Nightwolf Matchup Discussion Thread

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Can some one please update all of konqrr's posts? Im so tired of looking at these kung lao hat tier day 1 matchup charts -_-

I would if I were a mod..."clears esophagus"

I have an updated post somewhere in there and I have also made a thread that is buried in here some where. If you have specific questions feel free to make ask and me and Big D will figure it out for ya.

 

[McNasty]

Make the match up chart and I will update the OP.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Make the match up chart and I will update the OP.

I didn't even know yu were the mod...lol

I'm going to send you the link in a PM of my MU chart I already made. Just sticky that one and unsticky konqrres. It will be easier that way. Then when me and Big D figure out the newest version I'll have you update it.

Edit:

I found it

http://www.testyourmight.com/threads/lotf-nightwolf-matchup-chart.8730/

 

[Metzos]

as for Ermac, I see it as a 6-4 for NW. But thats just me.

Depends how you play the MU.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Depends how you play the MU.

No it depends on the characters...take the player out of it please. I keep hearing yu say this yet it makes no sense in the the origins of MU charts.

MU charts are ONLY based on the tools each character has. That is it, no more, no less. Take the player out of it.

 

[Metzos]

No it depends on the characters...take the player out of it please. I keep hearing yu say this yet it makes no sense in the the origins of MU charts.

MU charts are ONLY based on the tools each character has. That is it, no more, no less. Take the player out of it.

NW cant punish at all max range TKP. How is this a 6-4 in NW's favor then ? Up close we are pretty much even.

EDIT: Also Ermac's down pokes are faster than NW's.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

NW cant punish at all max range TKP. How is this a 6-4 in NW's favor then ? Up close we are pretty much even.

That's the ONLY thing nw can't punish. Any other range besides max and you eat a shoulder. Your not going to space it perfect everytime when we are both dash blocking around. NW can turtle and reflect projectiles and in the end, out turtles ermac. He has armor just in case you get pressure...Ermac has no armor he has to time a d1.

So the count is:
Turtle: Nw wins with reflect, absorb, eh shoulder, and eh lightning. He can keep the life lead and win with a time out if necessary.
Up close: pressure may be even but nw has armor to get out if stuck...ermac doesn't. NW wins
Footsies: NW normals are in general faster, have more range, and his specials are ALL safe except lightning and arrow. He won't use those besides full screen anyways or on a knock down. Ermacs ONLY good footsie tool is FP. And for that nw has shoulder. I'd say even.

 

[Metzos]

That's the ONLY thing nw can't punish. Any other range besides max and you eat a shoulder. Your not going to space it perfect everytime when we are both dash blocking around. NW can turtle and reflect projectiles and in the end, out turtles ermac. He has armor just in case you get pressure...Ermac has no armor he has to time a d1.

So the count is:
Turtle: Nw wins with reflect, absorb, eh shoulder, and eh lightning. He can keep the life lead and win with a time out if necessary.
Up close: pressure may be even but nw has armor to get out if stuck...ermac doesn't. NW wins
Footsies: NW normals are in general faster, have more range, and his specials are ALL safe except lightning and arrow. He won't use those besides full screen anyways or on a knock down. Ermacs ONLY good footsie tool is FP. And for that nw has shoulder. I'd say even.

I agree with it being even. And by armor you mean EX shoulder yes ? Ermac's d1 is faster than NW's d1 and d3. EX shoulder can be punished by full combo or uppercut on whiff though. Also agreed with your opinion vs the max range TKP but dont forget that when you block it you get a little bit pushed back.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

I agree with it being even. And by armor you mean EX shoulder yes ? Ermac's d1 is faster than NW's d1 and d3. EX shoulder can be punished by full combo or uppercut on whiff though. Also agreed with your opinion vs the max range TKP but dont forget that when you block it you get a little bit pushed back.

By armor I mean your pressuring me with 31, 312 f4 bull and I just armor through it to create space with eh shoulder. Your not punishing me if I'm using it this way.

It may be faster but if I counter poke your fast d1 with a d3...I'm at +10 and your pressure is over...thanks for playing

NW wins 6-4

 

[Metzos]

By armor I mean your pressuring me with 31, 312 f4 bull and I just armor through it to create space with eh shoulder. Your not punishing me if I'm using it this way.

It may be faster but if I counter poke your fast d1 with a d3...I'm at +10 and your pressure is over...thanks for playing

NW wins 6-4

Lol so you think its a 6-4 cause you place your hopes on counter poking ? Ok...

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Lol so you think its a 6-4 cause you place your hopes on counter poking ? Ok...

I'm not hanging my hopes. Yur apparently hanging yours on the fact that your d1 is 1 frame faster than mine.
Counter poking IS MK! Lol man you apparently are overlooking a few fundamentals that at high level play make a huge difference!

Counter poking makes all the difference. If I block a d1 your at -13. My d3 is 7 frames and if it his I'm at +10. So that means I get a free f3 check. Then comes in the mix up like cages f3 mixup. No frame traps on block but the illusion of frame traps make nw pressure dangerous.

If I read your d1, I get free pressure. That is huge! NW is the Only character in the game that gets +10 off a d3 counter poke. And you bet your ass it works

 

[Metzos]

I'm not hanging my hopes. Yur apparently hanging yours on the fact that your d1 is 1 frame faster than mine.
Counter poking IS MK! Lol man you apparently are overlooking a few fundamentals that at high level play make a huge difference!

Counter poking makes all the difference. If I block a d1 your at -13. My d3 is 7 frames and if it his I'm at +10. So that means I get a free f3 check. Then comes in the mix up like cages f3 mixup. No frame traps on block but the illusion of frame traps make nw pressure dangerous.

If I read your d1, I get free pressure. That is huge! NW is the Only character in the game that gets +10 off a d3 counter poke. And you bet your ass it works

Look m8... I m not trying to say that NW doesnt win this MU. He DOES. But its not a 6-4 and not for the reasons you tell me. And you are at +10f if i get hit while crouching. Same thing could happen if Ermac blocks your down pokes. Your d1 is at -13 and your d3 at -7f, plus it doesnt have a good range too. Ermac's d3 is also at 7f. Have you seen Ermac's d3 range ? I dont think so. Thats why i m saying its even OR .5 in NW's favor cause of the armor EX shoulder has, plus cause its safe on block. I know what i m talking about here. Counter poking applies for both of us here not only you.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Look m8... I m not trying to say that NW doesnt win this MU. He DOES. But its not a 6-4 and not for the reasons you tell me. And you are at +10f if i get hit while crouching. Same thing could happen if Ermac blocks your down pokes. Your d1 is at -13 and your d3 at -7f, plus it doesnt have a good range too. Ermac's d3 is also at 7f. Have you seen Ermac's d3 range ? I dont think so. Thats why i m saying its even OR .5 in NW's favor cause of the armor EX shoulder has, plus cause its safe on block. I know what i m talking about here. Counter poking applies for both of us here not only you.

I agree m8...but being at +3 doesn't give you that much compared to +10

 

[Metzos]

I agree m8...but being at +3 doesn't give you that much compared to +10

I agree. The reason cause its only +5 though is because of the insane range and the low hitbox it provides. That compensates it well.

EDIT: Btw its +5 on crouch hit not +3. I knew something was wrong with that number.

 

[Big D]

metzos13 L0rdoftheFLY Although this is just my opinion, I believe the match up is dead even at 5-5. Having Ermac as my strongest back-up, I can tell you that his change-ups/pressure is DANGEROUS. And not know when to stop blocking can be absolutely devastating, while one poke from NW can lead in to trouble. It is amazing what both these characters can do with a little exploring...

 

[KH_Captain]

I play both, main NW, and Ermac as a 3rd supplement. I agree NW wins. but its a close 6-4 maybe a 5.5-4.5. Fly so I've seen you started messin around with skarlet what's your opinion on NW vs. Skarlet.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

I play both, main NW, and Ermac as a 3rd supplement. I agree NW wins. but its a close 6-4 maybe a 5.5-4.5. Fly so I've seen you started messin around with skarlet what's your opinion on NW vs. Skarlet.

That's tough cause I've never faught a NW with her. I will say that she ha to chase nw down due to reflect. She can't zone at all. For that reason alone I might say nw wins but her rushdown...boy her rushdown.

NW has a large hitbox which opens him up to pressure shenanigans. He can't duck under her f21 chip string. So this means that if she lands ONE combo she gets to do f2121+2 eh dagger cancel all day until she is out of meter. For this reason I might say that skarlet wins...but her only problem is that she can't build meter very fast against nw because she is getting reflected all the time.

So all this to say...theory fight goes even at 5-5. Lol

 

[KH_Captain]

That's tough cause I've never faught a NW with her. I will say that she ha to chase nw down due to reflect. She can't zone at all. For that reason alone I might say nw wins but her rushdown...boy her rushdown.

NW has a large hitbox which opens him up to pressure shenanigans. He can't duck under her f21 chip string. So this means that if she lands ONE combo she gets to do f2121+2 eh dagger cancel all day until she is out of meter. For this reason I might say that skarlet wins...but her only problem is that she can't build meter very fast against nw because she is getting reflected all the time.

So all this to say...theory fight goes even at 5-5. Lol

I think NW's armor is very important in this matchup. So when she finally catches up to him to get in a block string it gets armored out of.

 

[Sirmixalot]

i dont know if this has been discussed before but how is Nightwolf Scorpion 5-5 i really dont understand it seems like everything is in scorpions favor

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

i dont know if this has been discussed before but how is Nightwolf Scorpion 5-5 i really dont understand it seems like everything is in scorpions favor

Explain how it is in scorpions favor.

They both play footsies to win in this MU. It comes down to the player I think. No blaring advantages for either character. One thing scorp has a problem with is ZERO invincibility on wake up. That means he gets hit by every eh lightning on knockdown except when he uses eh takedown. Besides that, scorp has better mixups up close and nightwolf has better armor and footsies IMO.

 

[Big D]

L0rdoftheFLY If you want, we can test out the NW vs Skarlet matchup and discuss it from there.

Sirmixalot As for NW and Scorpion, I see it as a 6-4 for Scorpion but that is just me...Scorpion can punish you standing on the ground, can anti-spear, has a great normal anti-air, and has a crazy vortex; while NW has one lightning trap and good damage. Bare lightnings wont work because he can teleport on reaction. Arrows are useless in this matchup. Air-to-air is almost unwinnable. Then again, its just my opinion.

Thoughts?

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

L0rdoftheFLY If you want, we can test out the NW vs Skarlet matchup and discuss it from there.

Sirmixalot As for NW and Scorpion, I see it as a 6-4 for Scorpion but that is just me...Scorpion can punish you standing on the ground, can anti-spear, has a great normal anti-air, and has a crazy vortex; while NW has one lightning trap and good damage. Bare lightnings wont work because he can teleport on reaction. Arrows are useless in this matchup. Air-to-air is almost unwinnable. Then again, its just my opinion.

Thoughts?

We should run it. I played ninj last night nw skarlet for about 6 matches...I still think it's even. But 6 matches isn't enough. We can play but be aware my skarlet isn't more than 6 weeks old and isn't battle tested.

 

[Big D]

We should run it. I played ninj last night nw skarlet for about 6 matches...I still think it's even. But 6 matches isn't enough. We can play but be aware my skarlet isn't more than 6 weeks old and isn't battle tested.

It shouldn't be too bad. Since I have been going crazy with Ermac, my NW is a lil rusty. Btw, where is your next offline appearance?

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Not sure man. Not sure