MK9 Potential Patch Character Balancing and Discussion

[RomeoBravoDelta]

Yeah I mean fix it for those awkward moments e.g. Raiden's electric fly where my jab hits and then the 2 whiffs because of its stupid ass hitbox. Or Reptile's elbow dash.

As for b+3, 4 I think that it will cover some of the holes in his offence, which isn't all that great as is. I think to complement normals like b+1 and f+2, he needs something long ranging other than b+2, 1 (which when blocked effectively ends his offense) to pose a threat to an opponent with. That being said, if b+3, 4 connects on every character, I have no problem making it disadvantage on block (but not punishable).

Against low hit-box characters, Sektor has problems getting his offense started. I mean it isn't 100% necessary but I don't think that Sektor needs that many changes anyways (compared to some other characters). Most important is giving him armour on flame burner so that he has a GTFO move and a respectable wake-up (I also want the flame burner to have better priority and not get stuffed so easily sometimes).

I get what you're saying, I just don't think that Sektor should be trying to get an up close offense going. And with b34, except Mileena and Sektor, it'll connect with everyone if you do it right. You just can't throw it out willy nilly. And even if it connected on everyone at any range all the time, he still can't maintain that offence because the rest of his options will wiff on crouch.

 

[NKZero]

I get what you're saying, I just don't think that Sektor should be trying to get an up close offense going. And with b34, except Mileena and Sektor, it'll connect with everyone if you do it right. You just can't throw it out willy nilly. And even if it connected on everyone at any range all the time, he still can't maintain that offence because the rest of his options will wiff on crouch.

Yeah but it's annoying how you have to find a specific spacing to get it to connect. Besides it's not like it's a stupidly good string, plenty of other characters have abusable strings. At least if you're gonna give a character mediocre strings, don't make them whiff.

 

[Impractical Joker]

Crouch block and reverse punish.

You realize that these aren't because I can't punish it but to make all of the characters more balanced. With the nerfs to the other top tier characters Johnny cage would become one of the top 3 characters so I added it. Also many characters can't get a good punish on it such as Jade and noob Saibot. I also have Reptiles dash becoming more punishable. They might not be necessary but when you are playing on a crappy net code it's nice to still be able to punish it.

You could also use the argument of duck block and reverse punish with Scorpions teleport in IGAU

 

[Tang94]

Learn to dash block.

I can dash block just fine, sir. I just think the game felt much more fluid when you could cancel your dash. Not to mention it caused that whole "universal nerf" thing where characters like Sub-Zero had a ridiculously hard time getting in.

 

[RTM2004]

Also many characters can't get a good punish on it such as Jade and noob Saibot. I also have Reptiles dash becoming more punishable. They might not be necessary but when you are playing on a crappy net code it's nice to still be able to punish it.

I agree. Reptile's Elbow Dash should be -20 since there a lot of characters with slow normals who can't punish heavy. With Cage, his Red Kick, Nutpunch, Shadow Kick are all unsafe, it only makes sense Flip Kick is a safe mid block by standing but it can be punished by crouch block reverse punish or baited with right spacing so you can air combo punish him. His F3 normal mix ups block stun should be toned down, -3 at least.

 

[Konqrr]

I can dash block just fine, sir. I just think the game felt much more fluid when you could cancel your dash. Not to mention it caused that whole "universal nerf" thing where characters like Sub-Zero had a ridiculously hard time getting in.

I guess maybe because I play Kitana (who's dash is fast), I don't feel the dash nerf did anything to be honest. That's how you get around in MK9 now.

 

[Impractical Joker]

I agree. Reptile's Elbow Dash should be -20 since there a lot of characters with slow normals who can't punish heavy. With Cage, his Red Kick, Nutpunch, Shadow Kick are all unsafe, it only makes sense Flip Kick is a safe mid block by standing but it can be punished by crouch block reverse punish or baited with right spacing so you can air combo punish him. His F3 normal mix ups block stun should be toned down, -3 at least.

Not a bad idea. The only thing is that's his main pressure game. I'm pretty sure f33 is already minus on block and f333 has pushback so I'm not sure if f3 should become negative or not. Who knows, Johnny Cage is pretty fair for the most part, maybe just reduce his meter gain on f3 pressure or something. The problem with him and Kabal is how quick they build meter honestly

 

[Impractical Joker]

I can dash block just fine, sir. I just think the game felt much more fluid when you could cancel your dash. Not to mention it caused that whole "universal nerf" thing where characters like Sub-Zero had a ridiculously hard time getting in.

I don't even remember the old dash but I think it's fine as it is now. Dash blocking to get places quick and Cancelling into attacks out of dash gives the game more depth.

 

[N-Zalo]

KITANA:
*As Nephrite said making pretty kick non-duckable, is a very good idea (specially on wake-up), and it's not too much to ask for since it's -4 on block.
*Buffin the gaps between strings and fake-out kick (1,1,2,-gap-,fok; f4,1,-gap-,fok) enough to jail, so she can have real mixups
*And of course it would be a dream come true if cutter was armored instead of butt...

 

[JAP]

ground skulls (both ex and normal) still come out of the floor when shang is hit

it would be great if ground skull startup time was shorter (around 5 frames less), but in order for that to work, cancel advantage for all of his strings would have to be adjusted and the rest of his specials would need to be sped up to avoid losing some of his block traps, so meh

Armor up skull Ex (wake up) WoundCowboy ?

 

[cR WoundCowboy]

Armor up skull Ex (wake up) WoundCowboy ?

Yea, that's a good idea. He would have a godly wakeup game.

 

[THTB]

Reptile:

+f31+2 reset no longer corner-specific.
+Slightly improved speed and distance on normal dashes (not extreme, just enough to properly maneuver...like I'm talking BARELY enough to do so)

Tbh, that's probably it. Maybe reverse the elbow dash hit recovery change.

 

[STRYKIE]

Stryker
5. Hitbox size reduced to medium from large.


Jade

7. Medium hitbox.

Just for the record, you do realize all of the hitbox idiosyncrasies weren't intentional right? If NRS were to patch the game full scale they'd probably make hitbox distribution universal.

Fun fact: Kabal gets hit by Scorpion's standing 1 in crouch block which is meant to be high while Jax's F1 whiffs on Kabal in crouch block despite being intended as a mid lol.

 

[STRYKIE]

I agree. Reptile's Elbow Dash should be -20 since there a lot of characters with slow normals who can't punish heavy. With Cage, his Red Kick, Nutpunch, Shadow Kick are all unsafe, it only makes sense Flip Kick is a safe mid block by standing but it can be punished by crouch block reverse punish or baited with right spacing so you can air combo punish him. His F3 normal mix ups block stun should be toned down, -3 at least.

I don't think Reptile's Dash was intended to be unsafe in the first place. -20 is overkill, he'd be crumpets against Sektor's B2 and Rain's 4 (if not already).

 

[Element_]

i listed many things in a different thread , but to be honnest...just give Sektor armor on his EX telepunch , Shang faster fireballs and maybe some armor , then i will feel satisfied.

 

[Espio]

Just for the record, you do realize all of the hitbox idiosyncrasies weren't intentional right? If NRS were to patch the game full scale they'd probably make hitbox distribution universal.

Fun fact: Kabal gets hit by Scorpion's standing 1 in crouch block which is meant to be high while Jax's F1 whiffs on Kabal in crouch block despite being intended as a mid lol.

The part you quoted isn't talking about strings at all, which based on the fun fact part is what you're talking about so I'm not sure if there's a misunderstanding or not.



I'm talking about their actual hitboxes/hurtboxes on the characters because according to the Kabal pressure chart and my own testing they have level 4 hitboxes like Kenshi and Freddy, but they don't have strong zoning or strong pressure or anything to compensate for this handicap like characters such as Kenshi or Freddy have.

 

[STRYKIE]

The part you quoted isn't talking about strings at all, which based on the fun fact part is what you're talking about so I'm not sure if there's a misunderstanding or not.



I'm talking about their actual hitboxes/hurtboxes on the characters because according to the Kabal pressure chart and my own testing they have level 4 hitboxes like Kenshi and Freddy, but they don't have strong zoning or strong pressure or anything to compensate for this handicap like characters such as Kenshi or Freddy have.

I was putting into perspective how random the hitboxes are in general. Kabal was just an example since he's widely believed to have a low hitbox when for the most part, this isn't the case and gets hit by several highs.

Master D's thread on Kabal's pressure I would assume is geared towards helping Kabal players in choosing which strings to use on each characters, some work more than others.

Again, as much as the varying hitbox sizes makes for an interesting meta, I highly doubt they were deliberate. Mileena's rushdown is awful, while having decent zoning and she ended up with the lowest crouching hitbox in the game IIRC lol.

 

[Big Pampering]

anybody who says teleport delay 3 should be high doesnt know what hes talking about. The only way your going to get hit is if the kung lao player guessed right about what youre going to do or your reactions were just slow which you are going to get rightfully punished for.

I don't want to hear any nerfs about ex teleport when people try to double uppercut the ex teleport which was one of the most dumb things ever posted. Also once you start to dash out of tele delay 3 or anti air it with a standing normal, making it whiff with a d3 or armoring it you have nothing to complain about it.

Just for the record, you do realize all of the hitbox idiosyncrasies weren't intentional right? If NRS were to patch the game full scale they'd probably make hitbox distribution universal.

Fun fact: Kabal gets hit by Scorpion's standing 1 in crouch block which is meant to be high while Jax's F1 whiffs on Kabal in crouch block despite being intended as a mid lol.

Hitboxes not being the same character is intentional, maybe not to the point where it was mileena small, but they are not intended to be the same for all characters and I don't think thats the case for any fighting game.

Edit: these sektor buff suggestions are ridiculous, are you guys serious? armor on ex teleport? and they even want teleport uppercut to be less minus frames when its already safe. they want a safe low launcher and want to buff all his 1/2 strings so he can be a character that blows up zoning, rushes you the fuck down, mix you up safely and outfootsie you at the same time. And on top of that they want armor on ex flamethrower.

 

[Letsgetacid]

Edit: these sektor buff suggestions are ridiculous, are you guys serious? armor on ex teleport? and they even want teleport uppercut to be less minus frames when its already safe. they want a safe low launcher and want to buff all his 1/2 strings so he can be a character that blows up zoning, rushes you the fuck down, mix you up safely and outfootsie you at the same time. And on top of that they want armor on ex flamethrower.

I main Sektor so I'm totally biased, but god I'd like to see that for a hot minute.