Player 1 has host advantage

[Reneketon]

So isnt this limited to if they press a button at the exact same time, player one wins it? Also, the move hase to be the exact same number of frames correct? What are the odds of 2 people pressing a button with the exact same frames at the exact same frame. So what if player one wins it, the odds of this happening seem very, very low and honestly I dont think it should be a huge deal, if this is in fact what your talking about.

They don't have to be the same number of frames, they just have to connect at the same frame. Trades happens more than you think. If you ever watch SF, when two moves connect at the same time, both players are hit by the move and enter the appropriate hitstun. In MK the trade goes to one player totally depending if he's player 1...or it switches randomly...whatever is found out at the end of this thread.(Either way, it's pretty annoying and should not be present)

 

[Shaolin Shokan]

Here is the main reason that I see this as a big deal.. characters like Kitana, Cage, etc. Think about Cage on side 1, f3 recovers at 0 which means that he will always d1 your d1 or d3 your d3.

Kitana strings like 21, b21, cutter, etc.. they recover at 0, if the Kitana player is on side 1 then they can d1 you for free every time. Even worse, if you both try to jump over punch at 0 after these strings are blocked, Kitana wins the trade and goes into a juggle.

LOL take Smoke's 3d12 string. VS a character that has a 6 frame d1, Smoke can always d1 after the string is blocked on side 1 and win but will get interrupted if the player is on side 2. Side specific frame traps? Come on now, this is kind of ridiculous.

 

[3PiecesOfBread]

Unless I'm misunderstanding something, 3:49 of this fight from FR seems to be a prime example...

 

[deathgun]

Yes.

Yes.

Thanks for the support, those who believe me. It's hard to have evidence for this as a video would be too fast and I would have to make a ton of screenshots.

cant you run the recorded footage at 10 fps and then record this new video at normal speed and post it on youtube?

 

[deathgun]

Unless I'm misunderstanding something, 3:49 of this fight from FR seems to be a prime example...

diferents heights, different timmings and different moves, definitively not a good example.

 

[3PiecesOfBread]

diferents heights, different timmings and different moves, definitively not a good example.

I figured if nothing else an EX would beat out a regular.

I AM SCUM!

 

[Bildslash]

I figured if nothing else an EX would beat out a regular.

I AM SCUM!

In Sektor's case the version of iAT is 1 frame slower than the regular one.

 

[CheapEddie]

Player 1 wins all encounters when 2 moves become active at the same time.

Whut?

Ok, then. Gonna pick KL and win games.

 

[Altaire]

I suggest you to google "high crash" term and watch "MK hit levels 101": I'm to lazy to explain really.

Edit: grammar.

I suggest you learn how to spell/pronounce "high crush" before you start talking smack with fighting game terminology. The term is older than time.

 

[Somberness]

Just a small example. I edited out the parts where I missed hitting on the same frame and the time in between so the video wasn't over 10min. The characters switch positions half way. Both are using 14 frame attacks, but it can be any combination, it's just easier this way.

 

[Iustinus]

The music really establishes how tragic this is.

 

[Playpal]

The fact that you included music made me lol.

 

[Scoot Magee]

Is it confirmed to be like this on both consoles?

 

[1man3letters]

i dunno really want to say about the video, wasnt doubting somberness but seeing it right in front my eyes,damn.

just like the input bug/meter dain etc etc it isnt gamebreaking or a reason to drop the game but holy shit how many skeletons are left in the closet to be found

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Just a small example. I edited out the parts where I missed hitting on the same frame and the time in between so the video wasn't over 10min. The characters switch positions half way. Both are using 14 frame attacks, but it can be any combination, it's just easier this way.

How does this effect counter poking?

this is weird

can you do a video of 2 mileenas doing standing 4

Use same characters, same costume, same controller, same everything

 

[aj1701]

Just a small example. I edited out the parts where I missed hitting on the same frame and the time in between so the video wasn't over 10min. The characters switch positions half way. Both are using 14 frame attacks, but it can be any combination, it's just easier this way.

There's something else different too; Mil's right leg is the one doing the kick as P1, but as P2 its her left leg. What happens if you change stance for one for both characters?

 

[Matix218]

That video is pretty much as clear as can be. I guess it is just 1 more stupid thing we have to deal with... I am not droping the game no matter what but I sure do hope they fix this and all of the other issues for the next mk game.

 

[SunnyD]

There's something else different too; Mil's right leg is the one doing the kick as P1, but as P2 its her left leg. What happens if you change stance for one for both characters?

Ohhh. Crap. Stuff changes with stance. Kung Lao's 24 string has different animations for different stances...it could be the case here.

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Lol what if there's different frame data per stance

That'd be crazy

 

[SunnyD]

Lol what if there's different frame data per stance

That'd be crazy

There is. Sub's 214 string in a closed stance is slower. To quote Somberness:

Chest facing you - 2 hits on frame 9, 1 hits on frame 34, 4 hits on frame 62, ice beam starts on frame 69 and hits on 98, you recover on frame 155
Back facing you - 2 hits on frame 9, 1 hits on frame 35, 4 hits on frame 62, ice beam starts on frame 69 and hits on 100, you recover on frame 157

 

[Somberness]

Nothing like that affects this, just did a Sub mirror with standing 2 and player 1 beat down player 2 winning every trade situation. Switched stances too.

 

[Derptile]

Man, this game.....

 

[Full Boat]

I did my own unscientific quick tests (PS3) in vs. mode with mirror matches on different stages. I tried about 20 different mirror matches, hitting the same button or move on both controllers. I tried switching the controller numbers during a round, and also changing P1 to controller 4, and P2 to controller 3.
I will say that 95% of the matches I tried, P1 had the advantage. But what's interesting is the 5% - P2 had the clear advantage for one full match, and it was just as obvious as when P1 had it. Which means flawless victory or near flawless (either due to my human error or this unexplained extra factor). I don't know what I did to change it, but when I tried that combination of characters, move and background again, P1 had it back.

So I think P1 has default advantage, but there's something else that also factors in and can change it. It could be stance changes (which I didn't really test) or something else, but there is something else to it.

 

[NogunYesknife]

Wait... are we really JUST finding this out? Is somberness our only guy who tests stuff?

 

[Mr. Mileena]

lol what? 1P side isn't dominating and winning majors either. The point of my post was this isn't that big of a deal compared to the other things found, not that there isn't anything wrong with it.

Yea its stupid, but there are far worse things in this game than 1P always winning all trades. Far worse things character specific-wise, and far worse things game engine specific-wise.

The chess analogy was just saying even one of the best game ever invented unintentionally has 1 player trying to overcome odds against the other. Your taking it way too literally dude.

Props to Somberness for doing the research. We'd be so lost without him.

what a shame for this game.