General/Other - Kotal Kahn Kotal Kahn General Discussion

[Mr Aquaman]

i didn't even realize i could 114 MB sun disc and get guaranteed follow ups

this is sexy as fuck, sun god pressure is real

edit: is there any reason to use his earth-shaker move in War God? It's unblockable, but the EX version doesn't OTG, does it? does canceling it give you any advantage on block compared to 114 xx air grab or saw blade?

the cancel is OP in the corner, and at full screen to bait jumps. f3, 4 in the corner into cancel, on hit you can get a d1 aitr takedown, on block you can let her rip(which can only be jumped or armored) or cancel and if they jump antiair, if they block its hard to punish by most of the cast

and yes, when I play blood god I use 114 ex sun disc as a way to continue pressure, and it hurts of they press a button

 

[TheIrishFGCguy]

So I'm looking to pick up Kotal as a secondary character because from my limited experience he seems like a ton of fun. My question is, what are the strengths and weaknesses of each variation? Best variation? Worst variation? The only one I'm slightly familiar with is Sun God. I know it offers a command grab which opens up the potential for some annoying tic throw set ups but that's as far as my knowledge extends. I have no idea what the other two variations do well and I thought I'd ask here before I go and really get stuck in at the lab.

I'd also like to point out that the main reason I'm here is because I saw Mr Aquanman play at Paradise Found and instantly thought to myself "I need to play this character" lol

 

[RYX]

So I'm looking to pick up Kotal as a secondary character because from my limited experience he seems like a ton of fun. My question is, what are the strengths and weaknesses of each variation? Best variation? Worst variation? The only one I'm slightly familiar with is Sun God. I know it offers a command grab which opens up the potential for some annoying tic throw set ups but that's as far as my knowledge extends. I have no idea what the other two variations do well and I thought I'd ask here before I go and really get stuck in at the lab.

I'd also like to point out that the main reason I'm here is because I saw Mr Aquanman play at Paradise Found and instantly thought to myself "I need to play this character" lol

War God gives you his best footsie/mix-up options along with good pressure and your damage is weak compared to the other 2's potential

Sun God, my personal favorite, gives you really good damage and tick throws. You can get strong consistent damage but you trade the mix-ups for the tick throws. IMO this one is slept on hard right now

Blood God is only as good as his strings are, so I wouldn't say it's very strong. You're forced to play as a bait and punish character but you don't really have much that they need to respect otherwise. Feels a bit rushed, to be honest.

 

[sPaB RoG]

I've been playing alot of Blood God because War God can get stiff at times (it gets the job done though). And I think blood god is dope as shit once you get your confirms down and when your neutrals good. It really gets your neutral way stronger.

 

[TheRealOnlyGoonie]

Blood God is shit against someone that knows how to block

 

[sPaB RoG]

Blood God is shit against someone that knows how to block

I used to think the same thing, but he hits too hard, if he was hard to block then it would be different. Just gotta go for the safe stuff and practice your hit confirm eye.

 

[KeyserSoze]

The more I play with Sun God the more apparent its potential viability becomes. The only problem is the lack of a good knockdown other than db4. The tick grab setups provide a very scary mindgame playstyle. Just because of that command grab, it opens a lot of opportunities for me to open them up. Is there anyone who actually cashes out for meter or health? I feel that the fully charged grab does have some uses to it, as you don't have to worry about switching sides after each grab.

Totally agree with the bold. Yes, I absolutely cash out for health (I rarely do it for meter - I personally think Kotal's supposed "meter-building problem" is grossly exaggerated), particularly in cases in which I already have a sizable life lead.

 

[Crayraven]

Totally agree with the bold. Yes, I absolutely cash out for health (I rarely do it for meter - I personally think Kotal's supposed "meter-building problem" is grossly exaggerated), particularly in cases in which I already have a sizable life lead.

I have a different perspective. Aside from the war god variation both sun and blood god have a difficult time building meter. I believe this is why they gave sun and blood god alternative ways to build meter: soul scorch and blood totem. The problem with blood god is blood totem is broke and its very difficult to use (vanishes if you get hit).

 

[RYX]

Kotal is super good in the neutral IMO. He has so much range on his normals and I think he has one of the fastest runs

 

[TheIrishFGCguy]

War God gives you his best footsie/mix-up options along with good pressure and your damage is weak compared to the other 2's potential

Sun God, my personal favorite, gives you really good damage and tick throws. You can get strong consistent damage but you trade the mix-ups for the tick throws. IMO this one is slept on hard right now

Blood God is only as good as his strings are, so I wouldn't say it's very strong. You're forced to play as a bait and punish character but you don't really have much that they need to respect otherwise. Feels a bit rushed, to be honest.

Thanks for the rundown! I've been in the lab for a few hours with War and Sun. Why do you think War God has weak damage compared to Sun? Excluding jump ins, the max I could get for war god (1 bar) was 39%, whereas the max for sun god was only 2% more at 41. Meterless damage was a little better thanks to the level 3 sun choke ending combos but nothing major. Damage seemed to be pretty equal for both variations. Am I missing something?

I think I like War God more. I'm not much of a grappler anyway and having some decent mix-ups appeals to me. Absolutely loving this guys strings and normals though. Most normals are like a 6-7 frame start up, and although full combo punishable F2 and F1B2 are great whiff punishing tools thanks to the great reach. I still have to try blood god and who knows I might end up liking that the most, but I'm not optimistic judging by the opinions of most people here on that variation. lol

 

[RYX]

Thanks for the rundown! I've been in the lab for a few hours with War and Sun. Why do you think War God has weak damage compared to Sun? Excluding jump ins, the max I could get for war god (1 bar) was 39%, whereas the max for sun god was only 2% more at 41. Meterless damage was a little better thanks to the level 3 sun choke ending combos but nothing major. Damage seemed to be pretty equal for both variations. Am I missing something?

I think I like War God more. I'm not much of a grappler anyway and having some decent mix-ups appeals to me. Absolutely loving this guys strings and normals though. Most normals are like a 6-7 frame start up, and although full combo punishable F2 and F1B2 are great whiff punishing tools thanks to the great reach. I still have to try blood god and who knows I might end up liking that the most, but I'm not optimistic judging by the opinions of most people here on that variation. lol

With good parry/blood offering, Sun God can go into the 50's and high 40% with no meter or one bar, where War God's damage will usually cap out much lower

I think with a parry into an f.2 starter Sun God will go up to 45%. War God doesn't have parry and IMO his defensive game sorta suffers for it, but War God is definitely strong as fuck with his good meterbuilding and pressure

 

[Hassun]

Totally agree with the bold. Yes, I absolutely cash out for health (I rarely do it for meter - I personally think Kotal's supposed "meter-building problem" is grossly exaggerated), particularly in cases in which I already have a sizable life lead.

I'd love some tips on building metre with Sun God Kotal. It's a massive problem for me.

 

[regulas]

Man Jason feels like a buffed version of Kotal Kahn....

 

[TheIrishFGCguy]

Man Jason feels like a buffed version of Kotal Kahn....

Yeah, his projectile in slasher was doing around the same damage as the sun tablets and the war god sword thing, only it looked much faster...

 

[RYX]

I'd love some tips on building metre with Sun God Kotal. It's a massive problem for me.

114 xx Air grab builds a fairly decent amount of meter on block; most things canceled into it does actually

Canceling into EX sun disc will give you a free block string into another canceled move and you'll get a good chunk back

Man Jason feels like a buffed version of Kotal Kahn....

let's not rush to conclusions

 

[regulas]

let's not rush to conclusions

So far the parts I find most silly are that he gets things like what looks like the first GOOD healing ability in any netherealm game, he has command grabs in all forms, and he gets super armor (compared to our useless dmg debuff)..

I do think he is superbly well done but it just brings up even more questions as to why so many of Kotals special abilities seem to be so poor and nerfed in feel. Like we can make it work but that's us working at a handicap.

 

[RYX]

So far the parts I find most silly are that he gets things like what looks like the first GOOD healing ability in any netherealm game, he has command grabs in all forms, and he gets super armor (compared to our useless dmg debuff)..

I do think he is superbly well done but it just brings up even more questions as to why so many of Kotals special abilities seem to be so poor and nerfed in feel. Like we can make it work but that's us working at a handicap.

His grabs are blockable outside of the one variation that's centered around them

with Jason's heal in this game I better get a better Sun Ray though, like damn that doesn't feel fair

 

[regulas]

His grabs are blockable outside of the one variation that's centered around them

with Jason's heal in this game I better get a better Sun Ray though, like damn that doesn't feel fair

I'm a broken record but that God Ray should loose it's entire recovery ((so18 frames total) and otherwise stay the same and it'd be perfectly good without being at all broken.

 

[Hassun]

Jason does seem to be similar to Kotal. I think his EX machete throw might even have the exact same animation as EX sword, down to seemingly grabbing it from his back.

 

[SepticFir8]

I don't think Kotal Kahn is viable in any variation except for War God. I used his Blood and Sun God variations a lot, and actually gave up on Kotal as a result. Against Grandmaster Sub, or any semi-decent zoner, it felt useless.

Kotal's War God variation makes a world of difference. Being able to counter Ice Clones, end any string with a low or overhead, as well as combo off of the b1, 4 string makes him a very viable character against pretty much any match up.

 

[regulas]

I don't think Kotal Kahn is viable in any variation except for War God. I used his Blood and Sun God variations a lot, and actually gave up on Kotal as a result. Against Grandmaster Sub, or any semi-decent zoner, it felt useless.

Kotal's War God variation makes a world of difference. Being able to counter Ice Clones, end any string with a low or overhead, as well as combo off of the b1, 4 string makes him a very viable character against pretty much any match up.

This is the general sentiment for now. Most pro Kotal players all use War as well with decent results. One victory and a few top 8 placements that I've seen so far.

 

[Pnut]

Don't be deceived. War god kotal still gets bodied by Grandmaster Sub.

 

[sPaB RoG]

War God is probably the best variation for Grandmaster Sub, but don't get discouraged if you play against Subzeros online. The delay makes it alot harder than it should be. Still a pretty hard match, but manageable.

 

[kenzokukien]

So while watching Streams of Jason, can't help but see that is how KK was supposed to be.

 

[regulas]

So while watching Streams of Jason, can't help but see that is how KK was supposed to be.

Yup it's pretty readily apprent that he has a similar base playstyle, just with better versions of the same abilities, and some fun unique specials.