Match-Up Discussion - Kitana Kitana MU Chart Created by xKhaoTikx & SonicFox

[ismael4790]

Probably because of Possessed. IMO Mournful is actually the worst against Possessed, because her zoning become irrelevent in this matchup. she loses all the trade and the glaive startup is so slow that Kenshi can teleport on reaction all day, if he doesn't get a full combo he gets some chip or a throw

Things like these show why mu charts should consider variations separately

 

[Parasurama]

You can throw like 4-5 fireballs at Kitana and she's in your face, her walk and run speed are the best in the game and his fireballs aren't that hard to get through. At close range she destroys every FF's gimmicks. Using FF's FBF4 (windmill punch) is asking for a full combo punish by Kitana. Without it FF is like no variation Liu Kang. She definitely wins FF. And remember ex rising fan is available for 3 variations

FF has answers after the windmill punches gap, what really gets to me is the 'float' move on jump ins.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

I don't really see why you guys would average it. A new player could see this and go "yippe I go even with predator" or "I beat Sub-Zero". Like the predator player wouldn't pick something that isn't HQT, ya know? And Sub-Zero isn't gonna come at you with Unbreakable, it's gonna be Grandmaster 10 times out of 10. It is awesome that you're putting all variations into account, but could you put them as separate scores so someone new to the game doesn't get the wrong idea?
Edit: I'm not actually disagreeing with the numbers, I'm just curious to learn about how some characters ended up how they are.

 

[xKhaoTik]

This makes the Shaolin - Kitana MU seem good for Kitana when its not. Ancestral and Bojutsu struggle tho. This is confusing.

Shaolin beats Assassin. RS and Mournful do fine against him

 

[xKhaoTik]

I don't see why Kitana loses to Kenshi... Moreover, I think Mournful has quite an advantage vs him.

Possessed beats mournful, Kenjustu beats all 3 and she only has a clear advantage against Balanced

 

[Lokheit]

We both agreed she beat cryomancer. I don't know shit about unbreakable lol, but Sonic does. He feels like she beats that variation. So that's 2 variations she wins against.

When it comes to GM, that's when it gets tough. Everyone knows GM is one of the toughest MUs for her, but not overwhelming enough to call it a 3-7. She can still compete, she just has to be on point.

So because she wins against 2/3 variations, we gave her the slight advantage.

As a Cryo main, Kitana is one of the easiest matchups for me, I'd say at best it's a tie and probably advantage Cryo. Just my 2 cents there. Cryo has a lot of counterpicks but I don't think Kitana is one of them.

 

[xKhaoTik]

As a Cryo main, Kitana is one of the easiest matchups for me, I'd say at best it's a tie and probably advantage Cryo. Just my 2 cents there. Cryo has a lot of counterpicks but I don't think Kitana is one of them.

You'd rather use Cryomancer over GM against her?

 

[Lokheit]

You'd rather use Cryomancer over GM against her?

The thing about Cryo is that most of his winning match ups are even better with GM while GM covers many of his losing ones. GM is superior in this one but IMO Cryo is still good here, only not as much as GM.

 

[ragnar0kz28]

Kitana DEFINITELY beats cyrax 7/3 at least 6/4 that matchup is hell on earth and very uphill for cyrax

 

[xKhaoTik]

Kitana DEFINITELY beats cyrax 7/3 at least 6/4 that matchup is hell on earth and very uphill for cyrax

I keep seeing alot of people saying she wins that. Care to explain? Like I said, that was sonic's choice to put that. Idk it at all. Never really played one

 

[ragnar0kz28]

I keep seeing alot of people saying she wins that. Care to explain? Like I said, that was sonic's choice to put that. Idk it at all. Never really played one

I have played a lot of cyraxes before and after the last patch, she wins the zoning battle and she has better normals, cyrax has no good mids to contest with her, he cant put out anything on the screen without eating fans, now after the patch he lost hes unblockables, he still cant compete with most zoners, Kitana can safely build meter all day long, teleport gets full combo punished with 111fan combo, I agree on sektor beating Kitana he has amazing tools to deal with her, and I wanted to ask why Reptile looses to her? I see it as an even match, I would like to know why? care to explain

 

[BunLantern]

Goro even if averaging all variations should still be 5-5 honestly. She outzones him, but gets outfootsied and dies hard in the corner to him. Run speed and other major buffs definitely equalized it even more so than it has always been. It's actually one of the most balanced match ups in the game in my opinion. I can write an in depth breakdown if interested.


Well Kitana is almost always going to have the meter advantage due to the sheer amount of fans she'll be throwing in this match up. I don't know about a matchup number but there's definitely more chances for Goro to make mistakes than Kitana in this matchup.

 

[Alright RyRy]

I am surprised to see the Goro players saying it should be 5-5 throughout all variations, with Goro vs Kitana.

I agree with all of the points made how she outzones him and he has a much better up close game, but This is the way I see it.

DF vs RS 4-6
KW vs RS 4-6
TF vs RS 5-5

DF vs MF 4-6
KW vs MF 4-6
TF vs MF 5-5

DF vs AS 4-6
KW vs AS 4-6
TF vs AS 5-5

Not much of a difference I am sure, but Goro has to work harder in the MU than Kitana. A very winnable MU, but not easy by any means.

 

[xKhaoTik]

@Espio @EVB Alright RyRy @BunLantern feel free to explain the MU. That was one of the MU I couldn't really talk about and went with Sonic's judgment.

 

[YoloRoll1stHit]

FF has answers after the windmill punches gap, what really gets to me is the 'float' move on jump ins.

I'll make a video to show the tech Kitana has against FF windmill punch. It's exclusive to Kitana, making windmill punch extremely high risk low reward. FF has to either spend bars on ex windmill punch or avoid using it completely

 

[SneakyTortoise]

Possessed beats mournful, Kenjustu beats all 3 and she only has a clear advantage against Balanced

I agree that Kenjutsu beats all 3. Why does balanced struggle?

 

[Espio]

@Espio @EVB Alright RyRy @BunLantern feel free to explain the MU. That was one of the MU I couldn't really talk about and went with Sonic's judgment.

I'll post tonight when I get home a long explanation. Posting on my phone is terrible, but I have a lot to say.

 

[xKhaoTik]

I agree that Kenjutsu beats all 3. Why does balanced struggle?

Mournful keeps him out pretty fine. It's hard for him to get his stuff going due to the glaives. Ex shadow kick is basically a free way to get in since it goes thru the zoning and he can't punish it. RS wins because it's pretty easy to counter the zoning due to ex lift and ex ass. Ex lift is a huge threat because even if we trade flurry or downslash, we have enough time to wake up with iaf and still continue the combo. A whiffed flurry gets punished by ex lift or any version of iaAss anywhere on the screen. Assassin is the weakest of the three in this MU because she doesn't have the mournful zoning or luxury of punishing the zoning well, but assassin strike is still a decent move against it. Assassin also can still play the MU similar to RS

 

[ismael4790]

Mournful keeps him out pretty fine. It's hard for him to get his stuff going due to the glaives. Ex shadow kick is basically a free way to get in since it goes thru the zoning and he can't punish it. RS wins because it's pretty easy to counter the zoning due to ex lift and ex ass. Ex lift is a huge threat because even if we trade flurry or downslash, we have enough time to wake up with iaf and still continue the combo. A whiffed flurry gets punished by ex lift or any version of iaAss anywhere on the screen. Assassin is the weakest of the three in this MU because she doesn't have the mournful zoning or luxury of punishing the zoning well, but assassin strike is still a decent movies against it. Assassin also can still play the MU similar to RS

I also think Assssin is the worst of the three vs Balanced, specially since reflect became a parry. Before that, Kenshi had to be more aware of Assassin strike while reflecting fans. Now he can parry assassin strike into full combo.

 

[Parasurama]

I'll make a video to show the tech Kitana has against FF windmill punch. It's exclusive to Kitana, making windmill punch extremely high risk low reward. FF has to either spend bars on ex windmill punch or avoid using it completely

I am always open to new knowledge and tech.

 

[Tinkerbell]

I'm kind of surprised at Sonya's numbers. To me, all of Kitana's variations have an insane advantage over at least 2/3 of Sonya's variations (I've seen Scar and some other people do well with Special Forces). And before people start screaming, I'm the first one to admit that I'm still learning so that plays a big factor.

 

[Addhad]

Kitana beats Ermac unless the kitanas playing mourn

 

[champdee]

This is pretty cool, I want to make an in untechable hard knock guide (all moves, normals you cannot tech roll out of.

Anyway pretty accurate mu chart.. All although I play mournful..only,and imposter rapes her, and kung lao vs mournful is prbly 4-6, I like pretty lady but I plan to be a master with mournful till this games over (sub too, fuckit, pit too much time I to him) I always use unbreakable against mileena to btw. Way easier than go against her, parries tele, regular roll.. and aura is so important in this mu

 

[Bruno-NeoSpace]

You can throw like 4-5 fireballs at Kitana and she's in your face, her walk and run speed are the best in the game and his fireballs aren't that hard to get through. At close range she destroys every FF's gimmicks. Using FF's FBF4 (windmill punch) is asking for a full combo punish by Kitana. Without it FF is like no variation Liu Kang. She definitely wins FF. And remember ex rising fan is available for 3 variations

Liu Kang has the best D2 in the game. I can bait her very well using my fireballs to make her jump, then I use my D2. Her walk and run speed are very good, but Kang's walk and run speed are also very good. About his fireballs, it depends, If she is using Assassin, it's not that easy because Assassin does not have the reflect or amazing zoning like Mournful. FF's regular fireballs is very good against jumps.

Against his gimmicks: regular FBF4 into parry: she can't do most of her reversals, but she can do her low attack.
EX FBF4 into parry: she can't do most of her reversals AND she can't do her low attack because EX FBF4 has block stun.
regular FBF4 into Dragon's Roar: she can do everything.
EX FBF4 into Dragon's Roar: she only can do an armor attack.
EX FBF4 into Dragon's Wrath: She can't do anything because I can delay my Dragon's Wrath to punish her EX rising fan.

I can delay every special move in EX FBF4 to trick her, the risks are the same. And I don't even need to use my Windmill punch on block because I can hit confirm my strings - If they block it, I use Dragon's Roar then i'll be -2 (armor trap situation), if they did not block it, I use my Windmill Punch. A good FF player will not use Windmill Punch free on block because he'll know the risks. And about EX rising fan: EX Windmill Punch beats the EX rising fan.

BTW, very good thread, @xKhaoTik

Edit: anyway, Kitana vs Liu Kang is 6-4 for her

 

[Rozalin1780]

Pretty much what you said, and the fact that he has a hard time dealing with her in the air and "she jumps over lasers" lol.

Why jump over lasers?