Pig vs Gross 5am MLG Dallas Casuals - A look at Kenshi vs Smoke

[l3rainst0rm]

Apparently I don't use Ex Smoke In enough. Another thing he is doing is the b2 after an air to air punch into a down 1 which is hard to do honestly.
My new life goal is to get toasty boost in the corner with the uppercut combo and kill my opponent with two resets with the meter I got.He rarely uses d4 except in combo. Overall he is just his own Smoke he does his own thing and it works.
He is the opposite of me he jumps a lot and I never jump lol. This is already been said however.
16:55 uppercut frame trap hold that. Also that online neutral jump punch tech.
After watching this I really want to play you in some casuals Pig Of The Hut
FrothyOmen tag me from now on as a Smoke player. I may not be the best, but I try my best to show up.

which uppercut combo are u speaking of...

 

[smokey]

Didnt look like you knew where to be in this matchup Pig, for the most part you were playing from full screen trying to get lucky with your specials. Smoke bombs can trade with anything you like, which you found out soon enough, so dont even bother, you want to be getting in on smoke asap.

Wasting meter on armoured specials to blow up....nothing. Smokes pressure is always neutral, and his normals are sluggish and gain him no advantage or access to safe threatening specials. Get in, stay in, keep your meter for breakers. Theres not alot to be gained from armouring smoke back to full screen (minus about 30% health of course) where you get smoke bombed and killed because you shot your breaker away.

Stop jumping in to standing 2, its a great anti air and leads to big damage. Stop jumping smoke bombs, just dash block in to b2/d4 range, take a quick breath so you dont get tagged, then get in. Also, for kenshis anti air im sure you can get more than just a spirit charge (i saw like 3/4 jump ins consecutively just spirit charged)

When smoke drifts away, dont try to jump in after him, you got caught by that!

Overall i would say 5-5 easily, kenshi is a great character, you just cant play him from full screen when the projectile trade is so horribly skewed.

Use your normals, get into the range where smoke bombs are risky to throw and fight from there, and stop jumping!

 

[Qwark28]

I don't even know. Thanks @CrimsonPanther.

this is weird subzerosmokerai.

^ FUUUUUUUUUUU

 

[Glass Sword]

which uppercut combo are u speaking of...

3d12, njp, 32, 32, dash uppercut, d1-smokeball, TOASTY, f4-exsmokeball, reset 32, f4-ex smokeball, reset 32,32,32, 214

 

[RiBBz22]

Pig Of The Hut, we have got to play again. I was able to get through like 3/4 of the video and should be able to watch the rest later. Maybe we can Skype and talk about the MU next time we play a set. From what I saw gross doesn't seem to use the D4 all that much and instead just mostly uses the D3 to footsie his way in and get advantage.

Also, I noticed he goes for a lot of B2 > D1~bombs off air-air wins and was dropping some of them. I just prefer throwing a smoke bomb off those situations because 1) it is really consistent at picking the opponent up [I mean you still get a good chance at a reset situation], and 2) if you miss you are still right on the edge of footsie distance and you don't really have to worry about potentially dropping it and being close to Kenshi. Then you can kind of try to play the spacing game where the threat of a naked Smoke bomb will force some jump-in reads that you can either try to anti-air or dash away from and go into block-string pressure.

 

[ForeverKing]

Man you are embarrassing me. I have realized you have to be a bit of a bully when it comes to playing casuals. You got to be like "Yo! i got next!" And they will be like "OK just one more." Then they play two more, so you got to be like "You said one more you have been playing for the past 30 minutes let me play." Then when you sit down you don't need to relinquish it easily after you just sit down unless you are playing lose and you get up. I can't remember the exact moment you are speaking of, but I'm sorry if I was rude. If it was my set up I might have pulled that clause on you guys sorry.

I was joking lol

 

[Showtime]

Good matches, I remember watching them live, 5 am we still going at it. I think the weekend of mlg Dallas was the most mk played in one weekend

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Blackula]

Still think the matchup is 5-5. Annoying, yes. In Smoke's favor, no. I'll watch all of the video when I have more time as I'm still currently traveling to Louisiana.

Also, for kenshis anti air im sure you can get more than just a spirit charge (i saw like 3/4 jump ins consecutively just spirit charged)

Pig Of The Hut read Smokey's quote.

 

[CD jr]

This match up is very 5-5

 

[REO]

Why is REO now the police of Smoke and Kenshi matchups?

Maybe because I played over an hour of the match-up with Gross' Smoke? God, I know you think I have the worst Kenshi on the face of this Earth, but I understand Kenshi better than a lot of players in this community.

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Still think the matchup is 5-5. Annoying, yes. In Smoke's favor, no. I'll watch all of the video when I have more time as I'm still currently traveling to Louisiana.

record yourself playing gross ft 10 set at nec and post

Didnt look like you knew where to be in this matchup Pig, for the most part you were playing from full screen trying to get lucky with your specials. Smoke bombs can trade with anything you like, which you found out soon enough, so dont even bother, you want to be getting in on smoke asap.

Wasting meter on armoured specials to blow up....nothing. Smokes pressure is always neutral, and his normals are sluggish and gain him no advantage or access to safe threatening specials. Get in, stay in, keep your meter for breakers. Theres not alot to be gained from armouring smoke back to full screen (minus about 30% health of course) where you get smoke bombed and killed because you shot your breaker away.

Stop jumping in to standing 2, its a great anti air and leads to big damage. Stop jumping smoke bombs, just dash block in to b2/d4 range, take a quick breath so you dont get tagged, then get in. Also, for kenshis anti air im sure you can get more than just a spirit charge (i saw like 3/4 jump ins consecutively just spirit charged)

When smoke drifts away, dont try to jump in after him, you got caught by that!

Overall i would say 5-5 easily, kenshi is a great character, you just cant play him from full screen when the projectile trade is so horribly skewed.

Use your normals, get into the range where smoke bombs are risky to throw and fight from there, and stop jumping!

^^see above
Im going to show you what happens half the time you go for standing 2 or rk on a character that gets 80% when you miss it

I see your advice but i know what i did wrong, as for playing far away its the safer approach and i blow all other smokes up. Gross is just better and forces you into situations

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Still think the matchup is 5-5. Annoying, yes. In Smoke's favor, no. I'll watch all of the video when I have more time as I'm still currently traveling to Louisiana.



Pig Of The Hut read Smokey's quote.

Yea i did and which is why i want you to play gross because when you mistime one standing 2 or rk i want you to think of this reply

"GGs" <---my reply
lol

This is how you lost to khaotik twice trying rk and standing 2 for AA - You miss one eat 52%

Its not automatic and concrete so in a mu where one mistake = 80% id rather take a safer approach

 

[l3rainst0rm]

3d12, njp, 32, 32, dash uppercut, d1-smokeball, TOASTY, f4-exsmokeball, reset 32, f4-ex smokeball, reset 32,32,32, 214

thats my combo... i made that up.....

 

[l3rainst0rm]

3d12, njp, 32, 32, dash uppercut, d1-smokeball, TOASTY, f4-exsmokeball, reset 32, f4-ex smokeball, reset 32,32,32, 214

i taught that to wafflez like aweek ago.

 

[Blackula]

Yea i did and which is why i want you to play gross because when you mistime one standing 2 or rk i want you to think of this reply

"GGs" <---my reply
lol

This is how you lost to khaotik twice trying rk and standing 2 for AA - You miss one eat 52%

Its not automatic and concrete so in a mu where one mistake = 80% id rather take a safer approach

Yes, I re-watched my match against Khaotik and learned from it. When I played 16 Bit at MLG Raleigh in your room, I did not fall for that at all. Used standing 2 to anti-air just perfectly against Kitana. Not gonna take a vital part of my game completely out just because it didn't work one time. Just gonna adjust how and when to use it.

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Yes, I re-watched my match against Khaotik and learned from it. When I played 16 Bit at MLG Raleigh in your room, I did not fall for that at all. Used standing 2 to anti-air just perfectly against Kitana. Not gonna take a vital part of my game completely out just because it didn't work one time. Just gonna adjust how and when to use it.

PLay gross and record at nec

 

[Big Pampering]

Yes, I re-watched my match against Khaotik and learned from it. When I played 16 Bit at MLG Raleigh in your room, I did not fall for that at all. Used standing 2 to anti-air just perfectly against Kitana. Not gonna take a vital part of my game completely out just because it didn't work one time. Just gonna adjust how and when to use it.

messing up anti air is hardly an excuse to not punish properly.

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

messing up anti air is hardly an excuse to not punish properly.

just because something is optimal doesnt mean its always going to work despite your execution

When you go for the sexy optimal punish you can get blown the fuck up and sent to losers or home

My way has proven very strong over the course of time, If i had been losing to some MUs id be asking "that guy" how does he do it and what am i doing wrong

Only thing I did wrong in this mu is not punish smoke towards correctly, 3d12 he at a space disadvantage and negative to kenshis options, I dont mind the ex trades but use them better, dropped a combo here and there and stop jumping at him.

Theres a couple of other things as well but this was more of a learning experience than anything, first smoke ive lost to and first real smoke ive played since JuNE 6TH (havent play xsmokex or waffelz since then)

 

[Blackula]

PLay gross and record at nec

Will do.

 

[Big Pampering]

just because something is optimal doesnt mean its always going to work despite your execution

When you go for the sexy optimal punish you can get blown the fuck up and sent to losers or home

My way has proven very strong over the course of time, If i had been losing to some MUs id be asking "that guy" how does he do it and what am i doing wrong

Only thing I did wrong in this mu is not punish smoke towards correctly, 3d12 he at a space disadvantage and negative to kenshis options, I dont mind the ex trades but use them better, dropped a combo here and there and stop jumping at him.

I understand that, but if the punish isnt anything significant, what prevents the other player to jump on you all day, and if that is the case the opponent will get in a jumpin punch.

its the same as sonya uppercutting lao's crossovers, if lao does one crossover teleport sonya will eat 43% no meter. it doesnt prevents the lao player at all, because you need 4 uppercuts to do the same damage as lao for one succesful teleport and even then sonya might mess up the uppercut timing and eat a crossover.

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

I understand that, but if the punish isnt anything significant, what prevents the other player to jump on you all day, and if that is the case the opponent will get in a jumpin punch.

its the same as sonya uppercutting lao's crossovers, if lao does one crossover teleport sonya will eat 43% no meter. it doesnt prevents the lao player at all, because you need 4 uppercuts to do the same damage as lao for one succesful teleport and even then sonya might mess up the uppercut timing and eat a crossover.

Please dont compare sonya uppercut to any of kenshis normals especially when talking about AA and Definitely cross up aa

A better comparison would be Mileena standing normals or kitana crossup normals

 

[Breaker]

Wow, I haven't posted in a long time. You don't have to play a god-like kenshi or any character in order to comprehend a character or match-ups. I noticed a good smoke has an advantage over a good kenshi. The teleport can be good tool to use once you bait the TK moves, the Smoke dash is very fuckin helpful in that MU and once smoke gets in he can be a nuisance. I strongly believe smoke has a maneuverability advantage in that MU.

 

[16 Bit]

Maybe because I played over an hour of the match-up with Gross' Smoke? God, I know you think I have the worst Kenshi on the face of this Earth, but I understand Kenshi better than a lot of players in this community.

If one set of casuals was enough to change the MU numbers I demand Noob vs. Kitana be changed to 1-9.

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

If one set of casuals was enough to change the MU numbers I demand Noob vs. Kitana be changed to 1-9.

lol

This is based on me vs xsmokex, waffelz and gross as well as other smokes

Just looking at all the tools in their entirety

 

[smokey]

I see your advice but i know what i did wrong, as for playing far away its the safer approach and i blow all other smokes up. Gross is just better and forces you into situations

Gross or not, you cant trade with Smoke, you cant whiff, you cant throw projectiles and you cant jump in.

I dont know how Kenshi's dash fares off against the rest of the cast (like Cage) but i have the most problems when people disregard my smoke bombs completely, and just run at me dash blocking into the range where another smoke bomb would be punished, but b2/d4 might whiff. If you can play him in that range, which i know RK and SC both will hit, and d4~close sword is a threat, you are laughing.

You dont have to worry about smokes pressure, outside of a sneaky d1/d3/d4~smokebomb that might get you sweating, keep on him, keep your meter, and just think every time you are outside of normal range trying to chuck stuff at smoke, you are a few frames off losing all your health. Disregard the screen outside your own normals range because youre just putting yourself at risk.

Weigh up the risk reward. A tele flurry/far sword hitting is not worth the risk of it trading with a smoke bomb, while Gross can sit and eat all the flurries he wants knowing that one smokebomb placed right is going to hurt you tenfold. Smokebomb might as well be the Shake of the Kenshi matchup.