Match-up Discussion Lex Luthor Matchup Discussion

[Dayvo]

You've got by far the best Lex I've played. I was trying not to spam too hard since we were playing friendly casuals, but I quickly found if I gave you room to breathe, I was fighting a losing battle. You opened my eyes that the MU isn't quite as bad as I initially thought, though I do still think he loses out if the DS player is ok with hanging back and overwhelming him with gunfire.

Normally, most of the Deathstrokes you can find online use to do that: Sit back and start to deplete your lifebar by gunshots, sword flip once you are at range, jump away and repeat. Lex doesn't have the better skills to face this scenario, but it's something that everyone has to learn to counter. Deathstroke is a popular character, and also that strategy.

Your DS it's not that type of character(yours has a lot mixup and combo potential) , but I understand perfectly that sometimes you have to go that way. And I want to learn to counter it.

By my experience, The watchtower and the Justice Hall can give a lot advantage for getting in, and Fenris and Atlantis must be avoided at all costs.

 

[Malec]

i seriously think that deathstroke is lex worst matchup. there is nothing lex can do to come in except for slowly walking/blocking in. you cant use any special moves on range and also no trait against those fast mutli hitting gun shots, you cant jump and also not dash in.
i hate this matchup so much. and if the deathstroke is on a stage with respawning interactables, this is gg already.
i am not an amazing top pro player or something like that, but against deahtstroke i always think i lost cause of the MU

 

[Thead]

i seriously think that deathstroke is lex worst matchup. there is nothing lex can do to come in except for slowly walking/blocking in. you cant use any special moves on range and also no trait against those fast mutli hitting gun shots, you cant jump and also not dash in.

Walk and duck, after Deathstroke fires High Guns or Air Guns (and they whiff from you crouching) you get a free dash he can't do anything about. After a blocked Assault Rifle (and MB version) you get a free dash too.

Deathstroke Low Gunshot is what you have to look out for, you don't get a free dash afterwards as a follow up Gunshot will hit you. This however opens up a chance to jump or jump~Corpse Charge to avoid Low Guns.

You have to be patient and take your time approaching Deathstroke, his zoning isn't that scary once you realise the gaps in it.

 

[Dayvo]

i seriously think that deathstroke is lex worst matchup. there is nothing lex can do to come in except for slowly walking/blocking in. you cant use any special moves on range and also no trait against those fast mutli hitting gun shots, you cant jump and also not dash in.
i hate this matchup so much. and if the deathstroke is on a stage with respawning interactables, this is gg already.
i am not an amazing top pro player or something like that, but against deahtstroke i always think i lost cause of the MU

If you are in the rigth side choose watchtower. Use the robot for cornering him in the left. Dont use the robot always. Punish him with empty jumps with corp charge . Never get near the reactor unless you feel fast enough to dash cantel your trait for full combo punish when he uses te button. If he uses the robot trait dash and punish.

Lex uses interactuables a lot, more than nobody. His trait allows him to mb interactuables in 2 amor points

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

I'm really salty as I write this.... Black Adam is a horrible match up for Lex. He can punish anytime you put something out, he can punish you trying to time a trait dash, even landing a orb strike doesn't help. Walking backwards and having some kind of instant projectile is Lex's downfall.

Rush him down and armor up and go in for 50/50s. Take advantage of adam's weaknesses with his wake ups and AA. JI3 gets you in for free mixed with jumping *read* and corp charge his zoning. If he jumps in the air first do a NJ ji3 or jump back 3 corp charge on his dive kick into armor

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

well, if lex got his trait up and grundy trys to grab you with his corpse walk (3 armor) you absorb the grab and he loses his armor cause the move is finished and you can hit him. if grundy uses corpse walk cancel into a normal, he should lose his armor also after canceling the walk, and you absorb the first normal he throws out after the cancel. so if i am not mistaken and lex got his trait up and grundy throws out any corpse walk options, lex just have to mash any strings, to be good.
i havent tested this, but thats what comes into my mind, thinking about that hole situation

Ok but what if Grundy does walking corpse cancel d2 xx throw ?

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Anyone think their Lex is an absolute beast on psn? Would like to see how you play against a friend of mine.

i like to

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

You've got by far the best Lex I've played. I was trying not to spam too hard since we were playing friendly casuals, but I quickly found if I gave you room to breathe, I was fighting a losing battle. You opened my eyes that the MU isn't quite as bad as I initially thought, though I do still think he loses out if the DS player is ok with hanging back and overwhelming him with gunfire.

I want to play this MU badly

doesnt matter if i lose 0-50

 

[BDMao88]

Rush him down and armor up and go in for 50/50s. Take advantage of adam's weaknesses with his wake ups and AA. JI3 gets you in for free mixed with jumping *read* and corp charge his zoning. If he jumps in the air first do a NJ ji3 or jump back 3 corp charge on his dive kick into armor

Thanks a lot, I will try this out soon.

 

[Deleted member 5032]

I want to play this MU badly

doesnt matter if i lose 0-50

I'm down whenever.

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Thanks a lot, I will try this out soon.

also go to practice mode

set up dive kicks on repeat

walk around the room and practice blocking them then punishing w d1 gravity mb b3 ji3 u3 far mine ..drone..Air strike FT

he will think about DK a little less

 

[Spheris]

I just did a FT20 against a fairly good Raven who clearly knew what he was doing and lost 20-5. I feel this matchup is very hard for Lex too, like 7-3. The 5 matches I won I got lucky guessed always correctly when blocking or making a move, and had a pixel left of life.

Any advice for her? Anyway I'll go lab this MU

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

I was dead wrong

Lex luther loses his ass to ds

I will keep looking for an answer

Its not even comparable to how well sinestro does

Lex is fucked vs a solid to excellent ds

he will body shitty ones

EDIT: WAIT A MINUTE I JUST WON 6 STRAIGHT
tbc.oh nvm

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

karaokelove

Lets us discuss this MU in detail Lex vs Ds

 

[CalDW19940]

Any character that has a relatively fast moving mid/high hitting full screen attack tends to give Lex trouble and almost completely shuts down any momentum he can get to close the gap due to his height and very sluggish walkspeed/dash.

Raven, Deathstroke and Sinestro are absolutely horrible for Lex since his trait is near enough pointless against them and any ranged attacks he has are too slow or don't do as much damage on trade compared to how fast their attacks are.

I really hope they consider something like giving him an MB version of Corp Charge that's immune to projectiles so he at least has a halfway decent way to get in. Best thing to do just now is block and dash and hope they make an attempt to jump over you to get out the corner or you're close enough to knock them down with sweep or Corp Charge.

 

[Spheris]

I really hope they consider something like giving him an MB version of Corp Charge that's immune to projectiles so he at least has a halfway decent way to get in

I was thinking about MB Corp just yesterday. That would definitely help for the Raven and Sinestro matchups, specially for the Raven one. But for Deathstroke.. well, that wouldn't make much of a difference because all his shoots are multihitting. I have the feeling that particular matchup is going to be always a steep hill to climb, no matter the patches they do.

 

[BDMao88]

I would hate a MB corps charge because Lex would literally have 0 meter all the time and unable to do any combos.

Why doesn't anyone like the idea of a 0 frame recovery air corps charge?

 

[Spheris]

I would hate a MB corps charge because Lex would literally have 0 meter all the time and unable to do any combos.

Why doesn't anyone like the idea of a 0 frame recovery air corps charge?

I like it too, in fact I dream both with MB Corp and 0 frame recover Air Corp, lol

PS: And with MB Air Corp XD

 

[Deleted member 5032]

karaokelove

Lets us discuss this MU in detail Lex vs Ds

First off, I always underestimate Lex, and end up paying for it. If I let you get within just outside sweep distance, everything I do becomes a risk. Gunshots can be punished with Corp Charge, your j3 beats almost anything I can do, and Corp Charge will also beat my jumps and backdashes. Corp Charge is also surprisingly difficult to punish. You were able to block my 7-frame Sword Flip and full-combo punish, which is when I just started throwing after every blocked CC.

Up close I'd say it's a bit more even. The problem with that point just beyond sweep distance is that none of my tools will reach you except my super-unsafe Sword Flip, or my relatively unsafe Guns. Up close, however, we both have access to some nice mixup tools and frametraps. I should have utilized f23 a lot more, since it's a 7-frame +9-on-block launcher. I believe that string will give Lex a lot of trouble after Corp Charge, because if you don't block it you'll eat around 15%-20%, but if you do block it you're susceptible to a crossup, 323, or b1u2.

Full-screen is where Lex has problems, which should surprise no one. If I can keep you from getting into that sweet spot then I win. Near the end of our set, I started to realize I didn't even need to use Low Shot from full screen, I could just spam High Shot and it seemed incredibly difficult for Lex to do a damn thing about it. Throwing in MB High Shot and the ocassional Low Shot or Machine Gun for frame variety made it so you couldn't easily dash between shots. His hitbox is so huge that jumping a High Shot seemed difficult, and Air Corp Charge has so much hangtime that I could usually catch you on your way down with another standing High Shot.

One thing I was curious about was how much invincibility Corp Charge had on wakeup. Most Deathstrokes, myself included, will chip you for 3% every single time we knock you down. It's free unavoidable damage, so why not? So if you knew I was going to do that, it seems like you could wakeup Corp Charge to ignore the chip and immediately close a huge gap. Even if the wakeup didn't work right, it would just result in an additional 3% damage (6% total), so it's not the end of the world. Any thoughts?

 

[CalDW19940]

I was thinking about MB Corp just yesterday. That would definitely help for the Raven and Sinestro matchups, specially for the Raven one. But for Deathstroke.. well, that wouldn't make much of a difference because all his shoots are multihitting. I have the feeling that particular matchup is going to be always a steep hill to climb, no matter the patches they do.

No I mean completely invul to projectiles o-o

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

First off, I always underestimate Lex, and end up paying for it. If I let you get within just outside sweep distance, everything I do becomes a risk. Gunshots can be punished with Corp Charge, your j3 beats almost anything I can do, and Corp Charge will also beat my jumps and backdashes. Corp Charge is also surprisingly difficult to punish. You were able to block my 7-frame Sword Flip and full-combo punish, which is when I just started throwing after every blocked CC.

Up close I'd say it's a bit more even. The problem with that point just beyond sweep distance is that none of my tools will reach you except my super-unsafe Sword Flip, or my relatively unsafe Guns. Up close, however, we both have access to some nice mixup tools and frametraps. I should have utilized f23 a lot more, since it's a 7-frame +9-on-block launcher. I believe that string will give Lex a lot of trouble after Corp Charge, because if you don't block it you'll eat around 15%-20%, but if you do block it you're susceptible to a crossup, 323, or b1u2.

Full-screen is where Lex has problems, which should surprise no one. If I can keep you from getting into that sweet spot then I win. Near the end of our set, I started to realize I didn't even need to use Low Shot from full screen, I could just spam High Shot and it seemed incredibly difficult for Lex to do a damn thing about it. Throwing in MB High Shot and the ocassional Low Shot or Machine Gun for frame variety made it so you couldn't easily dash between shots. His hitbox is so huge that jumping a High Shot seemed difficult, and Air Corp Charge has so much hangtime that I could usually catch you on your way down with another standing High Shot.

One thing I was curious about was how much invincibility Corp Charge had on wakeup. Most Deathstrokes, myself included, will chip you for 3% every single time we knock you down. It's free unavoidable damage, so why not? So if you knew I was going to do that, it seems like you could wakeup Corp Charge to ignore the chip and immediately close a huge gap. Even if the wakeup didn't work right, it would just result in an additional 3% damage (6% total), so it's not the end of the world. Any thoughts?

You explain things really well

In no way can I setup mid screen or full screen traps in this MU. Lex has to close the gap an you're right about quick high guns being used as the primary keep out tool. I felt like once lex got in it became very 5/5 or actually lex favor because of the momentum and damage he can get off guessing correct. No question DS gives him his hardest time getting in.

I think w corp charge it's 6 frame move and I heard there's 8 frames of invincibility so if times perfectly w your shots on OKI I could get in for free but it's harder to time than it sounds. I noticed it and got shot out of it many times.

I wanna pause for a second and comment on something I WAS GETTING ANGRY about last night and I noticed u were definitely having same issues. Did u notice how many times when I was close to u and would block a gun or sword flip I would do a jump back/ or a standing 2 that would accomplish nothing? I was trying to do corp charge as a punish every time but this games stupid block stun makes it where u have to sit there an hour after blocking then input moves . I started noticing it wasn't just me cause u would try to low gun me and a kick would come out.

Very frustrating

 

[Deleted member 5032]

You explain things really well

In no way can I setup mid screen or full screen traps in this MU. Lex has to close the gap an you're right about quick high guns being used as the primary keep out tool. I felt like once lex got in it became very 5/5 or actually lex favor because of the momentum and damage he can get off guessing correct. No question DS gives him his hardest time getting in.

I think w corp charge it's 6 frame move and I heard there's 8 frames of invincibility so if times perfectly w your shots on OKI I could get in for free but it's harder to time than it sounds. I noticed it and got shot out of it many times.

I wanna pause for a second and comment on something I WAS GETTING ANGRY about last night and I noticed u were definitely having same issues. Did u notice how many times when I was close to u and would block a gun or sword flip I would do a jump back/ or a standing 2 that would accomplish nothing? I was trying to do corp charge as a punish every time but this games stupid block stun makes it where u have to sit there an hour after blocking then input moves . I started noticing it wasn't just me cause u would try to low gun me and a kick would come out.

Very frustrating

Yeah, I was dropping Low Shots left and right. Our matches didn't feel laggy at all, so I guess it really was just block stun. I think Aris put it best when he said the game feels "muddy". So far nothing has been 100% consistent, and you kind of just have to pray that shit works the way it's supposed to.

And yeah, for whatever reason back-forward motions do not like to come out online. I play on a fucking Hitbox and I can't get Corp Charge or Bull Rush to come out half the time.

 

[evilben]

not related to DS due to his multi hitting projectiles, but what do you think about trait dash cancelling to get through the single hitting projectiles. sure you take the damage because the trait isnt powered up to level 3, but you can gain a lot of ground. also, with people walk back shooting, on knock down throw a far mine, they cant just walk away from you if its sitting behind them...

 

[miloPKL]

not related to DS due to his multi hitting projectiles, but what do you think about trait dash cancelling to get through the single hitting projectiles. sure you take the damage because the trait isnt powered up to level 3, but you can gain a lot of ground. also, with people walk back shooting, on knock down throw a far mine, they cant just walk away from you if its sitting behind them...

a 25% increase in the damage of the projectile because you are at lvl 1, you lose trait, and youll lose the dash if the projectile hits twice like batman or nightwing.

 

[Chrishaspads]

i main cyborg but every time i play a lex the only thing they can do really is do that unblockable if i mess up 1 iafb. But after that im at full screen so i go back to it. I would like to here people who main lex's thoughts on this matchup!