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Question - Ninjitsu Scorpion Corner Play

Scorpion Corner Play

  • he sucks in the corner

    Votes: 4 23.5%
  • He might have some good corner play

    Votes: 13 76.5%

  • Total voters
    17

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
Footsies aside, which the corner gives Ninjutsu a massive advantage to as Eddy Said, his Hellfire variation has great corner pressure but Ninjutsu gets shades of it, with the stagger. I think Eddy touched on this but didn't go into detail so I will, and while it's obviously not going to be as good as Hellfire's RC pressure, you can get good mileage off 21 alone staggered into another 21, or B12, or just finishing the string, it's not A-List pressure by any means but it IS a very serviceable pressure mix-up that most characters don't have access to. Midscreen connecting the last hit of 214 would end your pressure and oki if they tech roll, and a blocked 214 would have pushback out of follow up 21/B12 range but not to a far enough range for F2 or B2 (good range for B4 tho, but thats midscreen). Use this stagger to bait armour and get a full combo corner punish, or just disrespect them with 21 stagger conditioning to connect a B12 hitconfirmed into chain combo if they try poke out but havent got the timing precise (nobody has) or just hit em 214 which also leaves you plus if they block but doesn't push you back too far cause corner, and knocks em down on hit if they try to poke out (gap only gets beaten by armour) and doesn't let them tech roll out of oki, gives you time to space yourself and threaten an F2 against armour. Obviously this stagger is good midscreen too, it's just even better in the corner for the reasons that Eddy mentioned
 

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
You combo them they break TP you're in the corner & fucked lol. You know I'm right Eddy.
then they've spent 2 bars to break a meterless combo to get that advantage, you have to weigh it against the advantage that you forced against them for being in the corner to begin with - you would have had a much harder time and a smaller likelihood of even opening them up to begin with if you weren't putting them in the corner like that. And I mean, it's not like Ninjutsu is helpless while spaced at post-breaker range, its good spacing for him even if he can't move back, its not like anyone can just come straight in and force a 50/50 or pressure on Ninjutsu like they can on other characters. If taking the corner means I get to force my opponent to spend their two bars on this, then it's worth it everytime


EDIT: plus, I mean, you dont HAVE to tp to get some damage, can't you just throw B2's at em and end with an NjP into B121 or whatever, if you afraid of that breaker if they have 2 bars? sure its gonna be less damage but its damage that you can say "i might not have even got this if I didn't have the massive footsies advantage from the corner" and it leaves them knocked down into that same position
 
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Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
You combo them they break TP you're in the corner & fucked lol. You know I'm right Eddy.
I know, you're right on that one, but i'm not talking about doing tp combos on corner, i'm talking about locking someone in the corner, with staggers, poking, and out range them, since they don't have space to back up they will be way more fucked compared to midscreen.
 
then they've spent 2 bars to break a meterless combo to get that advantage, you have to weigh it against the advantage that you forced against them for being in the corner to begin with - you would have had a much harder time and a smaller likelihood of even opening them up to begin with if you weren't putting them in the corner like that. And I mean, it's not like Ninjutsu is helpless while spaced at post-breaker range, its good spacing for him even if he can't move back, its not like anyone can just come straight in and force a 50/50 or pressure on Ninjutsu like they can on other characters. If taking the corner means I get to force my opponent to spend their two bars on this, then it's worth it everytime


EDIT: plus, I mean, you dont HAVE to tp to get some damage, can't you just throw B2's at em and end with an NjP into B121 or whatever, if you afraid of that breaker if they have 2 bars? sure its gonna be less damage but its damage that you can say "i might not have even got this if I didn't have the massive footsies advantage from the corner" and it leaves them knocked down into that same position
They'll spend 2 bars & get positional advantage. More than enough characters in this game only need 1 or 2 mixups and your done. On top of that you'll still be cornered at the start of the next round. That's a hell of a reward bro.

You'll sacrifice plenty of damage taking TP out of his combos. The trade off just isn't worth it to me when his whiff punishing isn't lacking midscreen.
 
I know, you're right on that one, but i'm not talking about doing tp combos on corner, i'm talking about locking someone in the corner, with staggers, poking, and out range them, since they don't have space to back up they will be way more fucked compared to midscreen.
Well in that case of course you'd wanna keep them there.
 

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
They'll spend 2 bars & get positional advantage. More than enough characters in this game only need 1 or 2 mixups and your done. On top of that you'll still be cornered at the start of the next round. That's a hell of a reward bro.

You'll sacrifice plenty of damage taking TP out of his combos. The trade off just isn't worth it to me when his whiff punishing isn't lacking midscreen.
So you basically never go for the corner? I main Hellfire and meh I'll still take them breaks. Guess different strokes for different folks but I don't think this is clear cut

EDIT: what do you do against a Kano sitting the corner throwing knives? Just never combo?
 
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So you basically never go for the corner? I main Hellfire and meh I'll still take them breaks. Guess different strokes for different folks but I don't think this is clear cut

EDIT: what do you do against a Kano sitting the corner throwing knives? Just never combo?
No that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying I minimize my time in or around the corner by keeping the battle midscreen. 5-5 MUs like GM Subz can feel like 6-4 really easily in the corner.
 

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
No that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying I minimize my time in or around the corner by keeping the battle midscreen. 5-5 MUs like GM Subz can feel like 6-4 really easily in the corner.
Up to you brother, I can see the reasoning behind your decision. One thing I will say however is at the very least, don't be scared of abusing the hell out of the corner if you have 3 bars - if they breaker you, you can mash Xray, most people are going to try disrespect you after breaking you into the corner, and even if they block, well, you only spent 1 more bar than they did, they are back in the corner, and you are plus (not as plus as the frame data says tho), and they have no more breaker, no stamina, and likely no meter either. So, probably a big win :)
 

GAV

Resolution through knowledge and resolve.
Hi guys,

I wanted to know if any of you got good scorpion experience for corner play, right now the best I can get is B2,B2,B2 11, 11 then a grab dmg out put is between 27% and 31%

Johnny Cage and Jaxs corner play is really an example for what im going for.

Hope you guys can help out.

I main Scorpion Ninjutsu BTW
F2 (because its an overhead), B2, B2, jump in 3, teleport, 11Spear - then either continue the combo for a few more points or reset the vortex with a crossing up jump in 1 to go for the big damage.

Keeping them in the corner is nice, but Scorpion's damage potential is insane - so its better to just end the match in a combo - or maximize your damage to force your opponent to play catch-up.
 
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Rjsmal

Gamer
If been using all the tips from you guys its really going way better with the little bit of pressure keeping the game mid screen and poking more.
also I mix it up more now with the throw and just the BF4 Ex for coming out of pressure and it helps a lot people often don't know its coming.

Thanks a lot bredrens
 
Reactions: GAV

Rjsmal

Gamer
True, but I mean you set the minimal pressure you can and then be + so that you can block instant instead of a delay when they do a reversal so basically no recovery

For ninjutsu Affliction is -1 on block thats the least I could find is this correct?
 
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Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
True, but I mean you set the minimal pressure you can and then be + so that you can block instant instead of a delay when they do a reversal so basically no recovery

For ninjutsu Affliction is -1 on block thats the least I could find is this correct?
I dunno what you mean exactly but Scorpion has some frame traps either on hit or block, low profile included.

+2 on block moves are: s3, s1, s4, 21 string, 214 string, beware that the last hit has a gap.
+1 on block moves are: 1,1 string, not sure if there is more

- 4 moves: b12, b4 (ninjutsu), not sure about 212
-1 moves: b121
-5 moves: ex spear

if you're minus 5 to -1 you can still frametrap anyone in the game with d4, tp cancels and backdashes, those players that enjoy armor so much can be played out around those stuff, specially if you know when to pick your pace and when to press your buttons, you will see a lot of panic buttons pressed, either armor, jumps, uppercuts, d1s, d3s, and d4s a lot, some even do strings afterwards.
 

Rjsmal

Gamer
yes thats what I mean awesome Eddy thank you for the information this is helping me alot all the tips and explanations
 

Rjsmal

Gamer
21 xx Teleport or 4 xx Teleport Enders leave you at +18. From there you can build meter, pressure, bait, etc.

F42 leave you plus with a hard knockdown. Then you can use his oki setups.
ok so that's why when I do only a teleport there is some frame delay when I can do the next move, but if I do a 21 or 4 then teleport I'm on 18 frames plus so If you do a move with lets say a startup of 11 frames after the teleport it will be instant cause I was 18+?
 
ok so that's why when I do only a teleport there is some frame delay when I can do the next move, but if I do a 21 or 4 then teleport I'm on 18 frames plus so If you do a move with lets say a startup of 11 frames after the teleport it will be instant cause I was 18+?
It's the same no matter what move you do before it. Teleport is +18 after it hits the opponent. Meaning after it hits, you're free to do whatever while your opponent can't do anything for 18 frames.

B1 is an 11 frame starter. After teleport you can use that string to freely/safely build meter.
 

Rjsmal

Gamer
Shit I just got a deeper understand of it now brother no jokes I was also checking this movie after the reply of Eddy, with Eddy and your explanation its clear as fuck now :D

I can't say thank you enough brothers swear down no lies, gracias