General/Other - Shinnok Shinnok General Discussion Thread

[usedcarsalesmang]

that's a lie.
Shinnok is one of the three characters I use the most and since day one boneshaper was good. You had to play smart but he pretty much had everything there. The other two variations sucked before the first patch, but boneshaper was viable.

While it wasn't top tier stuff, it was definately mid tier stuff. Now? It's a top 10 variation. The changes to f+22, 1+2 string and the fireball made it amazing. The fireball hitting high now is an extremely small trade for what it got.

I'm sorry you didn't play the variation and instead rode what these "pros" said about the character. Since day one this variation was the most ignored for some wierd reason. Even in this site. People mainly talk about how bad necromancer was and how it's specials whiffed and how impostor was the only viable one.

That's a lie based on what in your paragraph?
Nothing you said means what I said was a lie lol

FYI Fire ball doesn't just hit high now it also recovers super fast and is safe.

I always said Shinnok was bad and EVERYONE thought Imposter Shinnok was the best one
not because that's what the top players thought.

btw top players usually know whats good that's why they're top players.

Shinnok wasn't viable and now he is. That should be obvious to anyone.
He was being ignored cause he was bad, but thanks for holding the torch for Boneshaper.
I appreciate it.

 

[Juggs]

Um...yeah you lost me after you said "the other two variations" one of them being Impostor which WAS his best variation by far.

That's not true, Boneshaper and Imposter were really close in viability. None of that matters now though.

 

[Zephyrus]

Um...yeah you lost me after you said "the other two variations" one of them being Impostor which WAS his best variation by far.

you're honestly telling me that day 1 shinnok's best variation was impostor? You must've played this character for a total of 3 seconds to say something that stupid. Especially since boneshaper had a re-stand combo, better strings, better pressure and a true 50/50.

 

[Zephyrus]

That's a lie based on what in your paragraph?
Nothing you said means what I said was a lie lol

FYI Fire ball doesn't just hit high now it also recovers super fast and is safe.

I always said Shinnok was bad and EVERYONE thought Imposter Shinnok was the best one
not because that's what the top players thought.

btw top players usually know whats good that's why they're top players.

Shinnok wasn't viable and now he is. That should be obvious to anyone.
He was being ignored cause he was bad, but thanks for holding the torch for Boneshaper.
I appreciate it.

first things first: I don't give a rat's ass about the opinion of others especially hypocrite "pros". I can judge for myself if a character is good or not.

Dat 1 shinnok boneshaper was good for the reason I mentioned in my post above.

For my information? Excuse me? Unless you can't read, I said the trade was extremely small for the buffs it got. I was talking about the fucking fireball so anything I wrote after was for the fucking fireball.

But hey let me say why boneshaper was good: It had a re-stand combo. Sure it had a 0 frame advantage/disadvantage but it had it's uses. It had good keepaway. Not just serviceable. It had good. It had a true 50/50 combo.

What exactly made this variation bad? Sure, it wasn't as brain dead as TG Raiden and other ridiculous variations that the top tiers had. But that's why they were top tier and shinnok wasn't. But boneshaper was viable.

Just because it didn't have those day 1 40% combos, doesn't mean it's bad.

 

[xInfra Deadx]

you're honestly telling me that day 1 shinnok's best variation was impostor? You must've played this character for a total of 3 seconds to say something that stupid. Especially since boneshaper had a re-stand combo, better strings, better pressure and a true 50/50.

That's cute.

F2,2,1+3 before the patch was neutral on hit meaning NOTHING WAS GUARANTEED.

Better strings? Okay. That's one thing you got right.

But you completely blew it when you said better 50-50 which is absolute bullshit when Mimicry puts you in a state where a low, overhead or throw and you are forced to guess.

Keep trying to amuse me and saying that i'm stupid...when you're the misinformed one.

 

[usedcarsalesmang]

Unless you can't read, I said the trade was extremely small for the buffs it got.

Not just serviceable. It had good. It had a true 50/50 combo.

lol, god knows why I'd have problems reading what you're typing.
English isn't your first language.

If a re-stand combo that leaves you at zero
is the best you've got then I feel even more sorry for you.

 

[Juggs]

FTR, I believe Boneshaper has always been the best variation, but not by much. Vanilla MKX Boneshaper and Imposter were really close in viability, definitively saying one was better than the other is not easy and arguable. The biggest reason Boneshaper was better imo wasn't his incredibly unsafe 50/50, but his 6 frame low leading to a relatively safe string.

Like I said though, it doesn't matter now.

 

[Zephyrus]

That's cute.

F2,2,1+3 before the patch was neutral on hit meaning NOTHING WAS GUARANTEED.

Better strings? Okay. That's one thing you got right.

But you completely blew it when you said better 50-50 which is absolute bullshit when Mimicry puts you in a state where a low, overhead or throw and you are forced to guess.

Keep trying to amuse me and saying that i'm stupid...when you're the misinformed one.

you ARE stupid. Imposter at day 1 had no overheads outside of tp shanenigans which would get blown up with armor moves. B+3 was added in his first buffs.

Boneshaper had a true 50/50 in his b+3,1,d+2 combo. You could use the third move of the string or go for his low scoop. Unless I'm mistaken (which I'm not) that IS a 50/50.

Also fyi I wrote that you said something stupid. I didn't call you stupid. I do now though.

 

[Zephyrus]

lol, god knows why I'd have problems reading what you're typing.
English isn't your first language.

If a re-stand combo that leaves you at zero
is the best you've got then I feel even more sorry for you.

So... I mention atleast 4 things boneshaper had that were better than what he had on impostor... and you ignore them and focus on the only thing that was kinda iffy. Yeah I'm done with you. Another imbecile on this website going straight to my ignore list. And yes english isn't my first language

 

[usedcarsalesmang]

So... I mention atleast 4 things boneshaper had that were better than what he had on impostor... and you ignore them and focus on the only thing that was kinda iffy. Yeah I'm done with you. Another imbecile on this website going straight to my ignore list. And yes english isn't my first language

you are the worst peddler of bullshit on this site so im fine with that.

maybe use google translate next time so you dont confuse people so much

 

[digit el brujo]

i have a legit question....
how is shinnok worst than kung lao?

people say kung lao is beast only because of ex orbiting hat pressure, but shinnok has that as well with the low string and the ex orbs thing.
plus shinnok got a tele and on top of that has mix ups which is something kung lao doesnt have.

can someone point out something im missing that may be the reason kung lao is better?

 

[xInfra Deadx]

Not to mention...day 1 Shinnok was worse than death anyway for obvious reasons and I don't give a shit which variation you used. No one wants to remember those days anymore.

 

[SixPathsOfHate]

FTR, I believe Boneshaper has always been the best variation, but not by much. Vanilla MKX Boneshaper and Imposter were really close in viability, definitively saying one was better than the other is not easy and arguable. The biggest reason Boneshaper was better imo wasn't his incredibly unsafe 50/50, but his 6 frame low leading to a relatively safe string.

Like I said though, it doesn't matter now.

Like the man said IT DOESN'T MATTER NOW.

 

[Zephyrus]

i have a legit question....
how is shinnok worst than kung lao?

people say kung lao is beast only because of ex orbiting hat pressure, but shinnok has that as well with the low string and the ex orbs thing.
plus shinnok got a tele and on top of that has mix ups which is something kung lao doesnt have.

can someone point out something im missing that may be the reason kung lao is better?

Kung Lao builds more meter.

 

[xInfra Deadx]

i have a legit question....
how is shinnok worst than kung lao?

people say kung lao is beast only because of ex orbiting hat pressure, but shinnok has that as well with the low string and the ex orbs thing.
plus shinnok got a tele and on top of that has mix ups which is something kung lao doesnt have.

can someone point out something im missing that may be the reason kung lao is better?

No one knows for sure due to Shinnok (and others) being buffed in the last patch Tuesday...so nothing offical right now.

 

[digit el brujo]

Kung Lao builds more meter.

is that significant enough as to put kung lao as "top tier" and shinnok as "low or mid tier" tho?

 

[Zephyrus]

Not to mention...day 1 Shinnok was worse than death anyway for obvious reasons and I don't give a shit which variation you used. No one wants to remember those days anymore.

then please don't argue with me. I mained this character. I know his strenghts and weaknesses.
Judging by what you write about the character, I'm 100% sure you barely touched him back then. You and others. There's a reason why boneshaper wasn't touched before and even the b+3 OH that he would get in all variations barely helped it. B+3 helped impostor a lot more than it did boneshaper.

 

[usedcarsalesmang]

is that significant enough as to put kung lao as "top tier" and shinnok as "low or mid tier" tho?

"Builds more meter" isn't really much.

I'd say that Tempest Kung Lao is probably slightly better than Boneshaper Shinnok now

But Kung Lao is arguably top 5 so that's not a surprise.

Kung Lao has better meterless damage, better pressure and best AA special in the game,
and decent keep away with mid hat. All those things combined make him better.

That being said- Shinnok is still very good now and could get better with time.

 

[Juggs]

is that significant enough as to put kung lao as "top tier" and shinnok as "low or mid tier" tho?

Shinnok just got buffed, he's no longer "low tier". He's not top 5 material imo, but he's now super viable.

 

[Zephyrus]

is that significant enough as to put kung lao as "top tier" and shinnok as "low or mid tier" tho?

shinnok isn't low or mid tier now. He's top tier or at the very least he's upper mid. Boneshaper got uber buffed and I'm pretty sure it's going to get nerfed in the next patch. Expecting a nerf on the hit advantage that the fireball has.

 

[digit el brujo]

"Builds more meter" isn't really much.

I'd say that Tempest Kung Lao is probably slightly better than Boneshaper Shinnok now

But Kung Lao is arguably top 5 so that's not a surprise.

Kung Lao has better meterless damage, better pressure and best AA special in the game,
and decent keep away with mid hat. All those things combined make him better.

That being said- Shinnok is still very good now and could get better with time.

how exactly is the pressure different???
and trust me tha that only gets you in trouble
and about meterlees damage... he has no mixup so imagine no mix up and on top of that no damage... :/ not very good

 

[usedcarsalesmang]

dang, Boneshaper Shinnok in CEO Top 8 Winners right after he got buffed.

(pls NRS don't nerf him)

 

[Zephyrus]

how exactly is the pressure different???
and trust me tha that only gets you in trouble

His f+22, 1+2 string is now able to be 2in1. That means that after you pull them in with the last part of the string you can now throw a special attack. And you want to throw his fireball since it got buffed and leaves the opponent at a frame disadvantage, allowing you to drink a cup of tea and then decide if you want to go low with f+3 or throw an overhead with b+3 or grab them.

Nasty stuff.

 

[RM slacked]

dang, Boneshaper Shinnok in CEO Top 8 Winners right after he got buffed.

(pls NRS don't nerf him)

He won't get nerfed, just like kitana he needed those buffs to be a viable character. I'm still sticking with impostor though because he's my day 1.

 

[digit el brujo]

His f+22, 1+2 string is now able to be 2in1. That means that after you pull them in with the last part of the string you can now throw a special attack. And you want to throw his fireball since it got buffed and leaves the opponent at a frame disadvantage, allowing you to drink a cup of tea and then decide if you want to go low with f+3 or throw an overhead with b+3 or grab them.

Nasty stuff.

thats in shinnoks favor... i thought you were arguing kung laos pressure was better
oh sorry youre a diff person.
i just saw that on ceo lol