General/Other - Wrestler LAW Cancel - Should it be -6 on block?

[Bender]

Just want some opinions. I think Jax is already really strong. If he were to get a buff, there are two things I would ask for (not that they're needed, but yeah - could be really nice).

(1) His F21 hits mid consistently. Characters seem to be able to duck under it even though its a mid and uppercut me, even if I am on hit advantage from a D4. For some reason Milleana can always ball roll under it after I come in after a D4, which is super frustrating.

(2) Make LAW cancels 0 or -1 on block. He only gets 1 LAW cancel before he runs out of stamina. I don't think it should be so negative (I almost always eat a poke and sometimes a full combo). When you look at characters like hellfire who get multiple frame trap cancels and ridiculous chip, it would make sense to have a better cancel LAW.

That said, Jax already has absurd pressure and this might be too much.

 

[RyuKazuya]

i totally agree bro
i really have issues especially online cancelling his LAW safely
Its not necessarily needed but as you said it would be really cool

 

[KIllaByte]

Mileena's roll is supposed to dodge everything dude, it makes the character and her style.
Block after pretending to rush in, then punish the roll, you'll feel great about making a read into 38% or 29%.

 

[Bender]

Mileena's roll is supposed to dodge everything dude, it makes the character and her style.
Block after pretending to rush in, then punish the roll, you'll feel great about making a read into 38% or 29%.

I get that, and the character needs something. That's how I've started playing the MU.

However I am on hit advantage, which is why it is frustrating.

 

[KIllaByte]

I get that, and the character needs something. That's how I've started playing the MU.

However I am on hit advantage, which is why it is frustrating.

oooohhh, I can see that being frustrating on hit advantage. My bad. You could be able to get a tighter, faster more mid hit from Jax's F3 into combo, though.
That being said I only play pumped up.
I can't imagine Jax without his +8 energy/bully wave.

 

[KIllaByte]

Is Jax in a throwable state when he crouches to fire the law?
I'm wondering how good the mixup between cancel or fire the rocket is.

 

[Bender]

oooohhh, I can see that being frustrating on hit advantage. My bad. You could be able to get a tighter, faster more mid hit from Jax's F3 into combo, though.
That being said I only play pumped up.
I can't imagine Jax without his +8 energy/bully wave.

Lol I can't imagine Jax without his law cancels and gotcha grab pressure. I do wish he had that +8 projectile instead of those garage machine guns tho.

 

[Bender]

Is Jax in a throwable state when he crouches to fire the law?
I'm wondering how good the mixup between cancel or fire the rocket is.

I've never been thrown from that, but keep in mind I'm only holding the rocket for 1 - 3 frames.

It's okay, but punishable if you fire.

 

[KIllaByte]

Lol I can't imagine Jax without his law cancels and gotcha grab pressure. I do wish he had that +8 projectile instead of those garage machine guns tho.

I've had thoughts of switching to wrestler to turn my 50-50s into 33/33/33s at midscreen, but then I remember how fantastic Pumped up's standing resets in the corner are, as well as more meterless damage.
ground pound gimmicks are good too.

 

[Bender]

I've had thoughts of switching to wrestler to turn my 50-50s into 33/33/33s at midscreen, but then I remember how fantastic Pumped up's standing resets in the corner are, as well as more meterless damage.
ground pound gimmicks are good too.

Yeah, the main issue I have with Pumped Up, is gotcha grab is only -3 in Wrestler/ HW's variations and I can get off d1 xx gotcha grab to d4 xx gotcha grab in the neutral game against a lot of players. It is so quick.

Pumped up loses out on that pressure.

HW's doesn't lose out on meterless damage because of the extended cancel combos.

 

[omegapr1me99]

Asking for Jax buffs? Really? A buff Sonya thread, a buff Scorpion thread and now a buff Jax thread. I'm sure being hit out of a mid string is frustrating but their are are a lot of characters in need of buffs that should be helped before buffing Jax is even considered.

 

[Bender]

Asking for Jax buffs? Really? A buff Sonya thread, a buff Scorpion thread and now a buff Jax thread. I'm sure being hit out of a mid string is frustrating but their are are a lot of characters in need of buffs that should be helped before buffing Jax is even considered.

Did you even read my post? I said it's not needed, as Jax is already strong.

I 100% agree, half of the cast needs a buff over Jax, but if NRS is looking at every character in the game, I wouldn't mind seeing these additions.

The F2 actually hitting mid "buff" feels like more of a fix than a buff.

 

[Error404]

Where's the option for just "no". As in Jax is great as is and does not need anything.

 

[Bender]

Where's the option for just "no". As in Jax is great as is and does not need anything.

Would be "yes" as it is currently -6 on block

 

[omegapr1me99]

Did you even read my post? I said it's not needed, as Jax is already strong.

I 100% agree, half of the cast needs a buff over Jax, but if NRS is looking at every character in the game, I wouldn't mind seeing these additions.

The F2 actually hitting mid "buff" feels like more of a fix than a buff.

If it's not needed then what was the point of making this thread, the character is fine and doesn't need any sort of tweaking.

 

[Bender]

If it's not needed then what was the point of making this thread, the character is fine and doesn't need any sort of tweaking.

It's fine in the sense that Jax is strong enough to win without these changes and a lot of the cast is worse.

The f2 missing mid seems like a bug and I'd like to see it changed.

The -6 cancel on block seems weak compared to a most of the other cancels in the game.

Jax is by no means a broken character and these buffs are minor. I'd like to see them implemented and if NRS makes a lot of changes to the tier list with their next patch, I'd like them to consider these two points.

 

[Bender]

@Error404

The point: do other players think dash bazooka cancel should be -6 on block? I think it should be 0 or -1. Someone else agreed with me, so I am not the only one who thinks that. Clearly you don't and that's totally cool.

I think Jax is one of the best balanced characters in the game, but these are the 2 areas that seem to raise my eyebrow with the character.

Not discounting other characters who are in clear need of a buff/ nerf over Jax. There are many.

 

[omegapr1me99]

It's fine in the sense that Jax is strong enough to win without these changes and a lot of the cast is worse.

The f2 missing mid seems like a bug and I'd like to see it changed.

The -6 cancel on block seems weak compared to a most of the other cancels in the game.

Jax is by no means a broken character and these buffs are minor. I'd like to see them implemented and if NRS makes a lot of changes to the tier list with their next patch, I'd like them to consider these two points.

They shouldn't be considered. I don't think you understand, at this current point in time Jax is a top 10 character. You are asking for a top 10 character to be buffed, that in itself is ridiculous. Be grateful that Jax didn't end up bottom 10 because their are some characters that can really do with some buffs, not Jax.

 

[Zoidberg747]

What you are describing with f21 is low profiling, basically certain characters have moves that lower their hitboxes. I wouldnt really care if they removed low profiling mids as that seems more like a bug and I want bugs fixed.

As far as the LAW cancel goes hell no. He should be - to give characters a chance to interrupt the pressure or else he will have free reign to do whatever the hell he wants. He is already top 10 material as it is, he needs no buffs.

 

[Error404]

@Error404

The point: do other players think dash bazooka cancel should be -6 on block? I think it should be 0 or -1. Someone else agreed with me, so I am not the only one who thinks that. Clearly you don't and that's totally cool.

I think Jax is one of the best balanced characters in the game, but these are the 2 areas that seem to raise my eyebrow with the character.

Not discounting other characters who are in clear need of a buff/ nerf over Jax. There are many.

You can't change the block advantage of just 1 cancel. If you make the LAW cancel happen faster sure f21 will be -1 or 0 , but it will make other strings like b34 +. And if you change the block stun of f21 it will become too good for other variations. Thats why we are not ok with this thread and its requests.

 

[Bender]

What you are describing with f21 is low profiling, basically certain characters have moves that lower their hitboxes. I wouldnt really care if they removed low profiling mids as that seems more like a bug and I want bugs fixed.

As far as the LAW cancel goes hell no. He should be - to give characters a chance to interrupt the pressure or else he will have free reign to do whatever the hell he wants. He is already top 10 material as it is, he needs no buffs.

Fair enough. I think a lot of Jax players will simply pick up wrestler variation once the community realizes they can always poke or combo out against the LAW cancel.

Yeah, the low profiling - that's what I was thinking of! Wouldn't mind it going away either, but I doubt NRS will take it out.

 

[BillStickers]

@Bender with regards to d4~law cancel, you actually should be concerned with the cancel advantage on hit of d4, not the law rocket itself. I don't think hit cancel advantage is available in this game, but historically hit and block cancel advantage for down pokes is pretty similar (in mk9 it was usually +20-25 or so). You should test out which moves can cancel into law rocket safely in practice mode with Mileena AI set to roll reversal. And don't forget that letting the rocket go is always an option.

 

[Bender]

You can't change the block advantage of just 1 cancel. If you make the LAW cancel happen faster sure f21 will be -1 or 0 , but it will make other strings like b34 +. And if you change the block stun of f21 it will become too good for other variations. Thats why we are not ok with this thread and its requests.

Fair enough. I said initially I wasn't sure if this would b a possible change without making Jax broken. That's why I posted it in the first place.

 

[Bender]

@Bender with regards to d4~law cancel, you actually should be concerned with the cancel advantage on hit of d4, not the law rocket itself. I don't think hit cancel advantage is available in this game, but historically hit and block cancel advantage for down pokes is pretty similar (in mk9 it was usually +20-25 or so). You should test out which moves can cancel into law rocket safely in practice mode with Mileena AI set to roll reversal. And don't forget that letting the rocket go is always an option.

I need to test more, but I wasn't talking about the d4 to law cancel. I'm simply doing d 4 and on hit confirm I am doing f21. Constantly am getting low profiled by uppercuts and ball roll. Perhaps the hit advantage isn't enough to get this string off, but uppercuts have become the bane of my Jax playing existence.

 

[BillStickers]

I need to test more, but I wasn't talking about the d4 to law cancel. I'm simply doing d 4 and on hit confirm I am doing f21. Constantly am getting low profiled by uppercuts and ball roll.

Oh, I see! In that case, if I were to read that, I would either keep doing d4s until they learn to respect negative frames or open them up with armored overhead dash punch.