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Jaded matchup and general discussion thread

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
Let me show you what I'm talking about.
I set the AI to random zoning to show sai is reactable and 100% guarantees a glow.


Kitana's zoning is really easily dealt with by Jade. On top of that, Jades d2 takes away the amplify mind game of the teleport.

I don't really know what you mean about being able to apply constant pressure. Her staggers, pokes, and throw game can be pretty good, but first she needs to get in which isn't as easy when her zoning game can't keep you on your toes.
@Elias6999
@GLoRToR
Set her to do sai and teleport kick immediately
 
Set her to do sai and teleport kick immediately
I could show it when I get off today, but I can tell you right now that still won't work for kitana. Try it yourself. I'm just showing Kitana's zoning and full screen presence doesn't need feel as oppressive as it could be. Once you know this you'll see that the matchup becomes noticably harder for your highborn opponent.

Here you go @GLoRToR
Even though this is universal, you should try and put more time in Jaded she's really good.
 
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Elias6999

Mournful Master
I could show it when I get off today, but I can tell you right now that still won't work for kitana. Try it yourself. I'm just showing Kitana's zoning and full screen presence doesn't need feel as oppressive as it could be. Once you know this you'll see that the matchup becomes noticably harder for your highborn opponent.

Here you go @GLoRToR
Even though this is universal, you should try and put more time in Jaded she's really good.
No good Kitana Zones with sais, that’s irrelevant, full screen her best strategy is to bait glow to teleport on you, and I don’t see how Jade wins this upclose, Kitana has better frames and staggers, and a high damage +20 restand ender. Kitana’s D3 low profiles all of Jade’s wakeups too, so if you're in the corner then you’re dead.
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
I could show it when I get off today, but I can tell you right now that still won't work for kitana. Try it yourself. I'm just showing Kitana's zoning and full screen presence doesn't need feel as oppressive as it could be. Once you know this you'll see that the matchup becomes noticably harder for your highborn opponent.

Here you go @GLoRToR
Even though this is universal, you should try and put more time in Jaded she's really good.
Is that the earliest you can activate teleport kick? Might just be online messing with me, then.
As for Jaded, right now I see no reason to play this variation over Emerald Defender. Air Glaive is just too dominant of a tool to pass up while Vault doesn't do much. +3 on a high for 1 bar is nothing to write home about.
 
No good Kitana Zones with sais, that’s irrelevant, full screen her best strategy is to bait glow to teleport on you, and I don’t see how Jade wins this upclose, Kitana has better frames and staggers, and a high damage +20 restand ender. Kitana’s D3 low profiles all of Jade’s wakeups too, so if you're in the corner then you’re dead.
Fans are crouch reactable. Teleport has to be done on a read, so the Jade player just needs to be patient. Jade could get glow full screen without taking any chip, when patient. Kitana's staggers are good but I don't they're that much better than Jade's, and I don't even think they are as good. But there are more ranges than in your face and full screen. Kitana uses her fans as a midscreen check, but she loses that once glow is activated (as long as Jade is smart it's going to happen) At this point Jade just straight up out ranges her. This really exposes how bad highborn's movement is. Her restand giving her guaranteed pressure is little comfort to a highborn player that can't even get in. As for frames, Jade can stay safe and plus on every string. Kitana gets damage in the corner, but nowhere else is she high damage. Jades wakeup attack game is bad against most characters, but that doesn't mean she bad against them, especially since she can control most other aspects of the match.
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
Fans are crouch reactable. Teleport has to be done on a read, so the Jade player just needs to be patient. Jade could get glow full screen without taking any chip, when patient. Kitana's staggers are good but I don't they're that much better than Jade's, and I don't even think they are as good. But there are more ranges than in your face and full screen. Kitana uses her fans as a midscreen check, but she loses that once glow is activated (as long as Jade is smart it's going to happen) At this point Jade just straight up out ranges her. This really exposes how bad highborn's movement is. Her restand giving her guaranteed pressure is little comfort to a highborn player that can't even get in. As for frames, Jade can stay safe and plus on every string. Kitana gets damage in the corner, but nowhere else is she high damage. Jades wakeup attack game is bad against most characters, but that doesn't mean she bad against them, especially since she can control most other aspects of the match.
idk about Jade's stagger being that great tbh. b3434 is fb'able easily even online, b343 is a free throw mixup for the opponent, and all her cancels are reactable and punishable. She's never truly safe.
Prove me wrong, I want to be wrong.
 
Is that the earliest you can activate teleport kick? Might just be online messing with me, then.
As for Jaded, right now I see no reason to play this variation over Emerald Defender. Air Glaive is just too dominant of a tool to pass up while Vault doesn't do much. +3 on a high for 1 bar is nothing to write home about.
Come on, Jaded is a lot more than that. But you're right air glave is super OD. But other than baraka and maybe skarlet, I feel that jaded does slightly better in most matchups.
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
Come on, Jaded is a lot more than that. But you're right air glave is super OD. But other than baraka and maybe skarlet, I feel that jaded does slightly better in most matchups.
I think you're just the better rushdown player then is all. I couldn't bear to lose air glaive against any of the balanced melee'ers like Jax or Johnny. nvm the Liu matchup, I'd get rekstroyed as Jaded
 
idk about Jade's stagger being that great tbh. b3434 is fb'able easily even online, b343 is a free throw mixup for the opponent, and all her cancels are reactable and punishable. She's never truly safe.
Prove me wrong, I want to be wrong.
Amp blazing nitro kick (I think that's the kick from pole vault) jails from b343 and removed the gap and leaves you plus and in their face or plus, but a safe distance away. The cancel is punishable, but it's really hard to react to with the right conditioning. I've played some crackhead reaction lui kangs and they don't even react to the cancels. But she has other staggers too. The ones off her f343, b1, 212 are all super strong too
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
Amp blazing nitro kick (I think that's the kick from pole vault) jails from b343 and removed the gap and leaves you plus and in their face or plus, but a safe distance away. The cancel is punishable, but it's really hard to react to with the right conditioning. I've played some crackhead reaction lui kangs and they don't even react to the cancels. But she has other staggers too. The ones off her f343, b1, 212 are all super strong too
Educate me.
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
Sure I can sometime later today, we can either play later or I can show u some options with a short video.
If you have the game on PC sure thing. Otherwise I'm sure a complete breakdown of Jaded's staggers, pressure, general game plan and conditioning tactics would be much appreciated in the community. Fairly sure more people would hop in on the discussion too.
 
If you have the game on PC sure thing. Otherwise I'm sure a complete breakdown of Jaded's staggers, pressure, general game plan and conditioning tactics would be much appreciated in the community. Fairly sure more people would hop in on the discussion too.
Jaded's general gameplay is to make your opponent guess between b343xx run cancel/deadly butterfly/regular pole vault/run intro nitro kick. It's a 25/25/25/25, they have to either react to run cancel with throw/a fast normal, react to deadly butterfly for full combo, react to regular pole vault with a poke, fast mid or throw and finally react to run into nitro kick by just blocking (or guessing a throw). You can also stagger empty b3 into another empty b3, throw or b343xx all of the above. Also, if jade ever confirms b343 on hit, she can amp razor rang and then f34xx any of the above again/f21 for maximum damage combo (risky, but doable). If you hit confirm f34, you can AGAIN restart pressure with amp razor rang all over again. Basically, just keep the opponent guessing whether you will go for plus frames, 3-hit-on-block deadly butterfly, safe regular pole vault, throw or empty jabs/b3.


People seem to prefer to punish pole vault with a throw, so duck and d2 for a free KB. Some also like to punish 124 with throw, but those are less common. Close the gap between you and your opponent with run into nitro kick, or just run into polevault once they start trying to duck and d2 your nitro kick - you will have to guess if they will poke or throw after that tho, because they WILL block it everytime from fullscreen. D1/D4 into deadly butterfly/polevault/nitrokick also catches people off-guard.

Those are my two cents
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
Jaded's general gameplay is to make your opponent guess between b343xx run cancel/deadly butterfly/regular pole vault/run intro nitro kick. It's a 25/25/25/25, they have to either react to run cancel with throw/a fast normal, react to deadly butterfly for full combo, react to regular pole vault with a poke, fast mid or throw and finally react to run into nitro kick by just blocking (or guessing a throw). You can also stagger empty b3 into another empty b3, throw or b343xx all of the above. Also, if jade ever confirms b343 on hit, she can amp razor rang and then f34xx any of the above again/f21 for maximum damage combo (risky, but doable). If you hit confirm f34, you can AGAIN restart pressure with amp razor rang all over again. Basically, just keep the opponent guessing whether you will go for plus frames, 3-hit-on-block deadly butterfly, safe regular pole vault, throw or empty jabs/b3.


People seem to prefer to punish pole vault with a throw, so duck and d2 for a free KB. Some also like to punish 124 with throw, but those are less common. Close the gap between you and your opponent with run into nitro kick, or just run into polevault once they start trying to duck and d2 your nitro kick - you will have to guess if they will poke or throw after that tho, because they WILL block it everytime from fullscreen. D1/D4 into deadly butterfly/polevault/nitrokick also catches people off-guard.

Those are my two cents
Or they can just block wait and then blow you up. idk man, seems weak
 
Or they can just block wait and then blow you up. idk man, seems weak
As long as they block, they're eating chip and opening themselves for throws and/or more pressure, though. They have to take risks to regain space and that is where you capitalize. In no way I think Jade has it anywhere as easy as Liu Kang, Erron or Sonya in that pressure game, but she's certainly not to be taken lightly.
 

Parasurama

Dragon
Or they can just block wait and then blow you up. idk man, seems weak
The +3 is really good in corner and they have to respect and you always safe. If they keep getting kicked it means they are trying something.
In the end the main issue is damage not pressure but the restand is good but tbh pole vault should give a better payout especially ex.
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
The +3 is really good in corner and they have to respect and you always safe. If they keep getting kicked it means they are trying something.
In the end the main issue is damage not pressure but the restand is good but tbh pole vault should give a better payout especially ex.
She has a restand?
 

LawAbidingCitizen

Bomb Setups & Ball Rolls(Mileena/Cyrax)
Ducking actually helps vs her nitro kicks. You can easily score a d2 krushing blow if you duck both her run-cancel kick and her (unamplified) nitro kick. Also, b343xx run cancel ×× f34xxwhatever catches people who stand block often.

But yeah, for some reason that Kitana couldnt react in time for the 28f overhead... twice.
ArE you talking about her string into PoleVault run into Kick Amp?
I did some testing and found it jails if done within 2f. Meaning they can't duck the +3 high if done fast enough off basically any string.
Its a tight link but I found I could do it consistently where I couldn't auto duck it in lab.
 
ArE you talking about her string into PoleVault run into Kick Amp?
I did some testing and found it jails if done within 2f. Meaning they can't duck the +3 high if done fast enough off basically any string.
Its a tight link but I found I could do it consistently where I couldn't auto duck it in lab.

No no, I actually meant that, if you are full screen away from them and try to get in with run-kick, they can duck and d2 KB it. In the middle of the blockstrings, no sane person should try to d2 a run-kick because, as you said, it actually jails more often than not. That, and you could just go for deadly butterfly or anything else instead of the run-kick.
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
It jails from an 11f advancing 3 hit string into more pressure on block. Not that you should be looking at the isolated move alone anyways.
Sure. Let's go that way then.
B3 and b343 are bad enough on block that you put yourself in range of a 50/50 throw using that string.
Both are also beaten by downpokes to the point where some characters can d4 your leg as it retracts.
B3434 is one of the easiest things to flawless block in the game.
Since that string leads to no damage and is a way to stay in harm's way, an opponent who understands this will wait for you to either cancel it into the high +3 kick which will get at least downpoked or even d2'd, or in the worst case scenario it will be ducked and full combo punished.

You get literally nothing for using the b3 string: on hit it's okay but on block you're literally countermindgaming yourself where the risk of your own attack outweighs the reward of your own attack.


It's the threat of run cancel/ cancel into +3 kick/ throw/stagger/low starter that keeps the opponent guessing, as I have said numerous times
That's no threat. Liu's F4, Kabal's B1, those are a threat, they lead to damage. Nothing happens if you get hit with anything from b3, you take 15% damage and you'll whack Jade for 40% the next time she does something meterless on block.

Also, Sonicfox
Elon Musk wants to colonise Mars. Doesn't mean you're getting a ticket.


It baffles me how some of the community seems so blatantly biased that Jade is shit
She's not shit.
IN COMPARISON TO THE COMPETITIVE TOP 20 she is unfortunately SIGNIFICANTLY WEAKER.
I don't know about some of the community because I don't need an anecdotal crowd behind me to say this:
Jade is not in a good place right now. She needs help.

when she is ok - could do with some fixes
This is where I need you to stop and with this thought in mind, re-read what I just said about why she's bad.
That's the fixes she needs. To not be bad.

"ok" in a game where Sonya exists in her current form, is bad.
End of story.