Match-up Discussion Post-patch Match up List and Discussion

[rzn]

Thanks, gonna try that.

 

[usedcarsalesmang]

Lol no. That was just a ridiculous statement.

He definitely does beat GL though.

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I didn't say Superman was the Kabal of Injustice.
PL said that lol

 

[THTB]

You can d1 his breath loop. Supes zoning isn't as good as you think, either. The matchup is certainly even.

Cyborg is terrible as expected, from playing Alioune. This is where GL's mobility becomes a liability. He doesn't get in, unless Cyborg fucks up on a fireball. I'm surprised they left this character's projectile like this because it's hard even when the opponent DOESN'T do iaFB perfectly. And WHY DOES HIS ZIPLINE HAVE ARMOR? Once you get I'm, it's not to terrible, and you can MB rocket and it'll give you time in. The only way to deal with his zoning is hope he fucks up lol, and advance and hit him out of the air.

Batman isn't terrible, but it definitely is his favor. You can stop him from using bats to run you over by simply throwing a rocket when he dashes behind them. 223 and his 1 strings have openings where you can d1 lift him and such. And MB mustangs can be jumped over by doing j1 to slim your hitbox over it. Pushblocking him after using bats is a good tactic as well.

 

[Crimson Panther]

I am not a GL player, I actually play Bane but there is one rather weird thing i noticed about the match up that might help your chart.

Bane gets armor and projectile immunity on charge at 3 venom stacks. This basically shuts down most of your options to stop Bane from getting in, right?

All but one actually. The bullets from the Gatling gun DO NOT count as projectiles in this case even tho i thought they would. I will do more testing on this but that's my finding so far.

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does it cause a stagger or can he just walk through them?

 

[Crimson Panther]

supes has to resort to rushing down and traversing GL's death zone since his zoning is easily punished, and up close they can go toe-to-toe.

Gonna see a lot of f23 breath loops and that is honestly the hardest thing to deal with. backdashing is a bad idea so I would just armored launch. According to the raw data you can probably d1 but without testing I won't commit to saying you can.

Most characters have 50/50's built into their strings and his are really easy to block; just low block for the scoop and react to a string that ends in an overhead. I had much more trouble blocking aquaman's overhead/low game than supes.

air dash is a non issue since anything off the ground gets immediately lifted

true

 

[Crimson Panther]

This is why no numbers have been put in yet. There needs to be an accepted consensus at least from the majority before entering them. Or we'll have another MK MU chart and tier list war lol.

I need to play the Supes MU more myself.

And THTB I'd forgotten about Cyborg. I've only played ONE online and it was hella difficult to catch him.

 

[Crimson Panther]

Superman, deathstroke, raven are 6-4 against him
Most of the rest is 5-5

I also think nightwing is slightly advantaged over him

We'll see

 

[G4S KT]

And MB mustangs

LOL this must have been posted from mobile. I know you can push block to trash his bats but I hate to have to do that because I need my meter and he's going to have more bats in 2 seconds anyway.

And yo, Alioune playing cyborg? Prepare your bodies MK community

 

[Crimson Panther]

I ran a set with Viper and I'm pretty sure that GL beats Grundy at least 6-4. Maybe worse.

 

[Crimson Panther]

Ok. I applied what you said KT Smith in the Supes MU. This MU might very well be either 5-5 or 6-4 in GLs favor. Still need to play it more. But his zoning is very manageable.

 

[KowtowRobinson]

By all means keep arguing about this stuff. I had no idea you could jump over Supes air laser like that, was pissing me off. So it's been a productive thread already lol.

VS Deathstroke his zoning honestly hasn't been that bad. There's a sweet spot in his gun pressure where you can jump over anything and hit his feet with air rockets, but his upward machine gun won't catch you. Jump is high enough to get over a low to the ground instant air gun too. If he's jumping higher to do air guns at you, gives you more time to close the gap. Obviously if you do close the gap, do your thing. Maybe I'll run into a better Deathstroke at some point to make me think otherwise, but I'm not that scared of this character like some people are right now.

 

[THTB]

LOL this must have been posted from mobile. I know you can push block to trash his bats but I hate to have to do that because I need my meter and he's going to have more bats in 2 seconds anyway.

And yo, Alioune playing cyborg? Prepare your bodies MK community

Yeah, he was trying to play I2 Gaug3 and I was like "You better invite this dude!" He had no idea who he was and he's from Europe...I'm like shame shame.

 

[EarthRyno]

By all means keep arguing about this stuff. I had no idea you could jump over Supes air laser like that, was pissing me off. So it's been a productive thread already lol.

VS Deathstroke his zoning honestly hasn't been that bad. There's a sweet spot in his gun pressure where you can jump over anything and hit his feet with air rockets, but his upward machine gun won't catch you. Jump is high enough to get over a low to the ground instant air gun too. If he's jumping higher to do air guns at you, gives you more time to close the gap. Obviously if you do close the gap, do your thing. Maybe I'll run into a better Deathstroke at some point to make me think otherwise, but I'm not that scared of this character like some people are right now.

I've found that GL gets a free dash after any DS projectile after crouch blocking it/avoiding it. There's some frame trap he has, but I'm not sure what it is or if it even works on GL. The trap works on Lex, but I'm fairly certain GL has a faster forward dash than him. Either way, DS is not bad at all for GL. As long as you don't panic about chip damage, you'll get in easy and get to have your way with DS. I try to stay grounded as much as possible just because of his push back if you get hit in the air. A DS could read you on a jump, but there's no reading after dashing in after his own projectile.

 

[Crimson Panther]

I've added a couple MUs that I personally FEEL is correct. These will most likely change like I stated in the original post.

The ones with "?" on them obviously mean I either don't know or haven't played the MU enough to know.

So please keep discussing.

 

[sgZick]

Only MU I can comment on with sufficient experience is against Aquaman, since I main GL and my flatmate mains Aqua, so we had a lot of matches and trainings learing the characters. I think this one is definitely in GL's favour. You can out-footsie him, just play defensive, stay out of his range, in doubt block low and react to overheads, then whiff-punish him to death (appropriate counter move, depending on what he does). If he activates his shield just be extra defensive and not try to combo. I tried the same tactic against other chars, but it doen't work against rushers. Against AM it is a 6:4 or even 6.5:3.5 as far as I see it.

 

[Tortonon]

Well, I'm playing a lot of matches everyday against Killer Frost and I also play Batman, two matchups that I think might be a 4-6 for Lantern. They both have some ridiculous wake-up capabilities - Killer Frost specifically if the other guy has great timing, with the command grab (since the character will have standed up frames even if you are holding down), not to say about her strings and a really quick overhead in F+3. Batman's got kind of the same problem, specially with some of his 1 strings like it was mentioned before, but I'd say he can be dealt with if Hal manages to get his space. But if you either get cornered, or even just close to him or to Frost, things can go bad pretty fast.

Thing is, they're both great in the ground, and if the other player doesn't take too many risks, they can be hard to either open up or defend against. Like, Hawkgirl has a hard time against Lantern due to her main options being in the air, where she is constantly opened to lifts. Batman can approach from the ground, with the bats and the b23 chain to keep Hal in check, not really close to get cr.1 into lift, bot not far enough for Hal's zoning to keep him at bay. I'd say they are 4-6s, but only time will tell.

 

[G4S KT]

I can see killer frost being very bad.

takes away b1 strings so you're reduced to b1 chaingun or b1 missile.

He has no real answer for slide, but then again no one does.

yo, real rap KF slide is broken. and I've NEVER said that about any single tool before.

 

[Tortonon]

Indeed. But I'm more worried about a technology that Art showed on his stream, iirc on the first day after the game was released. Basically her command grab can be done in a way that it becomes unescapable, specially near the corner. That happens because during the mixup opportunities after knockdowns, even if you hold lets say down-back, your character will have standing up frames before it, and she can loop command grabs in there. Hal's main weakness is his wakeup options when cornered, so if a character can loop command throws in that situation, we're basically done. That also benefits Cyborg's already great matchup against GL, since he's got setups for days. :'(

 

[G4S KT]

that's true those loops are pretty dirty, but they'll lose to wake ups even in the corner.

In this game I try and do wake ups on reaction. The speed of moves in NRS games is so much slower than in capcom ones, so I find it a bit of a luxury to be able to buffer the move and let it fly only if I see them flinch. AND, since the input is down/downback/back instead of a traditional DP you're also option selecting block, in a sense, along with the buffer.

 

[OutlawNightmare]

does it cause a stagger or can he just walk through them?

The first couple shots will be absorbed by armor but it will stagger after that. It basically comes down to timing. If you judge it right as the GL player, Bane should get staggered backward right about max range for your lift.

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[Crimson Panther]

The first couple shots will be absorbed by armor but it will stagger after that. It basically comes down to timing. If you judge it right as the GL player, Bane should get staggered backward right about max range for your lift.

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Ok then just like a GL player dealing with Doomsday's trait best thing to do is MG MB.

For Doomsday it staggers him long enough for his trait to end. I'll have to see about Bane, but any good GL player just deals with armor with MG. Whether it's meter burned or not.

 

[Crimson Panther]

I was just reading that other GL MU list. I just want to make one thing clear; it is too early for a full MU chart. Nobody has ALL the MUs figured out yet and I know this. That is why mine is not completed and the ones I listed with a "?" I tagged the players I know are maining them for their input. So please do not blow me up or this thread about "it's too early" or anything negative. That's not why I made this thread. It's a MU DISCUSSION so we can eventually compile a solid MU chart for GL. So please, continue discussing your opinions. If anyone would like to run MUs with me to figure some of them out, add me on PSN; GnG_Crimson.

 

[THTB]

I can see killer frost being very bad.

takes away b1 strings so you're reduced to b1 chaingun or b1 missile.

He has no real answer for slide, but then again no one does.

yo, real rap KF slide is broken. and I've NEVER said that about any single tool before.

Man, have you seen everything else in this game??? Lmao.

But yeah, I didn't think about b1's options getting parried. Fortunately she's not really plus and there's pushback. I don't think it'll be as bad as you guys think atm. Parry will be a deterrent, but only if she's willing to spend the bar (likely will). Plus, it leaves her open to other stuff because you can't just fish for b1 by reacting, you have to already be blocking or jumping. Because he already outranges her other normals, and I'm pretty sure beats her in the air, it's not going to be a cakewalk. Plus, when GL gets the lead, she's going to have to march through his projectiles, and he can very easily bait her slide using air rockets. I need to fight a KF that abuses the b1 issue, though.

I will back the GL-Aquaman argument in our favor. GL has the unique aspect in that he can punish Aquaman's punishable things, and trait WON'T save him. Not to mention, Aquaman has to come to him, in which he has to play in GL's best zone hoping GL doesn't make stuff whiff or block his risky options he'll have to take. GL can fuck you up at that particular range where dashing in will put you close with b1, and because it's safe and can be cancelled to minigun to be around -7 or so (Lex doesn't punish this point blank, as his charge will have extra frames before it hits). At least Aquaman doesn't have to eat air rockets all day due to water shield.

Ares is getting a little better for me outside the damn reset. I haven't found a way to stop it...and even though I haven't gotten it yet, I don't think any of his wakeups can beat the godsmack reset. If that's the case, this matchup is very well a 2-8. It's not easy getting in on Ares with GL in the first place, he counters some of your counterzoning attempts to damage him, and by the time you do get in, you may have lost a ton of life in the process and you can't fuck up, or else RESETTTTT because he built all that meter from your damn body vs his projectile conflict.

 

[WayoftheFist]

The last time we played it the KF matchup felt 5-5 but you need to play a better KF to experience her full potential. I'm not there yet. In my head I feel like she should be beating him.

 

[xWildx]

I'm inclined to believe that Catwoman vs Green Lantern is in GL's favor. She has no projectile, and all her best tools fall right inside the range of his lift. She has to play this matchup entirely based on reads, and he even outpokes her with his godly b1. His lift also beats her ji2, and she can't keep pressure on wakeup because of, again... his lift. Unless the Catwoman player can successfully bait out his punishable attacks, she's not getting close to him.