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Match-Up Discussion - Tarkatan Tarkatan Alien MU Discussion

ATP2014

The best mediocre Batman
From the matches I've grinded, my personal thoughts on his hardest matchups:

Tarkatan vs Piercing 5-5
Tarkatan vs Full Auto 5-5
Tarkatan vs HQT 5-5
Tarkatan vs Brawler/Hollywood 5-5
Tarkatan vs Pretty Lady 5-5

Tarkatan vs Tempest 4-6
Tarkatan vs Heavy Weapons/Wrestler 4-6
Tarkatan vs Acidic 4-6
Tarkatan vs Boneshaper/Impostor 4-6
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
I think Tarkatan loses to Impostor but for the record anything you can't anti-air from Tricky Portal with 1 and D2 will get anti-aired by U3 I've found :)
 

ATP2014

The best mediocre Batman
Alien can out space Cassie with d4, b3 and low scoop. D1/u3 are great at anti-airing anything she tries to jump in with. Plus, Cassie's anti air options against j2 aren't the greatest. I feel like Alien definitely has the advantage in footsies.

Like was mentioned earlier, there are also certain ranges where Cassie can't punish OH flip or low scoop. And since she doesn't have launching armor, any armoring through the rekkas isn't life ending. Besides, the meta haw evolved to the point where Tarkatan should be abusing the rekkas only if your opponent does have meter.
 

ATP2014

The best mediocre Batman
For Shinnok, the biggest reason he loses is hellsparks. Alien's large hitbox makes it hard to get through, and Tarkatan has no projectiles to contest a zone heavy Shinnok. Shinnok's fast buttons and backdash are also great at contesting delayed rekkas without meter. Then you throw in the vortex ability of Impostor, or the extra spacing tools of Boneshaper and it has the makings of a bad MU of Tarkatan.
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
For Shinnok, the biggest reason he loses is hellsparks. Alien's large hitbox makes it hard to get through, and Tarkatan has no projectiles to contest a zone heavy Shinnok. Shinnok's fast buttons and backdash are also great at contesting delayed rekkas without meter. Then you throw in the vortex ability of Impostor, or the extra spacing tools of Boneshaper and it has the makings of a bad MU of Tarkatan.
You can B3 through hellsparks, and punish them on block with rekka every time. I think Impostor definitely wins since he can vortex Alien, Acidic is probably better for Bone Shaper but if it is losing for Tarkatan it's probably a soft 4-6.
 

Tweedy

Noob
I have Tarkatan vs Imposter as a 6-4 for Tarkatan, Boneshaper as a 5-5.

I'm gonna go the top player elitism route and say that Calf/Stabs agree with me so ha what's good.

Kidding.

Make sure you use U3 vs teleport and punish the stolen flip and B3. Use snag and B3 to contend with hellsparks, punish hellsparks with rekkas and snag. Remember that if you block hellsparks from far out, nothing can punish them. If you block the first one the rekkas will always punish i'm pretty sure. Don't let him fit D1s in on wake up, in the gap(it's not a real gap but there's a lot of frames there to fit in a poke) in between F13 and F134. Keep your oki clean, bait EX bf3s.

There's not too much to say about Boneshaper. Dark beam is more relevant than hellsparks since it gives Shinnok an advantage on the screen, being fullscreen. Hellsparks are good but Alien has stuff from that range to mess with. Also, EX scoop helps his wake up and anti rekka game.
 

Tweedy

Noob
Btw I agree with Piercing at 5-5. I'm not sure about Cassie yet. Alien gets beat up by Jax. Imo Tarkatan beats Lao badly in the neutral. He beats him on the ground, in the air. Just make sure you're making him block a 50/50 before you go into rekkas or flip. If you just go into F13 xx flip or F134 xx flip, you're probably going to lose. Not saying those aren't 50/50s, they're just easier to block than other things that Alien can do.

It's definitely even or in Lao's favor, though, since he punishes so hard. I have it as even, currently.

Acidic has to settle for EX snag or pounce to option select rekkas and can't punish flip. Sure he has neutral control with the spray, but idk, I think Tarkatan does fine. Sonic seems to blast Dragon in tournament, so maybe since this match up is so unexplored and weird, we should take that into account? I don't know, on paper I think Tarkatan does fine.

I think Flamefist beats Tarkatan now tbh. He can punish flip with F1, option select rekkas with EX windmill punches, his projectiles give him some good neutral control since Tarkatan has none, he can actually anti air and trip guard Alien, he breaks his armor(even EX db2), Alien has a weird hitbox that gets clipped more often than other characters, when trying to jump over windmill punch cancels.

A little quirk that Alien does have in the Flamefist match up, is that he can break EX windmill punches with D4 xx snag after pounce on hit.
 

Tweedy

Noob
Grandmaster is 6-4 or 7-3. He only stands a chance if he gets you in the corner.
Just to play Devil's Advocate, can't "if he gets you in the corner", just be replaced by, "if he lands one or two hits"?

Because that's all it takes to get the corner on this game. Sub also doesn't just "stand a chance" vs Alien once he gets the corner, he's sitting pretty. The problem is getting those hits. I'm sure we're on the same page as far as that goes. Lord Alien rules and Poverty Zero drools.
 

Dankster Morgan

she don’t call me daddy she call me Grandmaster
Just to play Devil's Advocate, can't "if he gets you in the corner", just be replaced by, "if he lands one or two hits"?

Because that's all it takes to get the corner on this game. Sub also doesn't just "stand a chance" vs Alien once he gets the corner, he's sitting pretty. The problem is getting those hits. I'm sure we're on the same page as far as that goes. Lord Alien rules and Poverty Zero drools.
Yeah. What I'll usually do as SZ midscreen is try to read a B3 or something and do a jump 1 because of the terrible whiff recovery. Also you have to be careful trying to hunt shatters because he punishes B2 very hard. So I'll do the close Klone and the mixup won't be between B2 and B33 it will be B33 and am untechable throw. Sure I'll lose the opportunity to shatter but it's better to keep him locked down if I can help it and not risk it.
 

Tweedy

Noob
Yeah. What I'll usually do as SZ midscreen is try to read a B3 or something and do a jump 1 because of the terrible whiff recovery. Also you have to be careful trying to hunt shatters because he punishes B2 very hard. So I'll do the close Klone and the mixup won't be between B2 and B33 it will be B33 and am untechable throw. Sure I'll lose the opportunity to shatter but it's better to keep him locked down if I can help it and not risk it.
Yeah, this was the strat that Brady used on me today.

I ducked like 8-10 throws. Every time I tried a new normal I got frozen.

It seems like Alien's only options, besides armor of course, are D3 and B4, after a ducked throw with a point blank klone.

The reason i'm posting this, is because i'm not sure if my lab session was legit, as i'm not a Sub Zero player(maybe I could have placed the klone closer). Would you mind testing and seeing if D3 works, Lord Dankster?

If Alien can't even D3, there's no way it's 7-3 lol. Just sayin.
 

Dankster Morgan

she don’t call me daddy she call me Grandmaster
Yeah, this was the strat that Brady used on me today.

I ducked like 8-10 throws. Every time I tried a new normal I got frozen.

It seems like Alien's only options, besides armor of course, are D3 and B4, after a ducked throw with a point blank klone.

The reason i'm posting this, is because i'm not sure if my lab session was legit, as i'm not a Sub Zero player(maybe I could have placed the klone closer). Would you mind testing and seeing if D3 works, Lord Dankster?

If Alien can't even D3, there's no way it's 7-3 lol. Just sayin.
Yeah man I'll test it when I have some free time. Would you like me to post my advice here or PM you my findings?
 

Bruno-NeoSpace

They see me zonin', they hatin'
What do you guys think about Flame Fist vs Tarkatan? 5-5? Flame Fist is the best variation of Liu Kang against Tarkatan because of the EX windmill punch.
 

Tweedy

Noob
What do you guys think about Flame Fist vs Tarkatan? 5-5? Flame Fist is the best variation of Liu Kang against Tarkatan because of the EX windmill punch.
I think Flamefist will probably end up being one of the few characters that wins vs both variations of Alien, along with Jax and maybe Cutthroat Kano.

He's really tough.
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
I think Flamefist will probably end up being one of the few characters that wins vs both variations of Alien, along with Jax and maybe Cutthroat Kano.

He's really tough.
Why is it tough? Never played that matchup before so I'm curious.
 

Tweedy

Noob
Why is it tough? Never played that matchup before so I'm curious.
This is what I posted earlier in the thread.

"I think Flamefist beats Tarkatan now tbh. He can punish flip with F1, option select rekkas with EX windmill punches, his projectiles give him some good neutral control since Tarkatan has none, he can actually anti air and trip guard Alien, he breaks his armor(even EX db2), Alien has a weird hitbox that gets clipped more often than other characters, when trying to jump over windmill punch cancels."
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
This is what I posted earlier in the thread.

"I think Flamefist beats Tarkatan now tbh. He can punish flip with F1, option select rekkas with EX windmill punches, his projectiles give him some good neutral control since Tarkatan has none, he can actually anti air and trip guard Alien, he breaks his armor(even EX db2), Alien has a weird hitbox that gets clipped more often than other characters, when trying to jump over windmill punch cancels."
When you say he can actually anti air Tarkatan which moves is he anti-airing that others can't and with what?