ( B1 liu, 11 JC ). Then since the patch I tested the 3 variations & I'm still doing good with crystalline but better with lava against them. Cuz I can play my game as usual and wakeup If I want some space or get out of the corner. but like I said it's not a general opinion, it's just in my case ...

 

[1man3letters]

You won't use it on opponent who has atleast 1 bar anyway since it never was intended that way, but you will blow out anyone who will try to press a button that is slower than 6f. You can use it as additional pressure tool in the corner/mid once you out of stamina for shatter cancels or just making unsafe strings safe.
It has done wonders for me in the corner tho.

they dont need a bar (actually tremor needs the bar more in the siuation of wanting to use crystal throw) and that comment about blowing up all bur 6 frames button presses is false.
there is no pressure as your opponent shouldnt really have to block the move
the move is not a true mid and the downward throw downward direction doesnt kick in faster enough in corner to stop it being blown up,even with flex on crystal throw is a weak corner option

 

[angry bruiser]

Tremor's design has always revolved around abusing f+1,2,1 and punishing low pokes. The strategy was simple pre-patch. In Crystalline, you used to take advantage of the armor on EX low stone shatter in order to blow through low pokes. With the armor removed, you have to use a wide variety of strategies. I personally enjoy the design, which kind of reminds me of Steve's in Tekken. Both characters have phenomenal high attacks, yet they can easily be low-profiled so you have to find counter attacks.

If you still use Crystalline, which you should not because Aftershock and Metallic seem to be superior at the moment, f+1,2,1 xx delayed stone shatter trades with low pokes in your favor and leaves your opponent standing for a guaranteed f+1,2,1 follow-up. Your opponent will then resort to blocking, in which case you start doing f+1,2,1 xx stone shatter cancel into throw. Aftershock has the ability to jump back and punish low pokes with EX aerial quake for 30% of damage up close. Metallic has a more difficult time, but Lava stance rewards you with lots of damage and a reset if you make the appropriate read. Universally speaking, nothing is wrong with blocking low pokes as all of them are disadvantageous. You block them and start your own offense.

Again, I think the design is acceptable, but Crystalline was screwed in this version of the game because of the universal changes to armor attacks.

thanks for the detailed reply, dude. appreciate the effort, but i honestly don't think this game is for me the way it currently plays, so i uninstalled it. way too much poke wars for my taste and for half the cast seem like there's barely any reason to respect the opponent's pressure. for now i think i'm done until there's a patch that allows me to have fun again, so i'm going back to guilty gear until then.

again, thanks for the effort, guys.

 

[DanableLector]

While I understand your disagreement on Crystallines place in the over all Tremor variation hierarchy, I don't understand you discrediting @General M2Dave as a player.

You must be totally ignorant of the NRS scene if you are challenging his credibility as a competitive player/Tremor player.

He regularly plays, trains, and communicates with the best players in the world. While he hasn't been s big part of the MKX offline scene, in other NRS games he's been a regular threat for top 8 and regarded as the best Freddy (mk9) and one of the best Zods (injustice).

You should play Dave. See how "abysmal" his Tremor really is :-P. You might be surprised.

 

[ShArp]

but i honestly don't think this game is for me the way it currently plays

Actually its way less braindead than it was tbh.

 

[ShArp]

While I understand your disagreement on Crystallines place in the over all Tremor variation hierarchy, I don't understand you discrediting @General M2Dave as a player.

I don't think Dave's a bad player but rather one of the most basic Tremor's I have seen. And I have seen/played shitload of Tremors that are just above his level in every aspect. You or him shouldn't get mad because of it, if you do - I can't help you with that. Shoot me if you want.

You should play Dave. See how "abysmal" his Tremor really is :-P. You might be surprised.

I already said I want to play him. Oh and so far I already played RZA, inFlames, ReseT and others on Steam, KillerXinok on console - doubt I will get impressed by his gameplan or see something what I haven't from the guys mentioned above.

You must be totally ignorant of the NRS scene if you are challenging his credibility as a competitive player/Tremor player.

Yeah I must be incredibly ignorant of NRS scene because I named people who plays Crystalline better than Dave, has tournament experiences and don't seem to cry about EX Low shatter/call Crystalline "screwed in current meta" every time they get a chance. Poor me.

 

[ShArp]

that comment about blowing up all bur 6 frames button presses is false.
there is no pressure as your opponent shouldnt really have to block the move

Because that was exactly my point? You perform ex crystal summon after f3 while they are in the air and do the fallowing string while they are getting up/trying to press a button to hit you - anything above 6 frames will get blown out.

 

[1man3letters]

Because that was exactly my point? You perform ex crystal summon after f3 while they are in the air and do the fallowing string while they are getting up/trying to press a button to hit you - anything above 6 frames will get blown out.

i was talking about the ex crystal throw not the ex summon when i said tremor needs the bar more than his opponent when trying to use it in corner,
i really hope you didnt mean using a bar on ex summon to make his unsafe strings safe when you said that in previous message :/ assuming you meant the throw when said that, (which isnt safe anyways as i mentioned)

 

[Mr.EditUndo]

There can be more than ONE way to play Tremor

Dave plays a patient zoner heavy treamor unlike how DJT played...unike how Detroyer plays unlike /RZA/Sharp plays.

They both work!

I Freaking love how M2Dave plays the " You slipped up one time, enjoy your punish gameplay" and Sharps "got you in the corner time to give you so much pressure aftershock will turn to crystalline

 

[angry bruiser]

Actually its way less braindead than it was tbh.

i didn't say anything about braindead, but if we're going there, i strongly disagree. the game plays a lot more sterile and less intelligently than before (in general, not regarding tremor in particular,) along with so many chars having faster d1s the poke wars is a way more common factor than before.

if you enjoy it, that's fine. for me, i'd rather play guilty/KI, i think, so i'll just take my leave and not clutter up your discussions further.

 

[DanableLector]

@ShArp Im not trying to attack you or anything like that, I'm just trying to stand up for Dave because you came off really shitty. Dave is a tournament veteran, and a forerunner of the Tremor community.

He's a little nutty with the abysmal non sense, but he's otherwise a really nice, helpful guy. If red hot sundays is ever a thing again you guys should run a ft10 on it. It would be hype.

Lastly, no. I don't think I'll shoot you. I don't wish you, or anyone else any harm lol. We are on the same team after all.. and it ROCKS.

I'm so sorry..

 

[OmGxBdON]

why are people fighting about crystalline tremor and arguing over how well they play with the character. In general crystalline tremor is one of the most basic characters there is. No matter who plays him his game plan is the same. Its pretty simple f121 and scare your opponent with low shatter because its pretty neutral unlike aftershocks, so you can use it to scare your opponent to press buttons. it was obviously better before pre-patch but its still the same now just weakened. There really isn't much difference between crystalline players other then how they use his variety of his tools. Even then its just is he gonna let the shatter rock go or will he cancel it. Thats the basic gameplan. IMO watching general m2dave play, he played crystallines gameplan the best out of everyone. He understands the simplicity of the character. He didnt always use all of tremors tools to the max but it really doesnt change the fact he is one of the best crystalline tremors or were cuz he dropped him haha. I dont know why sharp is discrediting M2dave becasue he plays basic with the character even tho thats how your supposed to play crystalline. Of course you gotta use his other tools too, but still thats how u play him. Some of his variatant specific stuff is just for swag anyways.

As for which tremor variant is better it all depends on the MU. Still tho, no one can deny the fact that Crystalline tremors gameplan was significantly weakend from the patch. It is still good but definently not what is used to be. Both aftershock and metallic got better. There is definitely still a use for crystalline, and now more than ever metallic and aftershock. Metallic probably covers some of crystallines used to be good MUs pre ptach.

Thats my rant, oh and also flash parry isnt as godly as people are saying. Yes its good for alot of situations, but against chracters like lui, your getting blown the fuck up. And stop saying crystalline has mix ups. only mix up tremor has is standing 3 low shatter and his 21 string. the rest are reactable and or fuzzyable. I forgot aftershocks air quake and his set ups but thats it.

 

[1man3letters]

.

only mix up tremor has is standing 3 low shatter and his 21 string. the rest are reactable and or fuzzyable. I forgot aftershocks air quake and his set ups but thats it.

3~low shatter is less of a mixup in crystalline with the slower startup shatter compared to aftershock/metallic

 

[Sage Leviathan]

Can we go back to talking about Tremor instead of trash-talking other Tremor players please?

 

[OmGxBdON]

3~low shatter is less of a mixup in crystalline with the slower startup shatter compared to aftershock/metallic

It got slower too damn

 

[M2Dave]

Thats my rant, oh and also flash parry isnt as godly as people are saying. Yes its good for alot of situations, but against chracters like lui, your getting blown the fuck up. And stop saying crystalline has mix ups. only mix up tremor has is standing 3 low shatter and his 21 string. the rest are reactable and or fuzzyable. I forgot aftershocks air quake and his set ups but thats it.

Well-said. From my experience, though, high level players who fight Tremor regularly are able to block any mix ups involving standing 3. They are also able to fuzzy guard 2,1,2 and 2,1,d+4 fairly consistently. As you already know, you have to add throws to the equation if you intend to break down opponents with Tremor. The unblockable set ups are the most difficult to block, but they can only be used in the corner after certain knock downs.

@DanableLector , I sincerely appreciate your support, but I could not careless about being discredited. I will believe Crystalline is low mid tier until someone proves otherwise, which includes fighting competent opponents who do not get hit by "mix ups" such as f+1,2,1 xx down stone punch / EX low stone shatter.

 

[OmGxBdON]

Well-said. From my experience, though, high level players who fight Tremor regularly are able to block any mix ups involving standing 3. They are also able to fuzzy guard 2,1,2 and 2,1,d+4 fairly consistently. As you already know, you have to add throws to the equation if you intend to break down opponents with Tremor. The unblockable set ups are the most difficult to block, but they can only be used in the corner after certain knock downs.

@DanableLector , I sincerely appreciate your support, but I could not careless about being discredited. I will believe Crystalline is low mid tier until someone proves otherwise, which includes fighting competent opponents who do not get hit by "mix ups" such as f+1,2,1 xx down stone punch / EX low stone shatter.

True truw didnt know they were very fuzzyable. I only used the 212 mix up but if u can fuzzy it than whatever. I ussually just grab anyways.

On another note. I still get salty that the other two varistions have crap block stun with shatter, bit that would be pretty broke if they werent. They could knockdown a few frames tho. Seriously

 

[1man3letters]

It got slower too damn

been like that from day 1