Opinion on JIK's in MK11 1.11 patch

[LawAbidingCitizen]

This is probably an unpopular opinion but I feel JIK's are counterable if you lab the MU enough.
This may be Biased Opinion since I use characters with very strong AA'S like Terminator (D3/s1/B3), Cassie(B3 all day) and Kotal(some MU's).

But I also feel there are universal tools to deal with JIK's across most of the cast aside from a few exceptions like characters with bad AA's and FB launchers that wiff.

These options are:
Trip Guard
FB Launching Jump In's
Low profiling moves
Hurtboxless normals

Good examples of these are:
Terminators: S1, B3, D3, FB U2.
Cassie's: B3(godlike), Nutkick low profiles
Kabal D4
D'Vorah's D2, DF2
Kollector's: s2 & D2
Cetrion's: s1 & D3
Liu Kang's: D3 & s1

There are more but that's the best ones I've used/ran across that work vs JIK's like Baraka's S Tier JIK3 or Kung Laos JIK.

There is no doubt that some characters struggle in the AA department but the majority have something like Trip Guarding or FB or at worst evading it with low profiling moves and avoiding the plus frames into mix.

What does TYM think about JIK's?

 

[Plays2_MX]

I've had my handful of successful AAs with Noob's D4, but haven't tried it against Baraka tho. On the other hand, if I miss AAs it's mostly cause I reacted late and I haven't labbed enough to do trip guarding.

 

[Zer0_h0ur]

I've had more luck AA'ing with kollector D2 than any normal of the few characters I've played. But I think that's mostly due to it's absurd hitbox LOL. Shit hits people all kinds of weird, but I'll take it.
In fact, I'd be willing to bet most of the normal's you mention in your list have some really really wonky hitboxes, like Term D3 and Cetrion S1

 

[DarksydeDash]

Kitana can't do anything if someone jumps on her unless she does a read on d2.

S1 works for neutral jumps, and d3 works for jump in punches but it's very inconsistent against jump kicks.

This patch also nerfed fan toss as an anti air at the cost of letting us convert.

 

[Tony at Home]

Shallow jump kicks should be negative on block. That's it.

Kotal's S1 is pretty good against jump in kicks but crossup jump kicks are free and have almost no consequence for doing it so early that it blows up AAs

 

[MagicMan357]

AA's are fine in this game, ive watched so many people just wait until the opponent attacks instead of punishing the actual jumnp frames its insane. Even jump kicks get beaten by most d2's (just use barakas jump kick for practice).

 

[LawAbidingCitizen]

I've had more luck AA'ing with kollector D2 than any normal of the few characters I've played. But I think that's mostly due to it's absurd hitbox LOL. Shit hits people all kinds of weird, but I'll take it.
In fact, I'd be willing to bet most of the normal's you mention in your list have some really really wonky hitboxes, like Term D3 and Cetrion S1

Yes Terminators D3 has a very strong almost untouchable hurtbox. Those are my favorite ones where your hitbox gets out of reach and that's what I look for in characters since so many players jump in when they get pressured.

 

[MagicMan357]

@LawAbidingCitizen isnt it weird too how you have some people telling you they have normals that AA but theyre still crying? I dont get this site at all smh.

 

[LawAbidingCitizen]

@LawAbidingCitizen isnt it weird too how you have some people telling you they have normals that AA but theyre still crying? I dont get this site at all smh.

Honestly its probably because they play mostly online where lag is a factor. I know I can AA nearly every time offline but when I'm playing WIFI KL Lao's, Baraka's and Geras's splashing /JIKing me all day I do have issues.

I do find it crazy that some absolutely believe certain JIK are impossible to AA/Trip Guard though. There is 30+ frames before they connect after jump so you can react with fast buttons and even though there are different timing to stuff AA's doing the timing that's fast which counters AA makes it very hard to convert off it and makes it barely + on block removing most adv.
Generally those who JIK do it somewhat late to get plus frames and for it to be easier to combo off. This makes it easier to AA with the better AA's

 

[MagicMan357]

Youre correct because i keep trying to tell people that theyre playing a whole other game online with 100+ ping and people talking about me being scared LMFAO. No other fighting game would even allow that.

 

[Wigy]

Youre correct because i keep trying to tell people that theyre playing a whole other game online with 100+ ping and people talking about me being scared LMFAO. No other fighting game would even allow that.

I mean top players in tournaments statistically struggle they're also dumb offline with top players.

I've heard countless top players say they're dumb.

Aren't you on PC and mostly offline. Where are your credentials to tell everyone git gud. Maybe you're just playing with nobody good. Only match I heard you play with someone on here you got absolutely bodied.

 

[GLoRToR]

I mean top players in tournaments statistically struggle they're also dumb offline with top players.

I've heard countless top players say they're dumb.

Aren't you on PC and mostly offline. Where are your credentials to tell everyone git gud. Maybe you're just playing with nobody good. Only match I heard you play with someone on here you got absolutely bodied.

He plays on wifi and complains about the connection. He also has 0 fundamentals.
Lotta hot air, that one.

 

[MagicMan357]

@Wigy No matter how much low iq shit you talk, im still right about everything i say. You guys are so bad that you have to keep using 200 ping matches to validate your noob bs its actually hilarious. Anybody that actual knows how to play fighting games ALWAYS agrees with my post yet only johnny crybabies agree with you. WTF are your credentials? playing at 100+ ping matches you idiot?

Go back to the cry baby forums.

And the irony is that since mk9 the top players did the same shit and then said mk9 has the best AA's, you need to stay in your lane.

@LawAbidingCitizen Now whats funny is this guy thinks that me playing offline is somehow bad, hes so stupid he doesnt realize thats why i actually know wtf im talking about BECAUSE I LAB THE GAME LMFAO

 

[Wigy]

@MagicMan357

As per usual you gloss over everything I say and just sling insults. Do you play offline tournaments?

I never said I had credentials, I'm saying what I feel is in alignment with pro players, and the statistics from their tournaments.

If you hadn't mentioned mk9 I could swear you were about 13.

 

[Wigy]

@MagicMan357

Do you play offline tournaments?

 

[MagicMan357]

@Wigy What does that have to do with the fact that i know what im talking about? You cant get around it. Just deal with it.

Why wont you listen to sonic fox about johnny? Ill wait.

 

[Wigy]

@Wigy What does that have to do with the fact that i know what im talking about? You cant get around it. Just deal with it.

Why wont you listen to sonic fox about johnny? Ill wait.

If you don't play offline tournaments, and your connection is too garbage to play online you can comment on nothing in this game. Practice mode doesn't translate to the real game.

Anyone can antiair a fucking bot or AI set to jump.

That's my point.

It's actually HILARIOUS you come on here telling people to git gud when you're basing the game off tower AI.

I don't listen to Sonic fox as he's a renown troll. He has said numerous characters were top that weren't even close and downplayed his own that were busted. This is not an opinion it's a well known.

There's been a lot of people posting complete garbage on here but none had the absolute cheek to tell people to get gud when they only play vs ai. Get in the bin you absolute fucking clown.

I found it entertaining seeing everyone shit on your shitposts but I'm done. Ignore list.

 

[MagicMan357]

@Wigy So you literally proved that to online wifi warriors actually labbing the game isnt legit...You are once again a proven idiot and im telling you people are crying laughing at you right now.

You then make an excuse to not listen to someone with credentials while still asking about mine because youre so conflicted with factual info your brain is contradicting its self, now thats hilarious

You came on a site about tech and labbing and just told me idk shit because im labbing the game providing factual info

Thank god youre ignoring me, your negative IQ was hurting my brain.

 

[Agilaz]

If you don't play offline tournaments, and your connection is too garbage to play online you can comment on nothing in this game. Practice mode doesn't translate to the real game.

Anyone can antiair a fucking bot or AI set to jump.

That's my point.

It's actually HILARIOUS you come on here telling people to git gud when you're basing the game off tower AI.

I don't listen to Sonic fox as he's a renown troll. He has said numerous characters were top that weren't even close and downplayed his own that were busted. This is not an opinion it's a well known.

There's been a lot of people posting complete garbage on here but none had the absolute cheek to tell people to get gud when they only play vs ai. Get in the bin you absolute fucking clown.

I found it entertaining seeing everyone shit on your shitposts but I'm done. Ignore list.

While labbing is important, I feel some people here just put way too much stock in it. Labbing jumps is an example, another is labbing Sub's OH/low. Yeah, if you set the dummy to hidden random playback with OH/low, you'll be able to react to the OH fairly consistent.

Now go online. It's near impossible to do it consistently. Even even there was no lag, you have to account for all the other things a Sub player might go for. All of a sudden the OH isn't looking for easily reactable anymore, even if you blocked the mix-up 50 times out of 50 in the lab.

On topic: Jumps are fucking stupid. Yes, there's def answers to them but I feel something needs to be done to put some consistency into the whole thing. Give jumps a SET frame advantage regardless of depth, gives D2's priority over jump normals etc.

Right now there's just too many variables imo

 

[MagicMan357]

So you just admitted that online is trash but offline isnt that important...

No wonder why people stopped coming to TYM holy shit

 

[Agilaz]

So you just admitted that online is trash but offline isnt that important...

No wonder why people stopped coming to TYM holy shit

There are three environments of play: online, competitive offline and single player offline.

Single player offline is completely irrelevant to any discussion.

Online is arguably the most relevant, because that's where most of the action is. Even since MKX online competition has been a major deal in NRS games.

Offline play is relevant but on a different level and less common. There's only so many majors in a year.

From what I've read, you play online on PC. Sorry, but PC has literally zero competition aside from handful of players. I own both the PC and PS4 versions and the difference is night and day. Last time I played KL on PC I went 40-1. That shit ain't happening on PS4, let me tell you that. You're not running into people like VideoGamezYo, or asodimazze (who I played today even), or Deoxys, or Crathen, or Cannaper, or irishMantis or..any good player.

 

[Agilaz]

All of this is getting screen-shotted, its pure gold.

These guys are trying to convince an actual veteran that online is more legit than offline, im crying laughing.

Ok, where can I see some of your offline matches?

Against people. Not the AI on very hard.

 

[MagicMan357]

@Agilaz The AI on hard is harder than you guys put together considering i mainly LAB THE GAME DUMBASS

youre talking to a person who knows the game because i practice and youre still talking shit like idiots...

 

[Agilaz]

@Agilaz The AI on hard is harder than you guys put together considering i mainly LAB THE GAME DUMBASS

youre talking to a person who knows the game because i practice and youre still talking shit like idiots...

The AI can be cheesed, just like any AI in the history of fighting games. Even KI's Kyle difficulty could be cheesed super easily.

Please show me a match against a good player. Come on Veteran-senpai, teach us!

 

[Evantabes]

Just popped in to say in about 2 hours of casuals MagicMan did not win a single game against me. Oh well